Bobby,
I’ll pray for you. Really and truely.You are obviously a very intelligent and witty person.
I hope that you have an amazing life and are happy and proud of who you are.
I also hope that one day you might give God another chance.
I don’t know what happened that caused you to turn from Him, or if you never did believe.
But I sincerly hope that you will know Him.
When you die, do you know what will happen?
I’m sorry if this comes across as just another ‘conversion’ speech.
Just please never give up hope in life.
Thanks for reading.
Love, Katie
I’ll pray for you.
Published by Bobby Henderson June 27th, 2009 in Hate Mail (and concerned criticism). 128 Comments
128 Responses to “I’ll pray for you.”
I hope she also has “an amazing life” and is happy and proud of who she is. As long as she’s not gay or expects her prayers to be answered, it might be possible.
Katie, I hope you give reason another chance, that you reject superstition and the supernatural, that you embrase your one life, have lots of fun and leave a legacy of goodness to the living. Please don’t embrase the immoral morality of the bible.
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Why do they always say that ‘hope’ is only something for the believers? Like it is a privilege to have ‘hope’.
I have hope that maybe- just maybe in like say 75-100 years the word ‘religion’ is banned out of the dictionary.
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No. Do you? Really? I know you’ve been TOLD things, but if you think that’s good enough, you have much to learn.
“I’m sorry if this comes across as just another ‘conversion’ speech.”
Whoops …
“Just please never give up hope in life.”
Eh? Who says Bobby or any of us have given up “hope”? Do you think your religion is the only possible source of hope, just because you in believe it (and not in something else). I smell a circular argument here.
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Also, utterly ineffective. It gives no rational reason for change. I need to be convinced by a logical argument if I am going to convert to Christianity.
RAmen.
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Don’t be such an intolerant person, Katie. Only about 1/3 of the world’s population are Christians. Are you saying that the other 2/3 (the majority) are all wrong? And what about all the extraterrestrial lifeforms out there? I’m pretty sure they all have different (if any) religions as well.
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Polite, yet condescending; and still utterly missing the point. Honestly, do none of these people understand the difference between mocking some of God’s followers and hating or rejecting God and/ or any specific faith?
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The effect of my act will be measurable: I will become on bowl of noodles heavier.
The effect of your act is only exhaled CO2 and imagination.
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I’ll pray for you. Really and truly.
You are obviously a very intelligent and witty person (who can spell most words, generally use proper punctuation and write a coherent sentence).
I hope that you have an amazing life and are happy and proud of who you are.
I also hope that one day you might give The Flying Spaghetti Monster another chance.
I don’t know what happened that caused you to turn from Him, or if you never did believe.
But I sincerely hope that you will know Him.
When you die, do you know what will happen?
I’m sorry if this comes across as just another ‘conversion’ speech.
Just please never give up hope in life.
Thanks for reading.
RAmen, BlackBard
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Dear Katie,
You are obviously a patronizing and condescending person. I hope one day you will give Allah another chance. I don’t know if you were so incredibly unlucky that you weren’t raised a Muslim or your life circumstances made you so miserable that you turned away from Allah. Either way, I hope you will get to know him, because without him life is empty and worthless. You know what happens when you die? Just ask the suicide bombers, they had(have) no doubt in their hearts about it. I won’t be praying for you at all, honestly and seriously.
RAmen
PS: How are we supposed not to give up hope if, according to you, hope only comes when you know gawd?
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Its this condescending sugar coated crap that pisses me off the most about so called x-tians.
…when we die, lights out, its over. Just like flipping the light switch on the wall. Best we can all hope for is to go quietly in our sleep.
…and what makes you think anyone who just doesnt happen to believe in fairy tales, wouldnt have “hope in life”? I have hope in everything, and sure as fuck dont need some imaginary friend to make me feel better, or to serve as some morality guidepost. So to sum up my feelings on this one…piss off!
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Dear Katie.
Join the ranks of the long list of people who have completely and utterly missed the point. Thanks for being pleasant about it at any rate.
RAmen
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Came expecting tears/hate/swearing.
Left disappointed.
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Well, Katie,thanks for being so sweet and nice, but you’ll go in the books as another one who just doesn’t get it. Read the “about” page. Understand that your religion is no better than any other, and stop trying to impose your beliefs on the world. Everyone is different, and entitled to their own interpretation of and interaction with the world as they see it, so long as they do no harm to others. Please don’t bother praying for me, it will have no effect on anything.
RAmen
ET
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The arrogance of the religious never ceases to amaze me. Katie, do you know what will happen when you die? If so, how? I know you believe something will happen, but that does not make it so. Beliefs are not facts. Your beliefs about the afterlife hold no more truth then any of the other thousand beliefs about the afterlife. You should really ask yourself one day why is there no more evidence (and no, the bible is not evidence any more than the gospel of the FSM is) for your beliefs then there is for a satire about beer volcanoes and pirates. As far as praying for us, here is a simple comparison cart that shows how much good that will do vs actually getting off your ass and doing something real for the community:
http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/9864/1234325421949.png
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“When you die, do you know what will happen?”
The world will go on without us in it. It really is that simple. You might think that you really are something very special, and to yourself and your family you just might be, but in the grand scheme of things you really are just an insignificant piece of carbon.
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I think I be in love…
Katie, m’lass, why don’t ye give up th’ borin’ cracker-religion. Come join me, an’ we’ll sail th’ high seas, cutlass in one hand, pasta fork in t’other… It were meant t’be, Katie. Y’can’t be livin’ in some made-up fantasy religin’ f’ever…
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Of course we know what happens when we die…beer volcano and stripper factory.
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That was different.
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Katie,
Please tell us what evidence you have that there is anything beyond the grave for a person who dies. Misquotations of old Hebrew literature are not allowed here as evidence. Reference to the Bible requires your demonstration of competence in Hebrew, History, Politics, and a knowledge of Archeology, so we can discuss who, when, and why certain people wrote and compiled the book.
Don’t waste your time praying for any of us; spend it learning the subjects listed above so you can competently discuss philosophy with us.
http://www.sciam.com/podcast/episode.cfm?id=why-people-believe-what-they-do-09-04-10&sc=DD_20090413
Remember that you believe whatever it is that you do believe in strictly because it is what your parents believe in.
RAmen
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So close….. Katie, you’ve almost claimed the distinction of composing one of the first error-free hate-mails.
The only problem, though–apart from your inability to just let people believe what they want–is a misspelled “truely”. To create an adverb, sometimes you have to do more than just add an “-ly”, and in the case of the word “true”, that involves dropping the “e”.
Better luck next time!
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Katie,
Do you know honestly what will happen when you die? Why do you pray? Is it to appease the ego of your “God” or is it because you want something from it? Perhaps, you need to take an honest look at what you believe in.
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I know what will happen when I die. I will make the most lovely fertilizer. Really, it’ll be just fantastic. And somehow, people fail to grasp that praying for people who disregard any “power” in prayer… doesn’t work?
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Yeah, it comes across as another “conversion” speech. Yawn.
We’ll eat some pasta for you, and hope you someday feel the touch of His Noodliness.
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Good, you do that. You pray, and meanwhile, I’ll do something actually productive.
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When i die, i will go to a heaven with strippers and beer!
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You want Bobby to give two chances to one god, but instead he is giving his second chance to a minority god – much fairer.
And when he dies, he will see the beer volcano and the stripper factory.
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Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
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Finally! Actual legitimate grammar!
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“Prayer. How to do nothing and still think you’re helping.”
http://www.scottklarr.com/topic/453/collection-of-atheist-and-atheism-motivational-posters/
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Katie,
When you die, you will experience the exact same thing that you experienced for the billions (or, if you are a Creationist, the thousands) of years that passed before you first experienced consciousness (some years after your birth).
The developed physical human brain is what creates the illusion of a “soul”. Our “souls” are, in fact, only our memories.
When your physical brain stops its normal chemical functioning, your “soul” will go away. This can happen temporarily under anesthesia in the hospital and it will happen for forever when you die.
This is the only life you will ever have. Please enjoy it and be nice to everyone else while you do.
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I don’t think Bobby’s given up hope on life. Have you seen His blog, Katie? He’s having a whole lotta fun.
Other than that at least you were meaning well and being nice. You sound as if you are quite young so hopefully you have time to explore other possibilities in life before placing all your chips on the god thing.
Maybe you’ll still end up taking the god route but it’d be a shame if a nice person like you didn’t at least have the good sense and manners to look at the alternatives seriously before tying your colours to the god myth.
Some of us simply have no choice in our beliefs. We don’t believe in god because the facts back this up. We see no point in pretending to believe in something that doesn’t exist. I don’t mean to be rude to you but I do hope one day you’ll wake up from your trance and embrace life for the unique and wonderful thing it is.
Enjoy life. It’s the only one you’ll get.
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Katie–
Alfredo, marinara, bolognese.
I pray instead you’ll worship these.
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Wow. I think she actually kind of gets the point of the site, even if she can’t circle the wagons back to how it reflects on Christian dogma. She must’ve graduated from Liberty with honors.
