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What exactly do you think you are going to prove?

Published July 22nd, 2011 by Bobby Henderson

What exactly do you think you are going to prove? it’s just disrespectful to other human beings faiths and beliefs, and im sure u of all people should know u can’t put any sense into say a devout christian. Honestly, what your doing is the equivalant of making a rude, sarcastic joke to a child that doesn’t understand humor. u cant tell a christian thats been raised from birth to believe that there’s a magic man in the clouds that he’s wrong. you’ll just get what uve been getting, hate mail, and death threats. God is the equivalant of santa exept the child is never told he isn’t real until it’s to late. and u think your doing a good thing by making up this pastafarian crap to prove how absurd the idea of god is. what i don’t think u understand is that u cant argue with idiots about this stuff as most christians are dont know a thing about science.(I apoligize to all respectable christian scientists). as an athiest, im disgusted what youre doing. like making fun of christians being killed by somali’s, and u quoting, "apparently they thought there god could give them safe passage"(yes ive read ur website). really, did it ever, or does it ever occur to you that these people are actually human being’s with family’s and feeling’s, and just because they think the world was created  differantly than u, u have to mock them… that’s kind of a dick move. your being no better than they are(religious people) by making fun of and disrespecting other people just ’cause they think differantly than u. oh wait u are religous, u worship a flying spaggetti monster. which means i have the right to ridicule u on how stupid your dumbfuck religion is(oh may the great pasta diety forgive me for my sin) and dont deny that u worship the all mighty pasta king, because your the leader of the church. with the true words of your religion written on a piece of paper. it’s ironic that u, by trying to prove how bad religion is. go about it by u yourself inbodying everything that is wrong with human beliefs. u are everything that is wrong with athiesm. u go around acting all superior and pompus, like u know better than everyone else and tell them why there wrong mockingly. the world would be a better place if u took all your "followers" (butt pirates) got on a pirate ship and ate spaggetti until you all died of overeating.have u ever heard the term live and let live? and i love it how  u post all the hate mail u get on a your page to be ridiculed by your cronies( who by the way need to get of the internet and do something productive)yes we all the the bible huggars are gonna say dumb stuff because they’re uneducated. but that doesn’t mean u have to be immature and make fun of there faults so just lay off. even though this message sounds hostile just know i agree with what your’e trying to do (i think) educating people, i just wholly disagree with how u are going about it.

-David

A short response from Bobby:

It’s not our intention to mock or offend anyone. But I realize people sometimes feel mocked  or offended.

It might be fair to say that we’re disrespectful.  I would agree that most Pastafarians don’t respect the notion that religion should sit on a pedestal.  We don’t think that because an action is explained in the context of religion it is exempt from the scrutiny it otherwise would have been subjected to.  Religion is not a free pass for crazy ideas and crazy actions. 

I would agree that it’s not our place to pass judgment on those who see the world through a lens of religion.  But neither is it our place to ignore when personal belief becomes public action.  We can accept that some choose to teach their kids the earth is 6000 years old and that dinosaurs are a myth.  But if they push for those ideas to be taught in our schools, it’s no longer a question of respecting personal belief.

The idea that rational minded people must be anti-religion is a wrong one, I think.   If we must draw a line to divide ourselves, I’d prefer the line be positioned between reasonable and unreasonable people, rather than religious and non-religious people.  

It’s one thing to see the world through a lens, and another thing to act as if it’s the only lens that can exist.

I believe there is no group more tolerant of other religious and nonreligious groups than Pastafarians, without question.  The death of the Christian sailors by pirates was a sad thing for everyone who heard of it, I’m sure.  My hope is that it doesn’t happen again.  The hard question is:  will criticizing the decision to venture into dangerous areas on the basis of faith help avoid a similar situation in the future?  I don’t know the answer.  But I wonder how many of their friends and family wish they had shaken them and said this is a bad idea, don’t do this.  This is one of the hard questions – this line between respect and concern. 



793 Responses to “What exactly do you think you are going to prove?”

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  1. Gary says:

    This is probably already said by someone, but here’s my 2 cents.
    I think what they’re trying to do is make “people-who-want-to-push-their-religious-beliefs-on-others” think about what they are doing. Those who adhere to the Christian religion in the US think it’s their right to use government or school to push their beliefs. Just imagine if you were of the Christian persuasion living in Iran, and the government was constantly pushing Islam on you. Now you get the idea of what it is like to be a non-Christian in America. Those who are of the Christian persuasion in the US should be a little more sensitive to the feelings and rights of people of other religions.

