An Objective Review of FSMism

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Re: An Objective Review of FSMism

Postby E.Raser on Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:37 am

Antipasta wrote:
-It gives bored people more things to do at work.



Luccichi come la porta di un bordello!! :mrgreen:
come dice Henry Fonda nel film "il mio nome è nessuno "

What do you believe we ought to do/or ought to be/or ought to believe
TO OFFEND
20.000.000 of public employes in Italy
and 200.000.000 of public employes muslim allover the world???????

Lavoratori di tutto il mondo unitevi contro il Flying Spaghetti Monster ( Lenin 2 ) :mrgreen:
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Postby Qwertyuiopasd on Wed Dec 20, 2006 8:01 am

I know you knew what it means duke, but I was just saying how I interpret it, and it seemed that you ahdn't been doing it so well. sorry if I assumed too much, but you guys are coming off as a litle mean, and he asked for things to be civil.

remember, its not what you intend, it's what is perceieved bythe other party/parties.

just try and tone it down. even if he's no t the nicest or most civil person dosen't mean we can stop doing so as well.

that's my schpiel, I'm done untill antipasta actually posts back. this is getting redundant

~Qwerty
daftbeaker wrote:But if I stop bugging you I'll have to go back to arguing with Qwerty about whether beauty is truth and precisely what we both mean by 'purple' :moon:


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Postby Pastafarian Pirate on Wed Dec 20, 2006 12:17 pm

Qwertyuiopasd wrote:I know you knew what it means duke, but I was just saying how I interpret it, and it seemed that you ahdn't been doing it so well. sorry if I assumed too much, but you guys are coming off as a litle mean, and he asked for things to be civil.

remember, its not what you intend, it's what is perceieved bythe other party/parties.

just try and tone it down. even if he's no t the nicest or most civil person dosen't mean we can stop doing so as well.

that's my schpiel, I'm done untill antipasta actually posts back. this is getting redundant

~Qwerty

Oh dear... you just appeared to intimate that perception is reality... don't worry, I won't expound upon it. :mrgreen:

Qwerty, again, so that you fully understand my position in this matter.... I harbor no ill will, and I fully intend to be civil here. Can you please explain to me how you see my actions on this thread as being mean? You have the right to see things however you please, but at this time I don't understand how you can see me as being mean.

Thanks for helping to show me your point of view.

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Postby SC-Pastafarian on Wed Dec 20, 2006 5:40 pm

Brother Boyardee wrote:Antipasta,

I don't understand the point of your original post at all. What's the point of listing a religion's "positive contibutions" and "negative side-effects"? A religion is either right or wrong; either the world was created by a flying spaghetti monster (which it was), or it was created by a bearded white man (a common myth), or it was created by neither (a less common myth).

People shouldn't be choosing a religion based on whether it is "positive" or "negative", or whether it makes them feel good or not. They should be choosing a religion based on one criteria only, because it is the one true one - end of story. We don't get to choose who created us. We don't get to choose the truth. What's the point of laying out criticisms and contributions of the truth?

What you are doing is akin to critiquing gravity.

I genuinely don't understand where you are coming from at all.


Of course there are positives and negatives to religions. There can just as easily be rights and wrongs to any religion, and both could very easily be found in the same religion. You don't know what's right and what's wrong and neither does anyone else here.

No, we don't get to choose who/what created us, but we DO get to choose what we believe about it, and listing the positives/negatives to any possible choice is a way to find what YOU believe is the truth.

Antipasta's first post on these boards was angry and mean towards Pastafarianism. After many people told him he clearly didn't understand what we were all about he chose to make a new post where he analyzed FSMism the way he saw it. His post was a response to our calls against a misinformed post.
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Postby Qwertyuiopasd on Wed Dec 20, 2006 5:40 pm

okay, reading back I see you're not really the one with most of the hostility, you just happened to be in my line of fire.... it was mostly Duke and his condescending, cruelly sarcastic posts. I can c/v examples, or you can just go back and carefully read Duke's posts in this thread.

honestly its not something I haven't seen before from Duke, but I don't want Antipasta to think we're all like him.

~Qwerty

(also, I wasn't talking about reality, I was talking about peer mediation. what the person percieves isn't the reality, but it is where the miscommunication starts. yes, your comment might not have malice behind it, but if it could be taken that way, and it is, tempers are likely to rise)
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Postby Duke on Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:20 pm

Qwertyuiopasd wrote:honestly its not something I haven't seen before from Duke, but I don't want Antipasta to think we're all like him.

~Qwerty



Oh, God Forbid! :wink:

I agree, "cruelly sarcastic" are words you could use to describe me at times, and that's why I this place so much.

But I won't say anything nasty about you, although I should. :roll: We're friends. :wink:

But let's be fair, my first post in this thread was only a little bit sarcastic. Just a tiny little bit (and that ain't sarcasm). And the other sarcastic comments I've made have been mostly minor. But, giving you the benifit of the doubt, maybe you think I'm being more sarcastic than I think I'm being, but only because I'm worse.

