How can you know that God is a F.S.M. if he is invisible? If he is invisible how can you see him?
What is said on this website, in your books and amongst yourselves doesn’t change what the Bible and the real word of God says. Gods word is like gravity, just because people don’t believe in it doesn’t mean it’s not true and doesn’t mean there aren’t consequences to jumping off of a cliff. Someone can easily say “I don’t believe in gravity because I can’t see it, etc..because it’s an old belief….” but that doesn’t change the fact that it is there. This is like Gods laws for all of humanity.
Have any of you ever seen your own brain? Does that mean that it isn’t there? Have any of you ever seen your heart? Does that mean that it isn’t inside your body still beating? Have any of you ever seen your soul? Does that meen that it isn’t there?
The fact is that we do have souls and I heard it put this way “If God did not exist than man would create one” and this is what has been done with the F.S.M. group. You have created a God and the Bible calls this idol worship. Often times groups in the Bible would create an idol to worship because they couldn’t see or hear or touch God.
God’s fingerprints are on all of creation and more and more scientists and peole are recognizing this alike. Antony Flew, one of the worlds most famous atheists has recently said that there is a God and one who is intelligent. The Bible does say clearly that man was created in his image (Genisis 1:27) so we know that God is not a flying spaghetti monster.
On another note, God’s word was written because He loves us and showed his unending love for us through his son Jesus Christs death on the cross and ultimatley, His resurrection from the grave. Romans 10:9 says that “If you declare with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” Salvation comes through Jesus Christ and Jesus Christ alone (John 14:6).
I would recommend that anyone who is a follower of this group to read not only the Bible but a series of books from a former atheist called “The Case for Christ” and “the Case for Creator” and from there you can draw your own conclusions. If you are truly seeking for answers in life than I would encourage all of you to search for those answers and don’t just give up by creating your own religion/idol.
Romans 3:23 says that “all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God”. That means you, me and everyone else in the entire world.
Think about it, if all the people in the world were on a boat in the middle of the ocean and the ship was going down and there were no lifeboats, everyone would need a Savior no matter how hard they tried to save themselves. That savior is Jesus Christ. Every other religion in the world is saved through works and Christianity is the only one where we are saved by our faith alone. Once a person proclaims that Jeesus is Lord it is up to that person to live his/her life for Him.
I hope that this has been some help to all of you.
-CD
How can you know God is a FSM
Published by Bobby Henderson April 15th, 2009 in Hate Mail (and concerned criticism). 406 Comments
406 Responses to “How can you know God is a FSM”
LOL
“f you are truly seeking for answers in life than I would encourage all of you to search for those answers and don’t just give up by creating your own religion/idol.”
How do you think any religion came to exist? People wanted to believe in something higher or better and create a diety that was the image of it. In this case a Flying Spaghetti Monster.
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He spoke to me and told me so. Duh.
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you are still arguing there is a god with only one source…your god. do you not see the lack of validity that creates? your faith is admirable, and this website is obviously to poke fun at the faithful so i understand your frustration, but telling me there is a god because god said so does not convince me and it never will for that matter. “The Bible does say clearly that man was created in his image (Genisis 1:27) so we know that God is not a flying spaghetti monster.” are you kidding me? this is your argument? your cause will be better served if no one actually reads this. Im not even saying that I don’t believe in God, i just think that when you argue like this it actually makes people feel patronized. “Once a person proclaims that Jesus is Lord it is up to that person to live his/her life for Him. I hope that this has been some help to all of you.” Yea. thank you sooo much for your insightful help. You know im a dumbass and have never thought of it that way. questioned faith will always be more valuable than blind faith. people have to question and in some cases defy to feel satisfied, and that is what the faithful don’t understand. pressure from someone else saying “believe! this is His truth!” is not effective. so if you really are trying to “help” people try not to be so damn self righteous.
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“You have created a God”
And who created your god? And who created all the other gods?
“because He loves us”
That’s my favourite. If he loves us so much, why is the world so bad? Why do we need WWW and other similar groups?