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Well Hey Everybody,
And Hi FSM!
As a leader of my own Religion, with around 50 followers in 4 countries, I love the way you have so quickly gained worship!
I say go for your life Christians, write all the hate mail you want, proove him wrong!
But you’re just adding to the hate in the world.
He’s just seeing life through his own life, and his own views, and obviously you guys cannot handle personal choice. So I say go for your life Pastafarians! Make life much more enjoyable!
I have just made FSM my background!
Be sure to keep a lookout for my religion “Krowdism” in the next few years too!
I’m working on it!
Much much bolognaise,
King Krowder
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Well since you are so well spoken, I could maybe… Umm, no.
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Katie, the way I see it, it’s the religious who “give up hope in life” by basing their whole existence on the promise of an AFTERlife. I figure this life is the only one I get, and that’s OK.
Look at it this way, if there IS a creator, what incentive does he have for toying with us on different planes of existence? Why would he want the same characters inhabit both earth and heaven? Oh, yeah! Because he loves us so much! That’s why we have disease, starvation, hurricanes, etc.
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Wow.
That was completely different from every other hate-mail that I’ve ever read on this site. The grammar is good, and the meaning is clear. She accepts us, but will pray that one day we’ll turn to her religion. It’s actually kind of sweet.
Thank you Katie.
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I am glad to see a semblance of politeness for once. Although clueless, condescending and naive as Katie is, she may actually be a light of hope amongst those who state simply, “TWAT”.
R’Amen, and may you all be forever Touched by His Noodly Appendage
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Nice letter. Thanks for being human Katie.
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Regarding #6 Captain Parrot
For a while now I have wondered about the effect of an extra-terrestrial visit/communication.
Putting aside the belief or disbelief of other world creatures, or possibility of a chance for a vist:
If ET did visit, surely they would NOT have a “BIBLE” like Earth’s, nor would they have a “JESUS story” or “muhamed story”, or “vishnu story”, etc.
They would come with their own set of beliefs, or perhaps none.
How would these visitors be received on Earth by our religious personages?
Can you imagine Earth’s religious types trying to convert aliens to Christianity or Islam?
They would just simply laugh at earthling ignorance!
The Pope might even disparage them as “worse than homosexuals”.
Maybe they even have a version of the ten commandments, only it’s the 8 commandments.
Maybe they have belief in the son of the FSM, who came to save their souls…who knows?
Either way, when Earth’s religious find out about the “belief system” of aliens, I guarantee
that all hell will break loose. Aliens don’t believe in Jesus, and do not accept him as their savior, and will all burn in hell.
Earth’s religious will mock the belief’s of aliens as “unprovable”, “ridiculous”, and “absurd”.
They will say the same thing about our beliefs…and VIOLA!.. War of the Worlds!
Chalk up another win for religion!!! No use being religious if you can’t kill someone for it.
Of course, I could be wrong, and aliens all across the universe have realized the indisputable truth of Intelligent Design…. but will they have evidence to support this and disprove evolution? HMMM.
May you avoid stupid religious ceremonies that cut and shorten your spaghetti.
RAmen.
-TooferMan
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Sorry, second post, I couldn’t resist:
Kudos to #10 Blackbard and #11 Insightful Ape. Both very clever.
I would really appreciate a reply post from KATIE on these two, responding to the urgent plea
of giving another god another chance…
Perhaps by your mirrored ‘conversion speech’, KATIE might realize how pointless, fruitless, and worthless her attempt really was. She’s not gonna follow FSM, and we’re not gonna be ’saved’.
And #27 BaronVonPasta, you’re just a horney bastard trying to get laid by any means.
May you all swim in the saucy goodness of peace and pasta forever.
-TooferMan
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Katie,
Thanks for the concern, it’s very pasta of you. I do have a question in return though. When you say ” I sincerely hope that you will know Him.”, I have to wonder, do you mean in the biblical sense? I mean I’ve often hoped to be touched by His noodly appendage, just not quite in that way.
RAmen,
Your pal Al
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well its nice that she was nice about it but to answer some of her questions on a personal level (i cant answer for bobby but i can for myself) i “turned away from him [god]” when i started asking questions. The thing is it does not add up, my favorite example of this comes from the first story of the bible where god creates everything in 7 days including people. This is obviously false because there is hard evidence supporting life before people, millions and billions of years before people. therefor being created in such a short span of time is obviously false. anyway finding answers to questions such as this in contradictory science and not the bible led me down the path i am now. as a response to being “intelligent” and “witty” i’m not saying i’m very smart but i am smart enough to ask questions and not blindly follow what i’m told and if i ask questions its a “sin” and i “burn in hell”. which brings me to the finally answer i would like to give. to the question of “When you die, do you know what will happen?” i do you rot in a hole. the question is do you?
Praise be the Flying Spaghetti Monster, and may his noodly appendage touch you
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To Katie and all the Katies out there,
Have you ever thought that what you are asking Bobby to do is live a lie? Atheists don’t feel what you feel. And you don’t feel what an atheist feels. To ask an atheist to believe in a god is like–like–well, like asking you to give up your god belief. Can’t we allow each other to believe what we want without “guilting” each other? Without passing laws that prevent freedom from religion?
This whole Spaghetti Monster thing is just a mirror held up to show you what you look like to an atheist. If you don’t like how silly it looks, well, then Bobby made his point. This “Spaghetti religion” was created in protest because our society continues to favor the religious. Bobby just thought, well, if you can’t stop ‘em you can show ‘em what they look like.
If other religions were truly good and did not threaten atheists, Bobby would never have needed to create this website. The way to get rid of FSM is to improve your own religions. Make your religions good. That means stop threatening others with “When you die, do you know what will happen?” That’s ugly talk, Katie. If your religion says it’s okay to say that to another person, you don’t have a good religion.
Know what makes you happy and don’t live a lie to please other people.
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Katie:
Thank you for your pleasant email. I don’t think Bobby really wants your prayers, so don’t waste them. There are starving children out there that deserve more attention.
Meisha.
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Respect for Katie for being decent and polite in her letter. Obviously, her prayers will remain unanswered, but at least she has good intentions and doesn’t want to kill Bobby.
Thank you Katie, you make Christians look a tiny bit better. I hope (and we, pastafarians, are full of hope) you all wake up one day and see the truth, give up the nonsense and enjoy some spaghetti instead.
In the meantime, thanks for the effort put in correct grammar and spelling.
RAmen, may you be touched by HNA.
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And I’ll pray for you too.
Hoping that one day you’ll find the FSM greatness in your heart.
May you be touched by his noodly appendage.
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P.S. as for people missing the point: evolution is also something you accept with some amount of faith. get over it and stop forcing on people what you believe. you sound too much like the christians.
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Bravo Katie! Good grammar, polite, not hostile. I applaud you and hope someday He shall touch you with his noodley appendage.
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The people who truly love life don’t spend it worrying about a theoretic afterlife.
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Wait, which god should we give another chance? Are you referring to Zeus or Odin or Allah or Brahma or some other god in particular? Is Buddhism ok even though there’s no “god” per se? Or are any supernatural beliefs like Paganism or Scientology acceptable? Or maybe I’m still giving god a chance as long as I just believe something that claims to explain my existence and death regardless of what it is. Perhaps… a flying spaghetti monster?
Or maybe your just intend for me to accept your Jesus?
- Bagelsauce
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“When you die, do you know what will happen?”
Do you?
And #51:
“this site is domited by hitler-esque supposed rationalists”
Who said so? Im a Pastafarian and I dont, nor ever have supported anything Hitler-related, and 100% of the Pastafarians I know are also like that. Where do you get that idea from? I think you’re the one who’s missing the point of this religion. Perhaps you should read a bit more before posting such thing.
Hope you can get touched by His noodly appendage and transform your life to better by so. That way you can maybe start to live and let live.
RAmen.
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Dear Number 51,
I’m sorry to hear that your elementary school teachers didn’t teach you about grammar or spelling. I hope someday to make as big of an ass of myself as you do. RAmen.
Now, fo’ cereal homes. Where did we start forcing our religion? When did we start going everywhere professing our religion? I inform people I’m a Pastafarian and explain briefly what we believe. If they wish to know more, I proceed (sp.). But I live in the Bible Belt so it’s generally more of a, “THE POWER OF CHRIST COMPELS YOU! THE POWER OF CHRIST COMPELS YOU! THE POWER OF-”-esque response. With holy water and someone reading the bible. Evolution is not accepted with some kind of faith. It’s a scientific fact. Of course we Pastafarians know that His Noodly Appendage has simply been changing the results. I ignored the Hitler-esque comment because it makes me so angry that you would call us god-hating, when we love OUR God very much. Hisssss…
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To the stupid troll at 51: When I read your post I want to believe in FSM even more, even though it would be nicer if everyone (including you) agreed His Noodliness may be real and there is no way to know for sure.
And since you don’t seem to be getting the point, it takes as much faith to believe in gravity. You sound too much like Muslims.
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Hey, #51 (someone not as sure as 99% of you are)
For fun let’s run through your errors in logic.