I wonder if/when Antipasta's coming back, I miss him.


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He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.

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Postby Brother Boyardee on Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:39 pm

SC-Pastafarian wrote:No, we don't get to choose who/what created us, but we DO get to choose what we believe about it, and listing the positives/negatives to any possible choice is a way to find what YOU believe is the truth.
I disagree.

What do the positive and negative side effects of a religion have to do with whether it is true or not? Choosing a faith based on emperical "positives" and "negatives" is just silly. The sole basis on which a faith should be judged is whether it is true or not. That is why I am a Pastafarian - because we have evidence (a graph no less) that the Flying Spaghetti Monster exists and all the other faiths have absolutely none, zilch, nil, nadda.

I've never understood people who shop around for a religion like they are buying a coat. Are they looking for the truth or just a place to belong?

This is not a splitting of hairs that I am doing. The implications of this are great. For example...

It just so happens that I like strippers and beer. But if His Noodly Greatness decided to revoke his laid back "I'd really rather you didn'ts", and replace them with commandments that, say, banned strippers and beer. Well then I would have to comply wouldn't I? I wouldn't change religions. Although I would be disappointed, it wouldn't change the fact that His Noodly Greatness exists and is my Creator. So I would do as commanded. I would have no choice. The truth, in the form of a Deity, trumps any internal sense of right and wrong - it must.

So I disagree with you completely SC-Pastafarian.

I hope this is not the seed of a split within Pastafarianism into fundamentalism and moral reletivism. But then again maybe that would be a good thing - perhaps that would mean that Pastafarianism has truly come of age.

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Postby Qwertyuiopasd on Wed Dec 20, 2006 6:43 pm

hey, boyardee. the number of sects there are in a religion times ten is its age in human years.

that makes christianity like, 2,00. think of the alzheimers.


Duke wrote:

Oh, God Forbid! :wink:

I agree, "cruelly sarcastic" are words you could use to describe me at times, and that's why I this place so much.

But I won't say anything nasty about you, although I should. :roll: We're friends. :wink:

But let's be fair, my first post in this thread was only a little bit sarcastic. Just a tiny little bit (and that ain't sarcasm). And the other sarcastic comments I've made have been mostly minor. But, giving you the benifit of the doubt, maybe you think I'm being more sarcastic than I think I'm being, but only because I'm worse.

I wonder if/when Antipasta's coming back, I miss him.


Duke


good for giving the benefit of the doubt, but the point I was making about 'it's not what you intend, its what is perceived by the other party' means that it dosen't matter how sarcastic you think you were, what matters is how sarcastic antipasta and others think you are being. not because that is the reality, but because that is where the miscommunication and hostile disputes begin.


Duke wrote::roll: We're friends. :wink:


PP, this is an excelent example of perception not being reality.

~Qwerty[/i]
daftbeaker wrote:But if I stop bugging you I'll have to go back to arguing with Qwerty about whether beauty is truth and precisely what we both mean by 'purple' :moon:


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Postby Pastafarian Pirate on Wed Dec 20, 2006 9:28 pm

Qwertyuiopasd wrote:okay, reading back I see you're not really the one with most of the hostility, you just happened to be in my line of fire.... it was mostly Duke and his condescending, cruelly sarcastic posts.
I am curious… is this your way of saying your sorry? :roll: I was "not really" not part of "Most of the hostility" here at all... I was 'not really' part of any of the hostility. I can be hostile, but this time I was not even close. :x
Qwertyuiopasd wrote:yes, your comment might not have malice behind it, but if it could be taken that way, and it is, tempers are likely to rise)
My comments "might not" have malice behind them? Might not? How about just plain "don't." Please... do show me how my first two comments on this thread could be taken as having malice behind them.
First I said
I am not trying to convince ID supporters... I came for the punch and pie.
Then I said
I'm still trying to figure out how his initial post is an "objective review."
Please, show me how either of these comments are construed as having malice behind them. At best they are brilliant comedic statements and instightful comments. At worst, they are wildly funny and curious comments. There is no malice to be found anywhere. I am not trying to split hairs, dance with words or evade the issue here... you were just way off base.
Qwertyuiopasd wrote:
Duke wrote::roll: We're friends. :wink:

PP, this is an excelent example of perception not being reality.
~Qwerty[/i]

Lol... sure it is. It is an excellent example of how Duke's perception and reality are different than yours. :fsm_rock:
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Postby Duke on Wed Dec 20, 2006 10:59 pm

Qwertyuiopasd wrote:
good for giving the benefit of the doubt, but the point I was making about 'it's not what you intend, its what is perceived by the other party' means that it dosen't matter how sarcastic you think you were, what matters is how sarcastic antipasta and others think you are being. not because that is the reality, but because that is where the miscommunication and hostile disputes begin.