Now, I’m not saying god is a bad thing. We all need a god, or something to believe in. Otherwise no one would have inhibitions. A god is necessary but church and dogma is not.
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You lost me in the first couple sentences. Since when was gravity optional for some people?
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Hello CD:
I’m not sure that I see your point. How can you know that Jehovah is the creator if he is invisible? If he is invisible how can you see him?
How do you know that the Bible is the real word of the creator, and that The Gospel of the FSM is not?
What if I said “The FSM’s word is like gravity, just because people don’t believe in it doesn’t mean it’s not true and doesn’t mean there aren’t consequences to jumping off of a cliff.” Is that a rational statement? If not, how does it become rational when “Jehovah” (or “Zeus” or “Loki” or “Ra” is substituted for “FSM”?
CD, I urge you to go to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T69TOuqaqXI and listen to what is said there. I hope you will someday understand the nature of your own convictions about Jehovah.
Best always — Terry
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First, whoever said the FSM is invisible? He’s not the IPU for god’s sake. Besides, you argue that because we can’t see Him, He doesn’t exist, but I’ve never seen the God of the Bible either. (Note also that the FSM, in all likelihood, wrote the Bible Himself, if only to test our faith in Him.
Second, you argue that even though we can’t see our hearts or brains or souls, doesn’t mean they don’t exist. But we can see our brains and our hearts using x-rays or cat scans! Funnily enough, we’ve never found a technology that would show us our “souls”.
Next, you say:
So you admit that god does not exist?
Finally, I would bet if a ship was going down in the middle of the ocean, that Christians would die at the same rate as Hindus, Muslims, Pastafarians, and Trekkies. Your “Savior” isn’t going to pop out of thin air and give you a hand anymore than the Starship Enterprise is going to fly down and save you.
Scotty B
p.s. In both places you use it, it should be “then” not “than”, although this in and of itself does not detract from your argument.
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Have you ever read the bible with an open mind? Try it, it might surprise you. Most followers of FSM believe in scientific method, a good means to evaluate the bible by. Or completely disect and rule it out if you will.
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“How can you know that God is a F.S.M. if he is invisible?”
The same way YOU know all about YOUR god. A book told us so!
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Just because I never saw the Tooth Fairy, doesn’t mean she doesn’t exist either. But God has never left money under my pillow. It’s easier to believe in the Tooth Fairy.
Terry
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Interesting. You question the existence of FSM because no one has seen him but then tell us why your god is real even though no one has seen him. Some serious pot calling the kettle black going on here.
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Oooooh!!!
I’ve actually read those books, too!
I’ve read “The Case for Christ”, “The Case for a Creator”, and even Antony Flew’s book, “There is a God”. I’m working on “Answering the New Atheism” and “I don’t have enough faith to be an Atheist”.
Anyway, having read them (and the Bible, too; I went through four years of Bible-study classes) I can tell you that it *is* true; the Flying Spaghetti Monster is the One who created everything and Lee Strobel and Antony Flew are simply delusional.
Look around on this site, CD, and you’ll notice that we’ve had MANY sightings of the FSM, so we know what He looks like, and therefore know that our creator *didn’t* create us in His image, despite what your book says.
So we haven’t personally seen our brain, but it’s there. We haven’t personally seen our heart, but it’s there. We haven’t personally seen our soul, but we also HAVE NEVER EVER SEEN ONE EVER when we cut up dead people and, unlike the brain and the heart, we can’t seem to detect our soul with any modern scientific equipment.
Contrast this with the FSM. We’ve seen Him all around us, showing Himself and His likeness to us everyday. We have SCIENTIFIC PROOFS for His existence in the Gospel of the FSM.
You might say that the Gospel of the FSM is “just a book written by an out-of-work physics major” or even “not old enough to be a holy book”, but the Gospel is full of REPEATABLE scientific experiments that prove the existence of the FSM. Also, the FSM is just waaay more awesome than your misogynistic and narcissistic Magic Man in the Sky.