1) Pastafarians are Hitler-esque.
Can you even try to back that up with one example?
2) Because you don’t agree with Pastafarians it makes you “wanna be a god believer more.”
Well, barring actual evidence of a god, believing in one for spite is more rational than believing for any other reason. I’ll give you that one—if you still want it (makes you look rather shallow).
3) “None of us can be too sure, so let’s make the best of what we do know.”
We can be sure of only one thing: if the Muslim god is the real one, then all the other gods are fake. So all but none or one religion is false. So if you want to opt for religion, what reasoning do you use to select the right one?
4) “We all will die one day and all our bigotry will be for nothing.”
Actually, no. Unfortunately bigotry lives on. Religions are one of the main ways that bigotry gets passed down.
5) Evolution is faith-based.
Not true. There is as much evidence for the theory of evolution as for the theory of gravity. Do you leave the house in the morning wearing a tether because you don’t have faith in gravity?
6) Pastafarians are forcing their beliefs on others.
What evidence do you have for this? What laws are passed that discriminate against non-Pastafarians? Does your money say “In noodles we trust”?
7) We sound too much like Christians.
Gosh, that’s the point. Too bad you also missed it.
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Whoa Numpty #51 – Who is forcing anything on this site? We are simply having a laugh at creationists.
As has been mentioned may times before – There is NO evidence of any deity! I do not believe in anything that has no proof. Why don’t you just be mature enough to realise that anything without a shred of truth attached is unworthy of belief. The facts you stated toward the end would well apply to you also; you are being bigoted.
Finally, evolution has loads of EVIDENCE (and in fact humans can fast-track evolution easily – see pigeons, peas and dogs to name but a few). Evolution is not forced on people. Evolution is taught as a science should be: facts, facts and more facts. If you choose to believe things despite lack of evidence then that’s your right – but you are sure to be wrong.
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“someone not as sure as 99% of you are” – Congratulations on executing Godwin’s law after only 50 thread posts. Also, evolution has something your religion will never have: evidence. No faith required.
RAmen.
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@51 states we should get over ourselves because “none of us can ever really be too sure so let’s all just try to make the best of what we do know”.
Well, that is exactly what 99% of us here are trying to do. Science has demonstrated a good many facts that have nothing at all to do with supernatural agents or forces, and has provided tons of facts beyond a reasonable doubt that points to the process of evolution. It has shown absolutely NO evidence that points to a “creator” of the universe known as jeezus or yahweh, or that the universe was made for human beings alone. We are all humble enought to admit that humans do not have all the answers to the secrets of the universe (and may never), and that we are not ignorant enough to simply cave in by putting our “faith” into the belief of some invisible sky-daddy with anger-management issues.
So you can be turned off all you like. It makes no difference to me, as I am just as turned off about yours (and others) blind faith in superstitious beliefs. If you don’t like it and are turned off by it, then don’t come trolling onto our website blathering your nonsense. You can simply go back to the land of delusion, and we’ll continue to hang over here in the land of common sense. Bagelsauce in post #54 brought the point home rather nicely.
So, to sum it all up for you: absolutely NO stippers or beer factory in your future!
RAmen!
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His high,holy noodleness reaches out to touch us everyday. We are the ones that do not reach for his appendage. We feel the warmth of his dripping sauce as its goodness drips into our lives. Prayers are not needed. Unlike the christian faith his high carbiness is ever in contact with us boiling our souls into his tender firmness. Prayers are not needed for the believers, it is us that wish you the sauce. May the noodles of happiness dangle at your mouth and may is balls tickle your nose. RAmen
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While outwardly polite, your post is really egocentric and condescending. People are exposed to the gods that their parents choose to expose them to. I was brought up in a secular household. So I experienced no indoctrination in matters of the “soul”. This means that I had no god to turn from and have given him plenty of chances and tests (he has a 100% failure rate).
Now I will not speak for the Prophet Bobby. His upbringing is as unknown to me as Jeebus’s. I do not know where they went to high school. I do not know what sports they played. Few details on their childhoods are known. I know their vocations that they did not continue in (physicist and carpenter respectively). Therefore I will not postulate on what supernatural forces and entities that the prophet may or may not have rejected.
I know that the FSM showed himself to the prophet and he has shown the non-believers and heathens the Truth. When I die I will enjoy many an India Pale Ale with the chosen. We will enjoy the fellowship of the Pastafarian community and the company of strippers.
The DreddPyrateRoberts has posted! Yarrrrrrgh! and a hearty rAmen!
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Katie, I can’t give a chance to something that does not exist, nor did I turn from something that does not exist. I merely realized, based on evidence, or lack of, the way things really are. You seem to think that people can choose what they believe. The brain does not work that way. We base our beliefs, or lack of them, on what we experience, what we see, or what we are shown there is evidence for. There is no credible evidence for the existence of any god. (Sorry pastafarians, there is evidence for spaghetti…I had some for lunch). Katie, you say that you hope we know him. I think is better to hope that people lead a fulfilled life, don’t hurt anyone unnecessarily, and try to leave the world a better place than when you arrived.
Commenter #51, before you call someone hitler-esque, remember that Hitler was christian. Also, we are not god-haters, because you cannot hate something that does not exist, as I have alluded to above. I do agree with you about making the best of what we do know; that is the way most atheists that I know think.
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Hey, someone (#51). How can you “hate” someone or something you don’t think exists?
Perhaps some of us hate being hounded (atheists don’t come to my door with their pamphlets)
with ludicrous requests to believe not just what can’t be proven, but is being DISproven more every day.
You say that evolution requires a measure of faith. Dictionary.com defines faith as
1. confidence or trust in a person or thing: faith in another’s ability.
2. belief that is not based on proof.
I’d say your statement fails on both parts. Who are we confident of? 99.9% of all scientists?
That’s too overwhelming to be called faith. Belief NOT based on proof? There are dozens of
indications from multiple sciences all pointing to one hypothesis. Evolution has been OBSERVED.
Of course, on the other side of the argument we have a book (there are many versions, and they
all contain contradictions, mistranslations and ancient, orally recorded stories of dubious accuracy that are open to interpretation. Believing in THAT is faith; confidence that your priest/pastor/shaman knows what the hell he’s talking about in the absence of ANY proof.
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This just makes me sick. People trying to mean well, by foisting their mythology on others and condescending to “pray for them…” It’s not cool. It may be well intended, but remember WWII german soldiers thought they were making a better world.
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ok you have the right to spend time trashing a religon when you worship a god for whom you have no proof exists either.YARRRRRRRRRR!!!!!
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Why don’t the hate mailers ever respond???
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Katie, as much as I adore your blatant patronization and thinly-veiled bigotry, I feel the need correct a few things. For one, I turned away from your god to the same extent that I turned away from Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, and the Easter Bunny. My parents said nothing to me about religion for the first seven or eight years of my life, allowing me to form my own convictions. It may shock you to discover that I never even considered any of the three major monotheistic as plausible options: just sources of vague, mordant amusement.
And another thing: have you any idea how supremely ignorant it is to assume that atheists are simply embittered cynics who hate life? We are no less content as a group than you are. More so, I would say, since we don’t need an (in all probability,) imaginary sadomasochist who lives in the sky to tell us the meaning of our lives.
Oh, and number fifty-one, please feel free to shut up. No one has any patience for sheer stupidity here. By the way, we do not hate your god any more than we hate invisible unicorns. They are innocuous in that there is no plausible probability of their existence. As for the incredibly outdated phenomenon of “faith,” it does not apply to something like evolution, which actually makes sense and is backed up by something more than desperate insecurity and fear.
Thank you for your ever-so-gracious attempt at tolerance, but I really don’t think we need that kind of charity. May He reach down with His Noodly Appendage and show you The Way as he
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I have nothing against the central dogma of christianity, but how is the Abrahamic God, one whom we can not experience with any of our senses, any more believable than a delicious monster made of my last night’s dinner? faith is defined as belief without proof. There is nothing that proves that the Abrahamic God created the universe. one can argue that the universe if proof enough, but there are so many alternative explanations; explanations that can be PROVED scientifically for instance. with that said, as a strong proponent of the first ammendment, youre just as entitled to your beliefs as pastafarians are to theirs. however, i believe that instead of discrediting other religions, we should learn as much as we can to make us better people from our own. theres no point in proseltysing; religious conflicts, as theyre are a result of almost every war, are not worth waging.
hope to have enlightened you.
RAmen.
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Katie,
write a haiku, you must!
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@someone not as sure as 99% of you are (#51)
cc:Susan (#58)
I agree with you (don’t crucify me)
Since you never came back to defend your rude and offensive (things are rude and offensive if you put the word “Hitler” in them, that IS a crime in most countries) I will try to back up for you. I’ll use Susan’s 7 steps to reply on.
1) Pastafarians are Hitler-esque.
#51 never said that Pastafarians are Hitler-esque, just that most of the replies on this site seem to carry a tone that could be compared to (cq. isn’t equal, but alike) the way nazi’s used to follow orders just because Hitler said so. I agree on that, most people here do not want to accept that there might be some other way of looking at the world. Just because you believe you’re right, doesn’t mean other people shouldn’t be allowed to believe whatever they want. The original point of the FSM was to ban religion from the American educational system (which I totally agree on) not to ban religion.