    • HotEnema says:

      Gary, You are right. The religious right, mainly evangelical fundamentalists protestants, are trying to push a religious agenda on the U. S. Many of them are descendants of the puritans who wanted to push their religious agenda on the Church of England. Not only did they want to purge the Church of England of any Roman Catholic influence since the reformation they also wanted to turn the Church of England into something like a present day fundamentalist church in the U.S. They wanted to run the Curch of England their way regardless of the fact that Most English people were confortable with the way there church was governed.

      Back before the American revelution, the puritans and their churchs ran the country. It has always been said that they came to the American colonies for religious freedom. The truth of the matter is that they wanted religious freedom for themselve but were very intolerant of any other religious sects that didn’t meet their approval. In fact, they actually hung Quackers.

      Although our Constitution upholds a separation of Church and state. Present day fundamentalist have hijacked the republican party. They have given much support to the GOP and they are looking for the GOP in return to pay them back by catering to their religious agenda.

      • TheFewTheProudTheMarinara says:

        Once the Soviet Union and Communism stopped being a threat, the right wing looked around for some other fear to exploit, and the “godlessness” – in my case true – of the liberals became their rallying cry. It’s just so much easier to paint someone with a broad brush to turn people against them. As in “Obama is a Muslim” or “Obama is a Socialist”. And a mindless 30% of the population is convinced anything he does is evil.

        Quackers? Sounds like someone’s pet duck.

        • Keith says:

          You forgot “Obama is not an American.”

        • Alphy says:

          Enema mispelled it. Actually it is Quakers. They were a Christian religious sect. They were refered to as quakers because of the way they worshiped or praised. They quaked or shook with emotion as they prayed, sung, worshiped. They were also known as the society of friend. In Ireland they were well known for their schools and quality education of the young.

          No offense intended Enema. I quite often mispell and make typos myself to but I usually don’t notice it until after I have posted it.

  2. The Reverend Toni Rigatoni says:

    Greetings my fellow Pastafarians. I’m not sure if this has hit the world news or it is purely domestic, but you may find this at the same time, amusing and anger inducing, as do I.
    Four cases were recently heard in the European Court of Human Rights (ECHR) bought by British Christians claiming persecution, that’s right, persecution – not simple straight forward discrimination but full-on persecution because of their beliefs. One was bought by a British Airways stewardess who was required to remove her crucifix because it contravened the airlines dress code regarding the wearing of jewellery, not religious iconography I hasten to add, but jewellery! The second was bought by a nurse for the same reason. She was prohibited from wearing her crucifix because it contravened Health and Safety legislation and almost certainly would have presented an infection control risk also. Again please note, like BA’s rules it was directed at the wearing of jewellery generally and in no way specific to religious displays. I work for the National Health Service and can personally attest to the inclusive values of the service, employing as it does, many thousands of doctors, nurses and other health professionals from all around the globe, and I have never seen any heard of any discrimination against any faith or religion. I can however recognise the NHS’s commitment to the health and safety of its staff and service users; I of course fully support this as would any rational thinking person I’m sure; but we are talking about Christians here! The nurse in question was told that she could wear a cross in the form of a pin on her uniform instead but refused to do so. (Martyrdom?)
    The first case was upheld by the ECHR, correctly so in my opinion, but the ridiculous, laughable fact of the matter is that BA had responded to her original complaint and changed the rules to allow the wearing of a necklace to enable she, and anyone who wished to do so, to wear a cross or a Star of David or any other bloody thing they wanted to, back in – wait for it….. 2005! She has been working under these new rules for seven years yet still the stupid bitch had to take it to the European courts!
    In the second case, the nurse’s appeal was refused by the courts , again correctly I believe, for obvious reasons; the wearing of the necklace would have impaired her work, presented a safety hazard to herself and an infection risk to her patients; sound judgement by Europe (for a change!). Now for the really good bit! The UK Community Secretary, one Eric Pickles, has publicly announced that he will fight the courts to overturn their decision preventing the wearing of RELIGIOUS iconography!! The man must be hard of thinking!
    As for the other two, one was a registrar I believe and the other a sex counsellor; both had refused to deal with gay couples because of their beliefs. Can you believe it? They both refused to do the job they were being paid to do in order to discriminate against gay couples only to claim that they themselves were being persecuted! It beggars belief doesn’t it? You will happy to hear I’m sure, that those two representations were rejected by the courts also.
    This whole episode has caused uproar in the Christian lobby here in the UK and thousands of Christians are wailing and gnashing their collective teeth because of the persecution the poor little loves have to endure from nasty humanists! Once again the Christian card trumps all it seems, and the evidence is mounting that bat-shit crazy Christian fundamentalism isn’t exclusively an American phenomena.
    May the Sauce be with you all,
    The Reverend.