Also, I like spaghetti. And pirates are awesome.
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If I were on a boat in the middle of the ocean and the ship was going down with no hope of rescue, I would stand and laugh at the people praying while I drank and laugh with others in the bar.
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“Christianity is the only one where we are saved by our faith alone”
Nope, Catholicism and Orthodox Christianity require salvation by good works as well as by faith.
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Well, there is proof of the exsistence of gravity…
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What a goon! The usual mindless bible-oriented drivel, but then he goes and quotes Voltaire: “if god did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him”. Is he too dim to see that that quote is as unhelpful to him as it is sarcastic?
Put down the bible, cretin, and read ‘Candide’. It’ll teach you a lot about how the real world works, plus it’s very funny.
Oh – and by the way, does he really think his ’saviour’ would save anybody from a sinking boat?
Oh – and the majority of Christians in this world, including all Catholics and Orthodox, do not believe in salvation by faith alone.
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With that many moronic strawmen in one place, I think we now have enoug fuel to keep the orphanage heated through the winter! Huzzah!
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That was an erudite, clear and polite commentary. CD, we believe that everyone is entitled to believe whatever they want. Don’t go turning into a Jehovah’s Witness – you know how much people hate them (more than the French).
I’ve seen my brain (ah the human miracle of ultrasound), its small but its there. I can feel my heart beating so I know its there. The soul issue I’m not sure about, the argument that just because you can’t see or feel it doesn’t mean its not there works both ways – it might not be there.
BTW the comment about the boat sinking and needing a saviour is not very useful. Prepare for lots of smart alec comments about the coastguard, life preservers emergency beacons etc.
Anyway, thanks for the concerned criticism without swearing for a nice change. Believe in whatever you want, its freedom of choice – one of God’s great gifts.
Cheers.
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*shakes head* I believe in gravity because I see its effects; likewise with my heart and brain, and I have seen actual brains of other people. I have not seen any evidence for the Christian God, and much of the supposed evidence in the Bible runs contrary to science and logic. As for the soul, that depends on what you mean by that word – I have not seen any evidence for a soul that exists apart from a working brain, and so I do not believe in that either. Seriously, if you have real evidence, by all means share it, but until then we will continue to follow our feelings and experiences, and worship the mighty, loving, and most of all, fun, FSM. RAmen,
Sarah
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-CD,
There are lots of unsubstantiated allegations in your letter. If you can even read Genesis, I’d be happy to discuss it with you. I will discuss who wrote it, when it was written, the politics of the time, and the editor, and why it is as it is.
If you won’t come to the discussion, I’ll assume that you are another ignorant, uneducated troll, regurgitating what’s been fed to you to prepare your liver for foie gras.
RAmen
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Well, there you have it! It’s in print, so it MUST BE TRUE! The bible says so! But, oops, which bible? In what original language? Doesn’t it seem to provoke at least a little bit of thought in anyone else that before the printing press, the bible was “reprinted” by hand? By whom? Holy crap (so-to-speak), we can’t even narrow down what people today are trying to say when we have it on tape, word-for-word!
Faith, for most, is natural. Religion is a man-made concept.
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Best one in awhile
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Nuts!
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CD, I guess the point is your whole argument is based on the Bible. If you don’t believe in it (most people don’t), your post is nothing but inane quoting of ancient ramblings.
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Well-written, almost completely free of spelling errors, numerous citations… seen worse. But the ENTIRE post is rendered moot by the very first line: “How can you know that God is a F.S.M. if he is invisible? If he is invisible how can you see him?”
Change one thing and…
How can you know that God is a “FLYING SKY DUDE” if he is invisible? If he is invisible how can you see him?
Voila.
As for the rest, you ARE aware that the contents of the Bible were VOTED on by a bunch of Representatives whose own interests were in mind, right? Some word of god. Oh, and by the way, though Antony Flew has converted to Deism, he has… well… a direct quote probably is best: “I’m thinking of a God very different from the God of the Christian and far and away from the God of Islam, because both are depicted as omnipotent Oriental despots, cosmic Saddam Husseins”, and has repeatedly explicitly stated he is not a Christian, so not very helpful to your argument.