Susan asked for an example. Hitler told us everything that went wrong was because of the Jews, so, people started killing Jews. Simple. Someone on this side blames war (as a concept) on religion (which I think is quite true) so everyone starts ranting on those poor few Christians who dare to come to this site and leave a comment. Simple. I know trolling cannot easily be compared to killing Jews. I know I shouldn’t compare those. I do, anyway, because it’s the same lack of thought or social skills that’s behind it.
2) Because you don’t agree with Pastafarians it makes you “wanna be a god believer more.”
Actually, that one IS kind of shallow. If I’m ever voted Pope again I will explain that to you, #51.
3) “None of us can be too sure, so let’s make the best of what we do know.”
I don’t think many believers use reasoning to choose a believe. That would be kind of exactly the opposite of what believing is all about. You choose whatever you feel most comfortable in, “by heart”, if you wish. Believing is not a process that is accomplished by thinking about it, it’s brought to you by Emotions Inc.© Such emotions can be love, happiness, or in case of #51: fear (of the unknown). I hope none of the visitors of this site will deny the often useful existence of emotions. Since quite a lot of people are used to be guided by them, they won’t deny them when they tell them to believe in some bearded deity on a cloud. I wouldn’t.
4) “We all will die one day and all our bigotry will be for nothing.”
I would even daresay our bigotry is already for nothing. As is everyone’s.
And as a Pastafarian, #58, you truely are a little bit too fanatic. Wasn’t there a “I rather you didn’t” about spreading your (non-)believe? You seem to try to convince people to look at things your way. Why would you? Just because they’re trying to convince you to believe in something you don’t believe in? Isn’t that a bit like your 2nd statement? Shallow?
5) Evolution is faith-based.
Evolutionism (or Darwinism) is faith-based. Evolution is a theory, but still most of the (not-at-all-Hitleresque) people on this side seem to cling to it like a solid fact, in a way that reminds me of Catholics. Gravity is not a theory, it’s a fact. The explanation of gravity is a theory.
In pretty much the same way: the existence of mankind is a fact, the explanation of it (creationism, evolution, whatever) is, and probably always will be, a solid uncertainty.
6) Pastafarians are forcing their beliefs on others.
The only evidence you need is one non-Pastafarian that feels that some pirate is putting noodles upon his nostrils, trying to replace what was left of his brain. I don’t feel forced to believe in His Noodlity, but I can imagine Christians (among others) feel that they should question their own believes. That’s not a happy feeling, especially not if you can’t seem to avoid it.
The only reason American dollars don’t say “In Noodles we trust” is that politicians don’t have a sense of humor. (Which is on it’s own a proof of the non-existance of God, but I’ll explain that another time)
7) Pastafarians sound too much like Christians.
Yes, they do. I miss the happy tone of the ages of old, where us bloody pirates tried to encourage people to think, not to offend the guys who couldn’t. There used to be a difference between the parody and the one parodied. Nowadays you guys make me question my non-believe in something I don’t believe.
God at least has a sense of humor.
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Why does everyone assume that for an afterlife to exsist, there must be a god. This world exsisted. I have seen no proof of any god what so ever. I have seen plenty evidence to lead me to believe that the world occured by chance without the help of a divine spirt… I have seen absolutley no evidence that leads me to believe that an a world after death does not exsist. Maybe, were all wrong. Maybe, we don’t die. Possibly are bodies are just in a “waiting” stage… Like a long term hibernation. The “pastafarians” (which I jokingly consider myself among) are mainly cosisted of atheist. They are sure there is no god or afterlife. They argue this. The Christian believe the opposite and argue that. The fact is no one will, can, or did, ever KNOW. So shut up. And enjoy your life. Organized religion is bullshit!
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Olax (#72),
1) “#51 never said that Pastafarians are Hitler-esque, just that most of the replies on this site seem to carry a tone that could be compared to (cq. isn’t equal, but alike) the way nazi’s used to follow orders just because Hitler said so.”
So you equate people who use faulty logic or who lack social skills with being Hitler-like? The whole point in calling people Hitler-like is to compare them to somebody who would use faulty logic to KILL people. Are you sure you want to use your definition of Hitler-esque? because you fall under it. You admit that you know you shouldn’t compare trolling to killing and yet you do. This is not a rational argument.
Also, #51 compared Pastafarians with Hitler, not with Nazis as you interpreted it.
3) “I don’t think many believers use reasoning to choose a belief.”
It’s very true that believers in Religious Faith don’t use reasoning when they choose to believe. They freely admit that they must take a “leap of faith.” The “leap” refers to the lack of reasoning. But comparing Religious Faith belief to emotions is not accurate. We experience the emotions of love, happiness, or fear based on real experiences (no leap required). Sometimes we get it wrong, e.g. we love someone who betrays us. To the extent that we are able to recover, we are rational. If we keep going back to that person, we are mentally ill (i.e. the definition of insanity). Believers in Religious Faith believe against all reasoning and real life experiences. In fact, if they had a real life encounter with God, they could no longer have Faith.
4) “And as a Pastafarian, #58, you truly are a little bit too fanatic. I would even daresay our bigotry is already for nothing.”
Can you give me one example of why I am a bigot? Religious people have too much power in this world. I should not have to lie when I say the Pledge. My money shouldn’t lie. My tax dollars shouldn’t support people’s religious beliefs.
5) “People…seem to cling to [evolution] like a solid fact…the explanation of (evolution)…is, and probably always will be, a solid uncertainty.
Can you give me an example of people “clinging” to evolution in which it unfairly affects you? Gravity and evolution are not solid uncertainties. We know a lot about them. Do you also leave your house with a tether?
7) “God at least has a sense of humor.”
Can you provide an example of this?
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Olax #72,
I have to say that your ignorance is extreme. Origins of mankind have been thoroughly documented. There are many lines of EVIDENCE on the origins of man, all pointing to one fact: we are a species of African apes. That is not something I “cling” to anymore than the Earth not being flat. Before you make a categorical claim that our roots will always be “a solid uncertainty” you may want to educate yourself on the subject. Also, you may look up the word “theory” in a dictionary since you obviously don’t know what it means.
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1. I wouldn’t mind being compared to Hitler. As long as I’m not compared to an everyday regular nazi. Because I don’t consider myself using faulty logic, and the social skills I lack are only the ones that stop me getting a kick out of insulting anyone. I think for myself, rather than following any “religion” (no matter if it’s 6000 or about 10 years old). And hey, Hitler liked thinking for himself as well, so I guess, yes, I could be compared to Hitler. So could you. Congratulations.
And yes, I interpreted the word “Hitler-esque” (which I believe should be spelled without the “-”, but hey, I’m the foreigner, so nevermind that) not literally. I guessed #51 thought the word “facist” would be insulting and tried to be more creative in her vocabulary. Since #51 has left the discussion, we won’t ever know, and I’ll agree to the literal interpretation, if you insist.
2. Oh, yeah, we agreed on that one.
3. Sorry for using the word “believer” as “religious believer” (because now, suddenly, pastafarianism is no religion anymore? And what about atheism? I don’t know the exact borders of “religion”, if any). I meant of course specifically the believers of the three monotheistic religions with the most followers, because I lack education about most of the other religions, including yours.
Then again, if a priest (or parent, whatsoever) tells you as a kid that if you sin, you’ll go to hell, I think that should count as a “real experience”. An experience that will lead to an emotion, if you’re not totally autistic. If most of the people around you (for example, your relatives) are very strict followers of the way of the Christ, you will surely get the feeling (or emotion) you’ll be rejected if you don’t believe their fairytales. And hey, if you see a miracle happen (or, more likely, can’t explain why something good has finally happened to your otherwise miserable life) you’ll really be grateful, even though you can’t point out anyone to be thankful to. I guess those could provide you with examples how a real experience can lead to a real emotion, which hey… which leads to believing in a guy on a cloud! Well what do you know…
Of course, there’s still the emotionless guys left who just do as they’ve been told. They’re nazi-esque. That’s just silly.
4. “Religious people have too much power in this world. I should not have to lie when I say the Pledge. My money shouldn’t lie. My tax dollars shouldn’t support people’s religious beliefs.”
I guess all those nasty feelings of being treated improperly could be easily cured by one portion of “not giving a fuck”. “You give too much of a fuck.” (Ok, that’s jonlajoie speaking. I should stop quoting people. Otherwise I’m acting like a nazi.) Anyway, you’re fanatic. You’re style of writing is like the ones you usually encounter on banners of protesting crowds. I’ll give you the better side of lying when you say the pledge. You are allowed to lie in court, because you swear not to in the name of a guy that doesn’t exist (needless to say: according to your believes). How’s that?