    • TiltedHorizon says:

      In the US the “nones” are on the rise, this group represents those who no longer align themselves with a specific branch of faith. They are starting to recognize the qualities of fundamentalism within their groups, the political agendas, and the contradictions. They are opting to disassociate themselves from the ideology factories. While they likely still believe in a higher power they are no allowing religious leaders to define and quantify their faith. Pews are slowly emptying as a result. IMHO, this reality appears to be polarizing the fundamentalist mindset. I suspect the increasing activity across the pond is a byproduct of the fundamentalist paranoia here in the states. They are being increasingly aggressive in banging their drums, writing opinion pieces, prosthelytizing in schools, using human tragedies to push their agendas, and demonizing any idea or assertion which counters their beliefs. Ironically they are creating the ‘nones’ in the process. While this makes me hopeful that organized faith is on the path to extinction I am fearful of those who remain and the atrocities will they commit in the preservation of blind faith.

      May the Sauce be with you,

      Tilted

      • Atsap Revol says:

        Rev Toni & Tilted, the fundies here in the US are, indeed, going apeshit with all sorts of imagined slights and detractions from their holy principles. Yet women and men openly wear crosses, decorate their homes and yards for Christmas, and home-school their kids if they want to. No restrictions are placed on their methods of worship or prayer in their homes and churches. Our coinage and currency bear the legend “In God We Trust.” Our Pledge of Allegiance was modified by Congress to add the words “Under God” after the words “One Nation…” There are many other freedoms that Evangelicals enjoy in America.

        But they continue to clamor for prayer in schools and teaching creationism or intelligent design in schools. They claim that the intention of our “Founding Fathers” was to create a Christian nation. This of course is bullshit. Our Constitution does not mention God, Jesus, or Christianity. It does spell out that no laws may be made regarding the establishment of religion or that the religion of a candidate may not be a requirement to hold public office.

        We can hope, Tilted, that the trend to a higher percentage of “nones” will eventually lead to a nation that is religiously more like Sweden and some other European nations. I have had fundamentalism shoved in my face for 80 years at public and private gatherings. It’s currently getting worse instead of better. These selfrighteous bastards are so convinced that they practice the only true religion that they can crap on the rest of us at their pleasure, and we are expected to make no sound or be offended.

        Atsap

        • TheFewTheProudTheMarinara says:

          Teaching creationism along with evolution is only their first step. Katherine Webb, the former Miss Alabama who’s getting her 15 minutes of fame for being a football girlfriend, said she didn’t think evolution should be taught in schools. What a boob! OK, two.

    • Alphy says:

      Unfortunately, Christian fundamentalism which took root and flourished in the early American colonies and later grew into the present day fundamentalist religious right movement in America can find that it’s roots stemmed from the early puritan settlers who’s forefathers wreaked havoc in England, Ireland and the British Isles in general. They eventually left and migrated to the American colonies. Unfortunately, that same intolerant and self righteous mentality has migrated back across the pond to dear old England where it began to poison the minds of many English citizens with it’s toxic narrow minded self-righteous garbage.

      So, the country where the puritan movement began and where they viewed themselves as rejected and persecuted, where they wanted freedom for themselves but not others, where they wreaked havoc in Parliament and English society in general, is now being infected with their insidious and insane religious narrow minded poison. How unfortunate for the English people that so many of their citizenry should sub come to the delusion and insanity of fundamentalist Christianity which has been so carefully nurtured and fostered in the cauldrons of the puritanical American evangelical fundamentalist movement. Fundies are now, and have been for decades, exporting their delusion and insanity from the American Buybull belt, not just to less developed third world countries, but back across the sea to dear old England, the land where their puritan forefathers originated. I had always thought that the vast majority of English people were well evolved and progressive thinkers. I am starting to wonder if they are just as gullible and weak minded as Bible belt Americans, the majority of which have roots with the early wasp puritans.

      The poison , like a plague, has migrated back across the sea.

      • The Rev Toni Rigatoni says:

        There may be some truth in what you say Alphy. Until the last decade or so you were right in your assessment of declining religiosity in the UK, and I think that may still be the case; I suspect that the religious fanatics that do remain are aware that they are a dying breed and are all the more vociferous for it. It’s good hear that the US is becoming less religious, at least regarding individuals if not the government. I recently read that the ‘nones, represent around 30% of the population in the US and that is very encouraging. I too, look forward to a world free from religion though I doubt that it will be in my time.

        May the Sauce be with you.