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Nope. No help at all, OCD. Quoting a book written by a committee of ‘wise men’ in the 1300s does nothing for me.
Try again.
TBHNA
BCA
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P.S. The Invisible Pink Unicorn thinks you’re a bitch.
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“How can you know that God is a F.S.M. if he is invisible? If he is invisible how can you see him?”
Well, how can you know he DOESN’T look like a F.S.M if he’s invisible??
“if all the people in the world were on a boat in the middle of the ocean and the ship was going down and there were no lifeboats, everyone would need a Savior no matter how hard they tried to save themselves. That savior is Jesus Christ”
i didn’t know that Jesus can swim! little no to save HUNDREDS if not THOUSANDS of people all by him self!
i mean, he’s just a man!
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Meh.
This just makes me shake my head.
Are you telling us that your faith is stronger simply because our god is made of noodley goodness? FSM isn’t a worthy god simply because he doesn’t look like a man and isn’t Jesus? You quote the bible, saying that God made man after his own image, but did God WRITE the bible? No. So how do you know? Because it’s written by the hands of man, who, if you haven’t noticed, like to think themselves higher than most things? Yeah, mankind must be the shit, if God modeled them after Him.
Meh.
Another thing, though, that bothered me. You compared your God and gravity. All right. So, since there is gravity, or something keeping up from floating upwards, there must be a God, because we can’t see him either? Boo. That just reminds me of a time where everyone thought the world was flat, and if you went too far you’d fall off of the edge, or a time when people believed the universe revolved around Earth, but that turned out wrong too.
I’m not really trying to make a point with the last paragraph, or any of ‘em really, just… felt like sharing the mind vomit your ‘criticism’ caused.
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This one is actually relatively intelligent. I understand CD, that you are afraid for us, we aren’t and we don’t want you to be.
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Dear CD,
Switch to DVD.
1) You can feel a heartbeat. You can see it in low intensity X-Rays. You can yank one out of a living thing. That’s how we know it’s real.
2) See above for brain, substitute for MRI.
3) “Soul” and “Fact” do not belong together in a sentence.
4) Using the bible to substantiate the claims of the bible is like trying to hit a hammer with itself.
5) We believe in gravity because when what goes up comes down.
God does not exist, and man did create one – Jesus. Who probably never existed.
Please submit to the will of the FSM. Into his noodly care do I commend thee. Do not suffer the wrath of his meaty balls.
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What makes Yahweh or Jesus any more believable than FSM?
Nobody’s seen any of them.
You seem to be arguing that because the Bible is 2,000+ years old, it is a more reliable source of knowledge and “truth” than the Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. This argument is null and void. When was the last time you had a sickness or disease cured with leeches? Old does not equal right.
If you were to change every instance of “God” and “Jesus” with “FSM” and vice-versa, and “Christianity” with “Pastafarianism”, your critical points would remain unchanged, except that the overall theme would be pro-FSM instead of pro-Christianity. This makes your argument flawed.
I appreciate your concern, but making a claim based on the assumption that “my way is just HOW IT IS and your way is wrong because it’s not my way” is silliness.
Flying Spaghetti Monster is just as real and believable as Jesus/Yahweh/Thor/Vishnu/Krishna/Buddha/Moses/Voltron/Super-Mega-Ultra-Zord. Have a nice day. :)
RAmen.
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Why does following the Flying Spaghetti Monster necessarily mean that I’m, as you say, “giving up”? I like the Flying Spaghetti Monster, and his dogma-free setup leaves me plenty of time to ACTUALLY find some of life’s answers. Because the answers to modern life sure aren’t in a 2,000+ year-old book full of fairy tales.
Why hasn’t anyone been able to walk on water in 2,000 years?
If Yahweh loves us, why hasn’t he shown himself, or created a second child for us to see and appreciate?