5. I seem to be misquoted. “The explanation of [the existence of mankind] is, and probably always will be, a solid uncertainty.” And yes, I can. You (plural) irritate me by considering evolution the only possible way this whole system could have been founded, even those of you who are aware of the name “evolution theory”. I myself like the “pure chance theory” a lot better, because it has a better way of explaining why my girlfriend has left me for a girl. There is no natural selection, or survival of the fittest in that, I believe. So yes, it IS a theory, and therefor not a certainty. And yes, you irritate me as much as people saying that it was God’s plan. Especially because I thought they’re God didn’t like lesbians. (I am not as frustrated about this as I used to be, it’s been over two years now, but yeah, it was kind of hard).
And if I may repeat myself, I never considered gravity a theory, just the explanation of it. The theory of gravitation, as I believe it is called. For instance, the F = mg I know cannot (yet) explain how light and even time seem to be attracted by mass, having no mass of their own (as we know). So, of course there is gravity, and of course there is existence of mankind (or shut down my brain and call me Descartes), but there still hasn’t been an explanation I’d accept.
And no, I don’t leave my house with a tether. It would be very impractical if anyone did that. Unless they lived in outer space, which I don’t. Why, do you? Does anyone?
6. Either you forget to get back on item 6, or you agree with me. Fine, anyway.
7. “The duck-billed platypus.” (Oh God! That was Douglas Adams speaking! I must be extremely nazi-esque!)
If you need more proof: look in the mirror. Not meant as an insult, but have you ever looked at humans and how they are built? I mean, have you ever had an itch on that one part of your back that you just can’t reach, no matter what? Have you ever compared penises, or breasts? I mean… that’s satire, dude. Everytime Man accidentaly hits his funny bone, God is rolling on the floor of Heaven laughing his pants wet (I believe that’s why it’s called a funny bone). And the proof is in the pudding, the top of your elbow is something you are very likely to hit against something. Coincidence?
And if there truely is a God, he really seems to like the idea of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Has anyone on this site been struck by lightning yet? I didn’t think so.
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Oh, and have you ever read the Bible? It’s truely funny.
So this God person comes up to Abraham, and says: “I want you to kill your oldest son for me. Or else you’ll really have a bad time, since I am the almighty God.” And then, just when Abraham decides he rather has no oldest son than a shitty life, God returns and says: “Haha! Fooled ya! What, you thought I was being serious? No way, dude, I love mankind!” (Relatively shortly after, he drowns them all.)
Or this one time, when he sents his son to Earth, and says: “Come on, son, tell ‘em you’re my son! Then after a few years of you being worshipped, you can come back to me and we’ll laugh at how much chaos you created over there. At least it’ll get Jove all pissed, if anything.”
Come on, that is funny. Even the DaVinci Code wasn’t that hilarious. And I haven’t even begun talking about the crusades. Or about the war on terror.
My point being, if the God that Christians believe in has indeed created this world, he must have also (indirectly) created everything that I believe to be funny. So, if there is a God who created everything, along with the downsides, he has a sense of humor. Q.E.D.
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I am praying to FSM for you as well.
RAmen,
maddie
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Olax, you (singular) keep irritating me by repeating your ignorance about evolutionary biology. Since I irritate you by “clinging on” to science, we are even.
Except that I have evidence. You only have jealousy for your ex.
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1. I do mind being compared to Hitler because the comparison is not about his independent spirit. Using Hitler in an argument is shorthand for calling someone a brutal monster. But I think you know that.
3. The “exact borders of religion” can be found by using a dictionary. Religion is belief in supernatural things without evidence. If a priest tells you you’re hell-bound, your experience of hearing his words is, indeed, a real experience that creates emotions in you. But that doesn’t make hell real. If I say I have a million dollars to the Ferrari salesman, he won’t give me the car until I back it up with real cash. Religion is the only area where believers say factually impossible statements, and the rest of the world is required to respect their ridiculous claims. Pastafarians are amusing themselves by requiring the rest of the world to respect their ridiculous claims or risk being labeled hypocrites. Atheism is the refusal to believe in supernatural things without evidence. You simply cannot logically call that a religion.
4. A Bible is no longer required in court. Can you explain why you think I am a fanatic?
5. I am sorry to hear that you are irritated by the scientific understanding of the world. “Pure chance” (or gene mutation) is part of evolutionary theory. That’s what makes it so cool. Random things happen. That means some of the random things that happen don’t encourage our species to evolve (Lesbianism and childless heterosexuals) and some do (healthy parents). So your girlfriend will not be passing on her Lesbian genes unless she gets a surrogate. That’s the beauty of evolution.
The fact that you don’t consider gravity a theory is evidence that you don’t understand what a theory is.
7. “If you need more proof [of God’s sense of humor]: look in the mirror. Not meant as an insult, but have you ever looked at humans and how they are built?”
This is evidence of evolution–not of God’s sense of humor. The God you seem to believe in is very Hitler-esque. Why believe in such a creature?
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Olax…you are a strange one. Have you a coherent thought? Perhaps a point to make in there somewhere? Im pretty sure I just wasted several minutes of my life trying to find one.
Id suggest you brush up on your evolutionary theory. It’s a fact Jack. Evolution is supported by huge amounts of evidence, so much so the fundies are beginning to accept it, although they do still try their best to work in irrational posbilities of their deity tinkering with it somehow. They are understanding evolution can no longer be ignored. So they respond by lying for jeebus and work their gods into the gaps that remain. Also they are utilizing a pincer move, trying to dumb down the public education system by passing legislation that would allow religion a foot in the door. Oh they work it good (by making it sound all sciency) and dress it up in a fancy suit, but it (ID or whatever they rebrand it as) inevitably boils down to god did it. Which brings us to the FSM, the whole point (which apparently went over your head) is to object mightily, to the religious nutjobs who are trying daily, to sneak religion into schools.
As far as the girl leaving you for a girl….*snicker*
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Olax,
Evolution and natural selection are in no way based on chance. Best explanation I have found for this is Ch. 4 of “The God Delusion”.
At least science is willing to admit that it doesn’t have all the answers yet. That is why they are constantly searching for answers, which inevitably bring more questions. The scientists will press on, looking for answers to those questions, too. Religion just sits back and says “You don’t have to keep researching. God did it. Problem solved.” To me, that is just laziness.
What do you think it is? How else did all of this come about? How are we here? God is obviously not an explanation. I am open to other explanations if you can provide proof and evidence that surpasses the evidence that exists for evolution.
I am excited to hear a new theory, as well as your evidence to support this theory, and multiple scientific reviews from biologists who have reviewed your evidence, have declared it solid, and say that this theory should now be taught. It would be even better if you are published and that article has been peer-reviewed. I am also going to assume that you majored in biology. Where did you graduate from?
I look forward to it.
In Peace and Sauciness,
D&WC
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Hi there, I just found your site while surfing the web. I saw all the hate mail, and I have to say that all those people who are christians and think you’re stupid are retards. Sure, I’m don’t actually believe in a religion (I’m an atheist) but sometimes I think christians are too caught up in their own religion. Just because they think their god exists they think others don’t. Since we might as well never know anyways (we can’t see “god”, right?) christians shouldn’t just criticize the FSM church like that. What I thought about Christians saying that FSM is ridiculous is that if a flying spaghetti monster is ridiculous then wouldn’t God be ridiculous as well? God “flies” around like a flying spaghetti monster, he “has the potential to “create the world” ” like the FSM in your religion, and no one has actually ever seen god before. I don’t know, but I’m nearly certain no one has ever seen FSM before, maybe someone did, IDK. In my opinion if christians think that FSM is silly, then god is just as silly, if not even more sillier than a piece of fly spaghetti. I may not believe in your religion, but I respect it. I believe your religion has the right to exist as any other religion too.
P.S. this is a 11 1/2 year old here. I just wanted to speak out to all the silly christians who think that god is better than FSM or any other religion. I think every religion has its own right to exist, even if I don’t believe in them.
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P.S.S. the only thing i really don’t get is the pirate ship thing. Oh well. No offense, really! Good luck on that FSM thing! :)
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@Insightful ape: Yay! I love being even! Have fun with your “evidence”! I hope you’ll never find “truth”.
@Susan: Using Hitler in an argument can be 1. a way of drawing attention; 2. a way of being a complete ass; 3. trying to take comparison to the ridiculous; 4. Ignorance.
Hitler died almost seventy years ago. Get over it. He was as good a human as any other human, especially if you consider the evolution theory, which states that humankind is evolving, so steadily moving closer to “perfection” (of at least to something better than banging stones together). I don’t mind being compared to Hitler, because I haven’t killed any Jew, gay or nigger yet, I haven’t invaded any country, I haven’t declared war on any country and I’m not even planning to. What’s left is a brilliant dedicated mind, so, clearly you’re comparing me to that part. (Okay, relax, yes for me, using the word “Hitler” is a way of being a complete ass.)
Your dictionary says: “Religion is belief in supernatural things” (I think the “without evidence” part really isn’t in the dictionary, that would be kind of strange, since believing never requires evidence.) and continues to say “Atheism is the refusal to believe in supernatural things.” (again, the without evidence part, everybody knows atheists don’t require evidence for anything.)