        The Reverend

        • James says:

          I heard about the “Nones on the Bus” touring around the country and agitating for social justice…

  3. SM Wheeler says:

    Dear hate mail David,

    Before going and bashing anything please not that having the spelling and grammar skills of an average adult will get your angry hate filled rant more respect. As I read it I developed the following symptoms due to your errors :

    Headache
    Nausea
    Nose bleeds
    Space cancer
    Space nose bleeds

    I did, however, recover after ingesting a healthy portion of pasta with marinara.

    So again, it’s ok to be an atheist. It’s ok to be angry. It’s ok to be an angry atheist. However, on behalf of myself and other grammar nazis, get educated. You’ll cause less space cancer that way.

    Yours in “There is no god”,

    S. M. Wheeler

    • UhOhSpaghettiO says:

      Dear SM Wheeler,

      Please note the spelling of “note.”

      Yours in “There might be a god, there might not be a god, and anyone who claims to know for sure of either the definitive existence or of the definite non-existence of such a god is kidding his or herself”,

      U. O. Spaghettio

    • ReligiousCyclops says:

      For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

      • Barkingspyder says:

        Religious Cyclops said: “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.” That’s a very nice fable but that’s all it is. Just like the one about the Jewish slaves in Egypt for which there is zero historical evidence. Unless by not perishing you mean there will plenty of spaghetti for everyone, tehn we are back to the fable.

  4. Adolf Hitler says:

    NEIN NEIN NEIN DAS IST SCHEIZE.
    WIR MUSSEN DIR FSM AUFSTRAUSEN!
    Ich möchte die Mitglieder dieses Kultes unter den Duschen in Polen vergast!

    EIN REICH, EIN VOLK, EIN GLAUBE!!!

  5. Iamnotworthy says:

    I am SHOCKED and OFFENDED at the numerous innuendos suggesting that Pastafarianism, may not be the only true religion.

    What is becoming of the world.

  6. Shyly Pompous says:

    That
    hate letter
    gave
    me
    cancer.

  7. anonymous christian says:

    first point- i haven’t read all of the comments, so if one of my questions is answered or points proved wrong in the comments, i apologize now.
    2nd point- I am a Christian.
    like most Christians, i
    Believe in Evolution
    Think science, progress and understanding are good things
    Have no problems with any other religious or non-religious groups
    Like atheists and have many atheist friends. (We often have spirited debates- most of my friends are pastafarians, i am one of only 2 Christians in my class, and the other guy doesn’t want to be a Christian)
    FYI i am not one of those crazy american fundamentalists- im English and sane.
    One of my classmates came in to school wearing a pasta strainer- LOL XD. (unfortuantely he got suspended )
    just want to say, i like all of the argument above, but would like to remind you tom that most christians DO know about science, and agree with itin its entierity- i.e, the big bang, quantum physics, string theory, etc.
    Just a thing to consider
    Thanks. :)

  8. anonymous christian says:

    guys I’ve got a question from you all- its from the atheists at my school
    “Is the following true- Religion has contributed severely negatively to the world, and the whole world is barely surviving with it in. we must remove religion from the world if it is to become full.”

    Me: BULLSHAIZEN!
    atheists at my school: yey, lets kill anonymous christian!
    I’m right, right?

    • anonymous christian says:

      these times are wrong. this was uploaded at 9.30 not 2.30! goddamitt im in ENGLAND!

    • TheFewTheProudTheMarinara says:

      1. I believe that overall, religion has been a negative influence. Ask all the human sacrifices their opinion.
      2. The whole world is not “barely surviving” because of religion. Even if it were that bad off, I’d blame pollution.
      3. Having the world “full” is a good thing?
      4. We here at the FSM take the high road on things like genocide.

    • Keith says:

      Historically, religion has been used as a pretext or a trigger for many wars in history. The Crusades were economic/religious wars, the Thirty Years War started as a religious war and carried on as a war for feuding dynasties and profiteering mercenaries, the Spanish Armada was conceived as an attempt to overthrow a Protestant government : Queen Mary’s execution just added sauce to the meat. The Jewish Revolt started with the Romans electing the Jewish High Priests and with Gaius Julius Caesar Augustus Germanicus claiming god status. The Civil Wars in Britain were the result of King Charles imposing his ideas on the divine right of kings on just about anyone who would listen to him (and others who wouldn’t). Even now in Africa we have people slaughtering each other because of their beliefs. On a smaller note, you have family quarrels about religion, sometime leading to breakups, People being beaten up for being gay because of religious prejudices. People blows themselves up and target abortion clinics, brothels etc. just so that they can rape a bunch o f virgins every night. I would say that religion has contributed to a lot of misery in the world.
      No christian deserves to die, unless (to my way of thinking) he/she was a complete psychotic

      • Keith says:

        I’ve just re-read this and I apologise for the grammatical errors.

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