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FSM created all these questions you pose, to confuse you. Confusion about the truth is what created your Christianity.
One day you too will be touched by his noodley appendage. One day you will see the truth.
Noodle be with you.
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This HAS to be a joke.
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Well CD,
Have you ever seen your god? He’s invisible too but you beleive in him. You’re bible says man was created in gods image, our holy text says no such thing so it’s not true.
Your god is just as much an idol as ours or any other religion’s god is for that matter, you just can’t get your head around that fact.
And the bible quotes…how many times do we have to tell you people, they make no difference to us. I might as well quote this from Moby Dick:
“Better sleep with a sober cannibal than a drunken Christian.”
Only I think Moby Dick is a better book.
We don’t believe in the bible. It’s a book written by priest centuries after the fact. It is not a holy book to us so quoteing it is a waste of time.
And if we were all on a boat and sinking we’re all dead, your god or christ won’t save you either, you will drown. If that is the salvation your christ gives you, I’ll stay with my beer volcano and stripper factory thank you very much.
Ra’men
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No help at all. (tape rewinds, plays again: you cannot use your own religious texts as proof of your own god…) Also, learn how to spell genesis.
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While it certainly is a nice change for a friendly, well-spoken and nice Christian to come along, you must understand that the FSM is not a real religion. It was created so as to provide a counter-argument to ID, with a quite ridiculous (althought tasty) alternative that if ID is taught, so must Pastafarianism.
Pastafarianists may come from all religions, such as Christians, Atheists, Muslims, Buddhist etc. We are not solely an atheist group, or solely a group of nutjobs who believe in a Flying Spaghetti Monster.
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Has anyone else noticed that all serious Christians/Creationists cite “Former Atheists” in their arguments?
Really.
And I can guarantee that there are more former-Christian-turned-Atheists than former-Atheists-turned-Christian. I’m one of the former myself, as are almost every Atheist I know…
Also, gravity is scientifically proven, as are the facts that we have brains and hearts [also you can feel your heartbeat, so fail on that account]. God is just an idea that has not, will not, and cannot be scientifically proven.
So, preach all you want, but everything you’re saying is total bullshit.
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First of all the fact of gravity is not like God. Gravity is an observed phenomena which can be tested using the scientific method. Secondly anatomy is based in matter so of course it is different to God and of course we know we have brains, hearts etc. A position of subjective relativism doesn’t help you there in your argument. As for the ’seeing the soul’ question, no, I haven’t seen my soul, but then I don’t believe in souls, other than in a metaphorical sense (as a christian you should be aware that the dualist notion of the soul is derived from Plato, not from Judaism or from the Bible, indeed, the duelist idea of a soul being seperate from the body was only introduced later on in the history of Christianity).
As for Antony Flew, yes I have read his book. I’m an agnostic / default atheist but I would recommend it to all interested. However, your interpretation of Genesis 1:27 is a little wanting if you believe in a giant anthropomorphic being floating in the sky. Bad science AND bad theology that one is.
As for the suggestion that we have a read of the Bible as well as academic texts, that is indeed good advice. I for one have done both already but thanks anyway. I suggest a re-read of them yourself.
I would also suggest a thourough read of anthrpological articles on other religions as you seem to have a rather rudementary grasp of the range and content.
Of course, lastly, I realise you will not actually read this rather long rant, and that I could have merely sat back and been entertained by the flurry of comments which will no doubt follow of how you missed the point of this site altogether. It is a parody. But, I felt like a good rant. For the fellow atheists and agnostics on this site, I would point out that this guy is at least trying to be positive as seems alot better than the usual religious posts in the hate mail. And at least he suggests a few resouces? Have fun.
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Your God has no fingerprints or evidence. Don’t bullshit us and claim he does. You have a novel, that is all.
On the subject of Antony Flew, he became a deist… I’m sure there’s a least one here… and how does his becoming a deist support becoming a Christian?
BTW, I can feel gravity and I have held a brain (medical research) in my own hands.
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Wow…can you smell the irony?!