My dictionary tells me: “Atheism is belief in the complete absence of supernatural things”. I really don’t see any difference in the amount of stupidity. Therefor, I believe atheism is as bad as a religion as any other. There is no proof that there is anything supernatural, and there’s no proof there isn’t. This is the thought that Pastafarianism is based on.
Russel’s teapot. I sincerely believe it’s there, and you sincerely believe it isn’t. Neither of us have proof. The completely stupid thing is that we both seem to act in a way that responds to our believes.
You’re defending a belief just because I’m attacking it, even ignoring the simple fact that I’ve already tried to explain I belief in almost entirely the exact same thing. I think that’s fanatism. Close-mindedness. Shortsighted, if you like.
Thanks for your pity. I still don’t see any beauty in evolution, but thanks for YOUR explanation of MY misery. It’s quite a lot different than the way the Jehovah Witness explained it to me a couple of days ago, but I’ll try find comfort in both of them anyway.
“The fact that you don’t consider gravity a theory is evidence that you don’t understand what a theory is.” Gravity is a solid fact. It works. The explanation of gravity (masses attract, and such) is what I do consider a theory. I’ve been taught that a scientific theory is a way of explaining something natural just to be able to work around with it.
I don’t believe in God. I just said that íf the God of the Bible exists, he sure as non-existing hell has got a sense of humor, and a better one than Darwin had.
If I told you I think Professor Dumbledoor is gay, would that require that I belief in the Harry Potter universe?
By the way, and P.S.: Susan, I really thank you for the amount of time you think necessary to explain your point of view (and for once, I’ll say pov in stead of belief, just out of respect for you) to me. You seem to thoroughly put your sentences together in a way that others (including me) don’t even pretend to try. Thank you for that. I’ll happily reply to your next amount of text.
@Shelldigger: There was no point I’m trying to make, I’m just mocking atheism in pretty much the same way atheism is mocking ID. I just like to waste people’s time.
“Evolution is supported by huge amounts of evidence” No it isn’t. (Ha! See? I just proved you wrong in the same way you proved yourself right. Oh God.)
Oh, and I got the point of the original setup of the FSM. Glad you did as well. I just think it’s running out of hand.
@Drained and Washed Clean: I will never, never ever accept any proof quoted from any book written by anyone. I can’t do this because of H2G2 VI:49 to VI:53*. And furthermore, it would be just lazyness.
I think it’s a good idea to admit that one doesn’t have all the answers. I think it’s equally stupid to stop looking for answers as it is to search for more questions.
Oh, and I don’t have an official meaning on how the Earth was created. I can live with evolution, though. It’s based on perception, rather than emotion, and I like to base my actions on perception, rather than emotion, so I guess evolution and I agree, at least for a bit. The system seems to work, for now. For the rest, I couldn’t give a fuck. That’s why I bless myself for not having finished any educational system after high school. (Still here I am, discussing with highly educated Pastafarians in a language that I learned from watching television. Engels is nog best een moeilijke taal om te leren zonder degelijk onderwijs.)
@no one in particular: If “pure chance” is a part of Evolutionism, it equals the “free will” part of Christianity. It’s just put there to fill up for what the theory doesn’t explain. I for one try to believe there IS a reason why my girl left me for a girl, and applying occam’s razor, I think the most likely reason is just that she loved her in pretty much the same way she used to love me. And that’s what she said, as well. But “pure chance” will do, I’ll tell them. You may now start snickering again.
*) http://olax.nl/h2g2sample.htm
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Olax, you do have something in common with creationists, to your credit: in denying evolution, you are rejecting something you don’t know jack shit about.
No person with a whit of intellec dismisses evidence by putting it in quotes before, you know, finding out what it is. You on the other hand, decided since your girl friend left you, it was Darwin’s fault.
But I can only say, good for her. And it doesn’t matter that she left you for a girl-anyone would leave you for a rattlesnake, if your trolling the internet is any hint.
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Olax, I’ve enjoyed talking to you. However, I don’t know if your most recent comments about Hitler and your use of the n-word were sincere or simply an attempt to incite anger in me.
If they were sincere, maybe it’s best if we discontinue our discussion (our understandings of what it means to be human is simply too disparate). If the latter is true, why don’t you restate your argument with the ideas that you actually hold?
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To those of you just joining us, Olax seems to be a completely intelligent, logical human being. However, upon closer inspection, you find out he is an ass who is just trolling on the internet for shits and giggles. Lets see if they continue…
But making fun of him just because his girlfriend left him for another girl is wrong. Those are matters of the heart that you shouldn’t poke at. Olax is also at fault for bringing it up in the first place for people to poke at. Your girlfriend was born that way, and only just now decided to come out of the closet. If anyone denies this, there are studies that proved that female lesbians are attracted to female sex hormone, whereas a straight female is attracted to male sex hormone. Vice versa for gay guys.
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I vote that “Olax” be banned from this site after his threatening n-word remark.
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I’m sorry. I forget you were American (or should I use a term like “the A-word”, in this case?).
@Insightful ape: give me any evidence and I’ll give you my opinion. Until then, I won’t accept your beliefs for truth. You just repeatedly say that there IS evidence, and tell me that somebody else wrote about that evidence in a book I haven’t read, but you don’t tell me a single bit about what that evidence could be.
What I’ve been taught about evolution hasn’t convinced me any more than listening to fundamentalist Christians ever has. Nevertheless, it made me understand that the only truth is in your mind, not in the outer world.
@Susan: I’m terribly sorry I use words like nigger. Perhaps I should have said black person (as in comparison to what, normal persons?) or African native (to discriminate them even further.) But that is an altogether completely non-coherent discussion. So, I’m sorry. I blame it on my roots, I haven’t been raised in a country as politically correctly fucked up about racism as yours. About Hitler, same problem. One (I for one) probably wouldn’t mind being compared to the mastermind of King William 1st of the Kingdom of the Netherlands, who almost single-handedly freed the Dutch from the Spanish oppression, just because he isn’t German, he has been dead for quite a while longer than Hitler, and you don’t know how millions of people suffered under his reign, because we (the Dutch) wrote the history on that one. Now talk about discrimination.
I agree with you that it might be best to discontinue this discussion before things get even more off-topic. If you’d like to continue talking about the pros and cons of ANYTHING stated anywhere above, you are most welcome to reply by e-mail: fsm@olax.nl.
I won’t be visiting this site anymore for at least a while, so to all your Pastafarian Pirates out there, Arr! So long, and thanks for all the fish. May noodles rain upon you forever.
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wasn’t hitler christian anyways? it’s the individual that counts, not your loads of racist crap that generalizes people you don’t know.
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I would like to alter some points to my letter.
First, I must agree that (as many of you pointed out), I did sound condescending and patronizing, and was only referencing my own religion. I apologize, as that wasn’t my intent.
You were completely right on that point, and again, I sincerely apologize.
Also, it was wrong of me to assume atheists (or FSM followers) to be without “hope”.
As I look through your website, you all seem very happy and proud of what you do.
Thank you, I am glad you considered my letter “nice” and liked my grammar.
To those who will pray for me to “The Flying Spaghetti Monster”, and who hope that I will return to reason: Thank you for your concern.
I realize that my beliefs will not affect the majority (perhaps any) of people here, just as your beliefs will not affect. So I suppose both parties will have to agree to disagree and hope for the other.
My question about “when you die” came across much worse than I intended. I was of course referencing to my own religion, which was unfair, and I again apologize.
Also, my lack of evidence is due to my own beliefs being primarily based on blind faith. I am quite sure most of you could out argue me. As “plumberbob” wisely mentioned, I would need much more knowledge in “Hebrew, history, politics”, etc.
Finally, thank you to all the pirates who expressed an interest in me.
Sorry if I missed the point – feel free to contact me if you would like to expand on anything, or have anything to say. Please try to be courteous, and I will try to do the same.
Thank you
(You can contact me at zombikt@yahoo.com)
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@Olax #76
“I myself like the “pure chance theory” a lot better, because it has a better way of explaining why my girlfriend has left me for a girl. There is no natural selection, or survival of the fittest in that, I believe.”
There is natural selection in that though..she left you so you can’t breed so easily…and for that I commend her.
oh…don’t take me so seriously…I find humor everwhere. Your comments, others comments, the bible. All freaking hilarious.
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Guys, guys, guys. Please. Are you all really that bored?
Olax = lameass troll.
Let’s all just ignore him accordingly, shall we?
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Katie,
You sound like a very thoughtful and caring person. I agree that we should not force our beliefs on others or shame them into believing things they don’t believe. We should give each other the space to believe what we want.
But there was one thing you said that isn’t true and is the very reason for this website. You said, “I realize that my beliefs will not affect the majority (perhaps any) of people here.” Your religious beliefs do affect all of us when politicians use them to further their agenda. When religious people demand that religion stay our of public policy, then Pastafarians and New Atheists will go away.
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Dylan (#73) wrote “Why does everyone assume that for an afterlife to exsist, there must be a god.” Not everyone does, Dylan. Consider the Buddhists.