Oh, I agree completely. What I was saying is that you might feel that I'm being crueler than I feel I'm being. This is not so good. I'll look into it.:wink:

Qwertyuiopasd wrote:
Duke wrote::roll: We're friends. :wink:


PP, this is an excelent example of perception not being reality.

~Qwerty[/i]


Correct. He perceives it to be serious, but in reality, it is sarcasm. :roll:


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--Friedrich Nietzsche


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Postby Pastafarian Pirate on Wed Dec 20, 2006 11:39 pm

Duke wrote:
Qwertyuiopasd wrote:
Duke wrote::roll: We're friends. :wink:

PP, this is an excelent example of perception not being reality.
~Qwerty[/i]

Correct. He perceives it to be serious, but in reality, it is sarcasm. :roll:
Duke
Well... in your reality it was sarcasm... :wink:

Ok... ok... ok....

While this is all lovely and wonderful... I really don't want to be associated with derailing this thread of onto the "Perception Versus Reality" path...

So... with that in mind, and good feelings ringing in the air (and in the hallway), I would like to side with Brother Boyardee in saying that while there are Rights and Wrongs that can be nitpicked out of any religious thrust, is that the way people should go about establishing their system of beliefs?

I just don't see the value of cross-referencing or bar graphing religions and then trying to pick the "best" one, as if such a thing would even exist.

Oh, and now I am gonna get all philosophical and say that Religions are like Wines... sure there are a lot of them, and many claim to be the best... but when it gets down to it, it is the one you like the best that matters... be it a 2 dollar bottle or a 2000 bottle... if you like it, that is all that matters. Your religious beliefs should be the same... pick the one that works for you and makes ya feel good.

(you might want to consider whether it comes with a beer volcano or stripper factory, but that really is up to you - and that goes for wines as well)
:mrgreen:

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Postby Qwertyuiopasd on Thu Dec 21, 2006 7:29 am

Pastafarian Pirate wrote:
Qwertyuiopasd wrote:okay, reading back I see you're not really the one with most of the hostility, you just happened to be in my line of fire.... it was mostly Duke and his condescending, cruelly sarcastic posts.
I am curious… is this your way of saying your sorry? :roll: I was "not really" not part of "Most of the hostility" here at all... I was 'not really' part of any of the hostility. I can be hostile, but this time I was not even close. :x
Qwertyuiopasd wrote:yes, your comment might not have malice behind it, but if it could be taken that way, and it is, tempers are likely to rise)
My comments "might not" have malice behind them? Might not? How about just plain "don't." Please... do show me how my first two comments on this thread could be taken as having malice behind them.
First I said
I am not trying to convince ID supporters... I came for the punch and pie.
Then I said
I'm still trying to figure out how his initial post is an "objective review."
Please, show me how either of these comments are construed as having malice behind them. At best they are brilliant comedic statements and instightful comments. At worst, they are wildly funny and curious comments. There is no malice to be found anywhere. I am not trying to split hairs, dance with words or evade the issue here... you were just way off base.


ack. miscommunication. sorry. 1) the 'might not have had malice' wasn't saying you specifically might have had malice, it was just in general for that kind of thing.

and you're right, I should've used Don't, but it's a more useful than hurtful habit I've found here to say not completely all the way things, if you get what I mean. like using "not really" intead of "don't". it's simmilar to how if I do say it IS, I'll say IMO or as far as I know.

I do apolagize for the miscommunication.

~Qwerty
daftbeaker wrote:But if I stop bugging you I'll have to go back to arguing with Qwerty about whether beauty is truth and precisely what we both mean by 'purple' :moon:


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Postby Pastafarian Pirate on Thu Dec 21, 2006 10:39 am

Qwertyuiopasd wrote:ack. miscommunication. sorry. 1) the 'might not have had malice' wasn't saying you specifically might have had malice, it was just in general for that kind of thing.

and you're right, I should've used Don't, but it's a more useful than hurtful habit I've found here to say not completely all the way things, if you get what I mean. like using "not really" intead of "don't". it's simmilar to how if I do say it IS, I'll say IMO or as far as I know.

I do apolagize for the miscommunication.

~Qwerty


Ehhh... no problem... thanks. All is well. :)

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Postby Duke on Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:16 pm

See, PP, if you'd just stop associating with folks like me, problems like these would just go right away. :wink:

And, to the viewers out there, that was sarcasm. :roll:

But the question remains: Where is our Antipasta friend?


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He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.

--Friedrich Nietzsche


"If it turns out that there is a God, I don't think that he's evil. But the worst that you can say about him is that basically he's an underachiever."

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Postby Pastafarian Pirate on Thu Dec 21, 2006 4:25 pm

Duke wrote:See, PP, if you'd just stop associating with folks like me, problems like these would just go right away. :wink:

And, to the viewers out there, that was sarcasm. :roll:

But the question remains: Where is our Antipasta friend?


Duke


I need to associate with you because it is bad for my reputation to associate with me. :wink:

Not sure where Antipasta went... perhaps he was just doing a drive-by?

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