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“The Bible does say clearly that man was created in his image (Genisis 1:27) so we know that God is not a flying spaghetti monster”
The Bible is fiction, so how does anything that is said in it “prove” that God is not the FSM? Using your logic I can say “Harry Potter say’s there are wizards, so we know that wizards are real.”
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Hi CD,
Look, you took some trouble with your post so I’ll try to be not-too-flip in response. Some of your Christian colleagues are extremists who seek to impose their beliefs on others. I don’t know how you feel when people try to push their faith on you, but to many of us it can be offensive. In particular, the Christians who push “intelligent design” (as a means of getting their religious beliefs discussed in science classes) are obviously engaged in willful deceit. They are bad people. If you have a few minutes, search the internet and find the Nova program on theKitzmiller v. Dover Area School District court case. The manipulative nature of the ID agenda is fairly well presented. It is no different than “bleeding the beast” (the term that Mormon Fundamentalists use instead of “stealing tax money”). It causes many of us some anguish in that we don’t like being manipulated any more than we like being victims of theft.
So, CD, the main point is that you’ve missed the point. The FSM movement exists to highlight the activities of religious bigots who “lie for god”. The website is often lighthearted. Some of the people defending the FSM mission can miss the point as well. But, we don’t sit on our hands while bigots misrepresent their belief as science.
George
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I appreciate that this particular Christian isn’t angry and virulent like most who deny the validity of His Noodly Goodness, but I feel I must address the flawed logic. (Big surprise I know, flawed logic comming from a Bible-quoting Christian.)
“just because people don’t believe in it doesn’t mean it’s not true”
Exactly… just because you don’t believe in FSM, have never seen FSM with your own eyes, doesn’t he doesn’t exist.
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Well, if the Bible told you all those things about God, then they MUST be true. Of course, we have a bible as well, and it tells us the FSM created the universe. So, our evidence is quite as strong as yours. Stronger, in fact: our bible isn’t filled with gross scientific blunders, historical inaccuracies, immorality under the guise of piety, and so much more. Plus, our bible is much better written than yours, in that the author of our bible actually has an education. And, faith isn’t even required by our God. Basically, all we have to do is not act like a total douche, and we’re in. You want us to trade that for “faith?” Pleeeease.
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@ Eli: I think the word “fact” and “soul” can be used in a sentence where “soul” is used as a musical term :)
Yet I have a couple of questions for CD:
1. why is the god in the old testament different from the god in the new testament? OT: god of revenge, likes to play games with good people (Lazarus, e.a.) NT: god of love, a father. So actually there are two gods in the bible! Which god are you talking about then?
2. Why is the christian god the good one? Hindus have a lot more gods, change that their god is the right one seems bigger to me.
3. even in christianity there are different currents: greec-orthodox, catholic, protestant, born again christians,… they all worship the same god but in a different way. Maybe they angry god by worshipping him in the wrong way?
4. In what language to worship your god? It used to be Latin, then they chose the language of the people. So if I’m correct, god understands over a thousand languages and dialect? Errare humanum est…
5. When you die, you will most likely go to heaven. Good for you! But when you arrive in heaven, who will be the first person you will see there? Your grandfather, who died when you were 2. Your grandmother, who died when you were 25? Your first dog which ran away from home when you were 10? Your second dog that died when you were 22? Your father who died when you were 55? You mother who died when you were 60? Your children aren’t dead yet when you will die, so they won’t be there.
Suppose it is your grandfather. He will remember you as a 2 year old and doesn’t know anything of your life, you will have no memory of him what so ever.
6. If only christians can go to heaven, what about all the people that lived béfore there was knowledge of your only true god (which one of the two was it again?) Before there was even writing? The ancient Egyptians, ancient Greek,…
7. the first part of the bible, the old testament, is based on jewish tradition. So jews are half right? Dito for the muslims. Both consider Jesus as just another prophet, and not as their savior, like you do.
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“If God did not exist than man would create one” how succinct.
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This guy is a moron.
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cd, all i can say is “you started it!!!”
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