He also wrote “I have seen absolutley no evidence that leads me to believe that an a world after death does not exsist.”
Nor have I ever seen any evidence Catherine Zeta-Jones lusts after me. We can all dream, can’t we? How can you possibly have any evidence of something on another plane of existence NOT existing? This is even worse than asking how do we know a teapot is not obiting the sun directly opposite the Earth.
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You are quite right about Olax, Ron.
But it did bring a question up for me.
Since he was obviously so ignorant of basics of biology and yet he had the nerve to be a denialist of the hard-core type, does it mean that the educational system in the Netherlands is as bad as it is here?
If so, and if that applies to Europe as a whole, we are in even deeper trouble than we thought.
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Okay, let’s be fairly fair about this: I was the first one to call myself a lameass troll. But trolling this page is way too funny. And come on, except for Susan, no one has given me anything to reply on in a serious manner, because you all just state your beliefs without giving any arguments except for the fact that “there is evidence”. That’s what HE said!
I feel like the lasagna guru (#93) is the only one around who doesn’t take everything as seriously as some of you guys seem to. (@Lasagna_guru: by the way, she left me for a girl. That means SHE can’t breed either. In fact, she actually increased my chances of succesfully spreading my sperm across a larger diversity of females by leaving me, and that is what Holy Darwin wants me to do, right?)
@You all: Don’t fuck yourself up. There’s plenty of Christians to do that for you. ¡Viva la pasta!
P.S. I showed this page to my ex-girlfriend yesterday. We decided that “If anyone denies this, there are studies that proved (etc.)” was the funniest remark on this site. That is so gay. Not especially gay in a cock-sucking way, just silly. Silly Garrick. McElroy. Haha. Silly.
P.P.S. I probably should have used the term “g-word”. Sorry.
P.P.P.S. Can someone explain to me WHY I can’t use the n-word? I don’t like offending people when I don’t mean to. It keeps them from being offended by my intended (and far more clever) insults.
P.P.P.P.S. Seriously. ¡Viva la pasta! Don’t burn your noodles on lameass trolls.
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Re: 98 – Olax – Jul 16th, 2009
DNFTT
RAmen
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I thought I was done here…I almost came back and linked Olax to some evidence but assumed it would not be read or understood. Now I will try. Olax, lets begin with a nice little place: talkorigins.org Look around till you find the link that says “Browse Archive” click it, now look for “Quick Links” under that try to find the link “Evidence for Evoulution” click it. Enjoy!
Now Olax, dont just browse through this, it is a long and deep read. I suggest you read it at least 5 times. Treat this as a book report, read up on the subject, summarize it for us, and lets see if you learn anything.
Horse, water, taking bets on “drink” So long Olax! See ya!
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Olax, you seem sincere in your request to understand American’s use of the n-word. No doubt we have exported rap lyrics that give the impression that this word is inoffensive and mainstream. It is not. It is the single most offensive word in the English language when used by white people.
The term “gay” used to be an epithet against gay people, but they turned it around and now refer to themselves as “gay” and encourage others to call them that. The n-word parallels that only slightly. Some black people tease each other with the n-word and almost seem to use it as a term of endearment. But most black people will bristle when white people call them that.
And anybody would bristle if someone flippantly said he hadn’t killed any ____ yet.
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Olax, #98
The study I was referring to can be found here: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/science/article4138245.ece
If you would like I would be happy to go dig up more studies on the chemical reactions in the brain of a homosexual for you. This is a huge issue to me, while not gay myself, I feel they deserve every right a heterosexual person has, which is the ONLY reason I’m willing to do this.
“The research suggests sexual orientation is largely programmed into people early in life, according to Savic. However, other studies have shown a person’s lifestyle can lead to structural brain changes.”
While I admit this (mostly the last sentence) can be true. While it can change, it’s far more likely that it is determined a much younger age as opposed to the lifestyle that the person leads later on in their life. It does change, I’m not saying it doesn’t, but to change that much seems highly unlikely to me. When I say always been like that, I don’t mean ALWAYS always. I mean most of his/her life.
The fact that we’re stating our beliefs and not actually arguing for them is part of the satire. That is what Christians do. I, however, can. While at the moment I am lacking my Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, I will be back in an hour or two to provide proof of the FSM and to prove how pirates directly affect the global temperature. I will see you then.
Here’s to hoping His Noodly Appendage touches you and may His Sauce rain down upon you,
-GM
RAmen
If you have any questions about, or just want to discuss the existence of the FSM, you can reach me at kanastag@comcast.net
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@Plumberbob: Why doesn’t anybody listen to you?
@Shelldigger: Thanks. I have read the first two pages (starting on http://talkorigins.org/faqs/comdesc/) and you are right: it will not be read or completely understood, at least for now (I have bookmarked them for someday when I’m way more bored than today). The English jargon used is a little bit too much for me, but I will plough my way through it someday. From what I have read, I agree completely on it. The first sentence “Evolution, the overarching concept that unifies the biological sciences, in fact embraces a plurality of theories and hypotheses” pretty much sums up everything I have said (if you leave the random insults out of that). It goes on giving evidence based on the scientific method, which seems to be (and correct me if I’m wrong) “if everything you predict based on your theory comes true, it’s a pretty good theory, and we will regard it as most likely truth.” (Seriously, this text was way more than I should be able to handle as a high school drop-out. And I’m gonna read it again.)
It goes on starting with the second page, providing evidence for predicted events and situations (based on influenza, lab mice and aids, I believe). Picking the right possibility out of 135,135 ones… predicting the correct evolutionary tree of human Influenza A virus 83% of the time… reproducing the known phylogeny of 24 strains of mice almost perfectly… It’s all pretty convincing. But to quote two sentences on the first page, just to explain that this proves nothing:
“Common descent is a general descriptive theory that concerns the genetic origins of living organisms (though not the ultimate origin of life).” and later on “In evolutionary theory it is taken as axiomatic that an original self-replicating life form existed in the distant past, regardless of its origin.” – I believe axiomatic means that you accept it is so without asking for evidence. In pretty much the same way you’d accept gravity, to get back on that one again ;-)
But, I agree, based on what I have read and understood, common descent is a pretty good theory. I knew that already. But the site you showed me strengthened my obsession to question everything I encounter and never accept any theory, no matter how greatly supported, for a fact. So thank you!
Oh, and I didn’t understand your last sentence, about the horse and the water. Perhaps I would understand better if you’d replace the water by a beer fountain. That would be awsome.
@Susan: Thank you for your explanation. Whatever made you think I’m a white person? By the way, where I come from, “white people” would be equally offensive. And I kind of expect people to bristle, also when I write I haven’t killed any gay (however endearing that word is, when used by me) yet. What should I call people with a dark skin color, than? I can’t think of anything that is not in a way very very discriminating, and black one (to translate the n-word) pretty much nails exactly what I meant, without referring to origin, habits or status in any way other than an insinuation coming from misuse of the n-word in your country. So… Personally, I still don’t get why Americans get so upset about it, but I will respect your phobias.
@Garrick: Haha again. As an inhabitant of the Netherlands (you know, Amsterdam and surroundings) I live in the country that actually has equal rights for people of any sexual interest. (Like, until last year, this was the only western Europe country where expressed zoöphilia was legal!) Both my ex-girlfriend and I are bisexual, and I’m not bisexually born or raised, but decided I’d like to be. When I was about sixteen. Oh, and yes you are gay. Even your name is gay. Gay-ish.
And I wasn’t talking about your belief in the FSM, I’m not a Christian and I don’t write in all caps. I am also not “seriously” only fourteen years old, as most of the hate mail writers tend to be. There is no religion I’m defending. I was talking about your (plural) unsupported belief in Evolutionism. And I stand corrected after Shelldigger’s response.
Thank you all for your dedication and patience.
¡Hasta la pasta!
Olax
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Thats a start Olax. The thing to understand about evolution is there isnt a single instance of evidence that proves evolution without a doubt. (although some points by themselves are enough for me) The sum of known evidence is the clincher. Fossil record, genome studies, cytochrome c, vestigal organs,…toss in some geology, add a sprinkle of astronomy, a dash of common sense and your average fundie has no place left to hide.
…and yes, evolution does not claim to know “where or how” life began, that is another area of study. Evolution begins the exact moment that life did begin, however that may have occurred.
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~ rAmen ~
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(takes four Advil and marches back to his ship)
~ rAmen ~
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Olax: Racist, as well as other discriminations – like homophobia – arise from 2 factors: fear and ignorance. Coincidentally, these are the 2 factors keeping organized religions together, too!
You claimed that DISbelief in the supernatural was as absurd as belief in it. How is that? Why should I believe in something that has never appeared? I don’t believe in ghosts or the Easter Bunny, either. And while I do spend a few minutes a week at this site, I don’t spend hours in a church, nor do I give them a significant part of my income. Building my life around something I couldn’t prove exited would be MUCH more absurd than simply holding a rational opinion.
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@107- theFewtheProudtheMarinara
You don’t believe in the Easter Bunny!? His Noodliness will not be pleased.
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Not anymore, Bootstrap. The bunny meat went into the pasta sauce. Sorry, kids! You’ll have to ask mom to buy the jelly beans and chocolate this year.
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“I envy thee not thy faith, which is always in thy mouth but never in thy heart, nor in thy practice.”
-Rebecca the Jewess in Ivanhoe
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Good JOB katie!!!!
atleast you aren’t hostile… but really why did you take the time to post?
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Touching. Too bad you believe in a religion that says he’ll be tortured for all eternity simply for not worshiping a god (yours in particular)
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“When you die, do you know what will happen?”
Of course not, and anyone who says they DO is a liar and/or seriously deluded.
I suspect, however, that all conciousness would be extinguished. Game over.
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@Olax – #85.
You said, “I don’t mind being compared to Hitler, because I haven’t killed any Jew, gay or nigger yet, I haven’t invaded any country, I haven’t declared war on any country and I’m not even planning to.”…”(Okay, relax, yes for me, using the word “Hitler” is a way of being a complete ass.)”
Evidently, your use of the word, “nigger” is also your way of being a complete ass. Thanks for making even more clear what sort of person you really are. Finally, something we can agree on.
RAmen
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Olax, the reason no one has posted evidence is because no one feels like scanning the internet and copying and pasting stuff just so that you can read it. If you were really interested in being informed, you could easily google “evidence for evolution” or something similar. Instead, you want us to bring to to you.
Also, I think a little ego deflation might be healthy for you. Just my opinion though.
I will admit that there are some people on this site who are nearly as bad as the trolls. It makes me flinch a little to see a fellow Pastafarian swearing at someone.
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Hmm, Katie…
You have a nice tone, but in all seriousness it’s a bit patronizing.
Again people, if you have no evidence, DO NOT INSIST THAT YOU HAVE THE KNOWLEDGE!
You have as much of meeting your “God” as they do meeting that Spaghetti Monster.
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The Christians who don’t curse, who actually ACT the way they tell us to act.
I’m atheist,
But bravo to whoever wrote this for not being one of those sad people who come on here claiming to be better than us, swearing every other word, and making a fool of themselves.
May the great Noodley Appendage touch you Katie!
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I agree with Devin on this one. The tone of this message is actually respectful, it does not patronize despite what some have claimed. I wish more so called christians could muster this kind of respect with whomever they disagree with. So I say props to the original poster of this letter.
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This message is kind. At least it’s not more cursing. Still. Why can’t people just back off? I want to believe.
They believe.
So I don’t see why they have the right to insult us, or… pray for us. Gosh. We have our own god. Now you’re being nice so we don’t last back at you? Wrong. Quick, go for the eyes.
RAmen.
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god is not real. only the FSM is.
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Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
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“When you die, do you know what will happen?” Well as in the great words of Jimmy King, “I’ll be dead, and burried in the ground with little bugs feasting on my ass!”
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[@InsightfulApe(#11) Oh please ! EVERYONE knows that the terrorists are everything but muslims >D if they really were, they wouldn't throw their lives away as easily as they do and they would at least know that muslims "have their own religion, and the others too"......they wouldn't so much as TRY to impose their religion or point of view or whatsover and even kill others for that ! I mean stop believing whatever the medias and the likes says ! anyways, terrorists can be just about anything : atheists, christians or Hindous; And in every single case they're f*cking fanatics, stop dirtiying the Muslims' name or Christians' name or any proper believer because of a minority if you please;]
About Katie’s mail or whatever was her name, I also think it’s good to have proper English and stay polite =) But I also think that taking everything that seriously is reaally bad; This site’s purpose, as many have already said it, isn’t to convert people into Pastaism (sorry I don’t know the name for the religion of FSM believers…) but to denounce something else….and I totally think they’re right : saying you’re “laic” then go teach children at school the resurrection of Jesus really makes someone wonder what laicity really is. I hate hypocrites and doing that really stinks of hypocrisy; So I support the almighty SFM !
I totally agree with Susan (#47), atheists shouldn’t threaten and make fun of believers and so shouldn’t the believers; Also, in my opinion, those believers who threaten others or impose their faith upon atheists really aren’t real believers and just aren’t sure of themselves so they want to drag others into it. Everyone should just try to live their lives however they think it should be without interferring with others’ private lives.
RAmen, may the sauce protect us from evil and ignorance.
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What does she mean by “give god another try” not many of us ever gave it a first try.
Also just because we don’t beleive in god does not mean the we have no hope for life.
And when we die we become worm food.
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123 just out of curiosity, are you a 9-11 truther?
Oh, and imposing their religion on others has always been part of Islam. Just look at the flag of Saudi Arabia. Is there a rose on that flag? Rather, a sword. That is how Islam spread throughout the Middle East and North Africa. There is nothing new about it, neither about the promise that if they are killed in the process they will go to paradise.
Just for your information, literal belief in the scripture, though it exists among Christian, it is an extreme position. Among Muslims it is just about universal. And THAT is my real problem with Islam.
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If I were to say that this religion is plausible I would be just as fucking retarded as you MOTHER FUCKERS! Take this religion and shove it up your spaghetti ass and see if fucking sauce comes out the other side. You need to get a life and not worship a god that you have probably eaten every day of your fucking worless lives. Fuck you!
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“I also hope that one day you might give God another chance.”
Which god?
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Hehe nah but I do wonder if what we saw that day really was the truth…..I just tend to doubt medias that’s all; The whole thing just seems really suspicious don’t you think ? I mean the USA : United States of America didn’t see two big planes coming their way until they exploded ?
You’re certainly right about the Saudi Arabia’s flag and I absolutely agree that there’ve been many many holy wars in the ancient times (and various problems related to religon nowadays) BUT I don’t agree with your general view on Muslims : the Coran (or “Qur’an” in Arabic I think) is a book that contains various general teachings about daily life and more or less (and it still is very hard to determine) defines how we came to be here and how we’ll get out of this world; Anyhow, that book is certainly NOT like a kitchen recipes’ book where instructions are clearly put out so that everyone is happy : the tipping off thing is that you have to interpret the general “instructions” that are in there; Don’t you agree ? it’s a common thing that people interpret movies, books and various other things however they please right ? Well I think it’s the same for “holy” books. So if, for exemple it was written “Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loves not transgressors.” [Qur'an, Chapter 2, verse 190.] people who somehow had some kind of interest in demolishing Christian Nations (if we speak about ancient times right ^^) could symplify it by “destroy all those who oppose Allah and leave them no mercy for Allah loves not transgressors” right ? Well I could anyway for there are many ways of interpreting this single line [I don't even speak about a whole verse or whatever they call it or the entire book...] and if they didn’t have anything against Christians and did those things, well all I can say is that either they were a bunch of brainless idiots either they just followed the ones who actually did some thinking.
My point is (finally getting to it sorry…) the fault doesn’t necessarily reside in ALL of the muslims or the book itself; The problem is the interpretation of the whole thing and if you think about it, the same goes probably for the Bible : [Someone mentionned it earlier in the site] isn’t it a translation of Hebrew Torah ? maybe a mistranslation ? Well I can’t really talk about it since I don’t know much about the Bible so I’ll just move along; We absolutely CANNOT say what exactly that sentence means or if every single thing was transcripted correctly, therefore, the possible interpretations of the sentence are also just as unsure and blurry. For this reason, you can’t be meaning it when you say “Just for your information, literal belief in the scripture, though it exists among Christian, it is an extreme position. Among Muslims it is just about universal” : I don’t know for Christians but it surely isn’t true for Islam [Maybe you've heard about "Muftis" who [b]interpret[/b] the teachings of the Coran ?] and not every Muslim (’cause I know a lot of them) will scream “for Allah !!” and slash open his guts upon seeing a christian on the road ! ^^ Well that’s what I think about the “jihad” whole thing you seem to hate : if you can bear your hate for it a bit, could you just check out for a minute or two this site ? [http://www.religioustolerance.org/isl_jihad.htm] I think it’s a pretty interesting site and a lot of reference books are posted, if you’re interested in perfecting your knowledge about this of course !
Well to finish with my whole view on that subject, you seem to critisize [I'm not talking only about InsightfulApe of course ^^] only the beliefs and religions saying it makes people think badly etc…I think it’s actually the opposite : aren’t the three global yearnings of Man wealth, food and power ? [I'm cartooning things of course] Thus, do you think people would care if you suddenly told them to abondon all of those things ? Well I wouldn’t, isn’t it so much easier to live by your desires ? I think it’s only natural for people to choose the easiest way to turn things their way. Same thing with the Crusades when Christians feared the muslim’s power and wealth and sent people telling them : the more you kill muslims, the richer you’ll get; That’s also roughly what was said in the Muslim’s side at the same time probably.
On a side note : jihad also means (and you can see it in the site I recommended) researching self purity; Meaning : before attacking others, people should reflect on their own actions right ? I’m not saying it’s easy though….
I really like your way of saying things InsightfulApe ! ^^ it’s a pleasure to discuss of this matter with you ! I hope my opinion wasn’t that annoying to read and the spaghettis I ate today were absolutely delicious ! =D
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