1. Do you know any building that did not have a builder? Yes? No?
2. Do you know any painting that did not have a painter? Yes? No?
3. Do you know any car that did not have a maker? Yes? No?
If you answered “Yes” to any of those statements… please give details:______________________…
Building with no builder=cave
This one seems pretty self-explanatory.
Painting with no painter=flower
This might sound as if I’m waxing poetic, but I figure that paintings are just an arrangement of pigments on some medium, usually canvas. Since the colors in a flower are natural pigments, I figure that this works.
Car with no maker is a tougher one. I guess that these days most cars are put together by robots, not people, so you might be able to make the argument that the car has no maker, or at least no living or conscience maker, although the things that make the car had a maker, and the car was designed by people, even if they did not do the actual construction. Side note, they do have robots that have designed and built other robots. I think that is really neat.
Do you know any super-natural being that did not have a parent?
If yes, please explain how he came to be…
How is that any different from a building, painting, or car?
Why is this in Hate Mail?
No, but I do know of a comment poster that did not have a brain. If this is the logic that is used for creating an entire belief system I pity you. One can always give the chance of a creator a .001 percent chance of having actually existed and created the universe. But if you decide to teach that idea you are not discovering anything you are only reaffirming what you gave already been told. You can not test whether or not there is godliness in something. One thing I take pride in is the fact that I do not need to know everything about everything but if I did I would use a source that is less than 2000 years old and wasn’t subject to a 2000 year game of telephone. Scientists can only show what the Universe was like when it was 3 trillionths of a second old, I know it’s not the definitive answer to your life but I still think it is commendable. I assume that you are open to the idea of a God, I hope that you can open your heart to the Flying Spaghetti Monster, it is He that will teach you not to be such a jerk.
2. Do you know any painting that did not have a painter? Yes.
I forgot who it was, but there was an artist who bumped a cart and his tray of colours fell onto a canvas that was propped against the cart. The tray stuck on the canvas and then slid down. The end result was hung at MoMA for a few months in NYC.
How clever, you copied and pasted something from another hate mail to seem smart. Good for you!
And this is the worst of questions. It gives us only one option. However, if we answer no to these questions, that doesn’t mean god exists. In fact, it denies his existance because god was not made by someone, according to you people.
I’m so sick of seeing these stupid questions copied and pasted here, I mean don’t they realize that we’re not as simpleminded as they.
1. no
2. no
3. no
so what’s you’re point?
oh, i get it, you mean humans were made by a humaner!!
No
No
No
We’re not saying there is no creator. We’re saying it’s the FSM is the creator, albeit an occasionally drunk/unintelligent one.
My good sir, this has been used before. It still does not disprove the existence of the FSM.
May you be touched by his noodly appendage.
Didn’t someone already send a hatemail in phrased almost exactly like that?
This is where other religions fall by the wayside. I can empirically back up the FSM in conversations that are hours long, and yet every hate-mail that comes in seems to follow almost the exact same rhetoric.
Let us thank his noodly appendage for blessing us with a religion so true to the fabric of the universe itself that it cannot be denied.
1: Ever seen a beehive, or an anthill?
2: Look out the window, silly person. Even better, climb a mountain and enjoy the view, or look at the sky.
3: Cars are a recent HUMAN invention. Does a whale need wheels? Does a bird have brakes?
Typical narrow-minded human-centric thinking. Nature was here long before us, and will be here long after we are gone.
Sarky, rhetorical muppet!
To the author of the post, who remains anonymous:
Ah…we’ve seen this before. It gets a little old, actually. Of course, we’re all supposed to think for a second, have a religious epiphany, and become born-agains, right? Why can’t the universe just exist, without some mystical cause? You, I guess, would allow that jehovah can just exist, forever and always, but not the universe. Doesn’t make any sense to me.
On the other hand, the FSM has always existed, and always will. RAmen.
First of all, you deserve congratulations for the proper grammar, punctuation and coherency, as well as allegory in your questionnaire. But the larger issue is the fact that you have missed the point- this is a religion. We DO believe that the car has a maker, so to speak. A noodly one.
no
no
no
and the final unasked question: do you know any planet that did not have a maker?
no, t’was the FSM ofc!!
deja vu?
This argument again?
All of those are man-made (maybe with the exception of the building).
You can’t extend that into the argument over who created animals, because we aren’t inanimate objects,
and no one can be sure that we were “made” by some sentient being.
If what you are trying to do is, as most creationidiots does, to compare the universe to.
A. A building.
B. A painting.
C. A car.
You are.
1. An idiot.
2. Someone without any education.
3. 1. and 2. combined.
Do you know any IDiot without a point?
1) Do you know of any universe that dis have a maker. Please post your documented proof and show all your work.
No, I do not know a building without a painter nor do I know of any paintings without artists or cars without makers. But we are talking about man made things. Why do people bother to learn how to make these things in the first place, if nobody is willing to use common sense when dealing with the big questions. You claim that God created everything however, the only available proof is an ancient book written decades after the death of this christ (which to me sounds a lot like santa). When people come back with actual hard evidence and FACTS the general response is to be “faithful”. If I told you that 2+2=5, you would say that it is really equal to four and you would be able to prove yourself correct. If I were then to say that it really is 5 because an ancient text says so and that you must remain “faithful” you would think that I was crazy. It is the same thing with religion. Hell, I was raised a Catholic and I enjoyed religion right up until high school, when I took my first real biology and math course. Religion is quite simply a way to keep people under control. No sex, no fun, and no logic. I do not believe that there is a heaven thus. I do not believe that there is a hell. I am free to do as I please without worrying about being punished by God and sent to hell to rot for all eternity. This does not mean that I will run around Axe murdering everyone because I do not think that I will be punished. This means that I am a smart enough and logical enough person to live a life where I do not fear God but a life where I am free to question everything around me. Everything includes your flawed belief system and the origin of life. So before you post smart ass and stupid questions, maybe you should take a look at how faithful you really are?
Have you had sex before marriage?
Have you even been intoxicated?
Do you curse?
Are you ever jealous?
Have you ever stolen ANYTHING?
Have you ever thought about adultery?
Do you go to church each week?
Do you do work on Sunday?
Do you eat meat on Friday?
Have you ever harmed someone or something?
Have you ever taken the lord’s name in vain?
If you said yes to any of these questions, which I know you did, CONGRATULATIONS YOU ARE A HYPOCRITE.
Good night and remember God loves you, and he is ready and willing to sentence you to an eternity SUFFERING IN HELL!
Buildings, paintings, and cars are NOT REPRODUCING AGENTS and are not alive.
Negates entire argument.
One all of those are inanimate objects. Two your arguement is incomplete an absolutely uncompellingin anyway. Get and education and come back and try again.
Define “building,” “painter,” and, especially, “maker.”
Thanks very much.
Oh, dear FSM, not this fallacy again.
1. Do you know any tree that had a builder? Yes? No? How about a rock? A bird? Yes? No?
2. Did you bother to read that we are on the same side, bringing religious discussion into the science classroom? Yes? No?
3. Did you know that the “a watch implies a watchmaker” analogy was debunked over two and a half centuries ago? Couldn’t you at the very least delve into newer philosophy to misconstrue to make your weak arguments?
4. Did you bother to think about what you were coping out of that lame little pamphlet that you ’secretly’ leave on the back of busses and under people’s windshields? Yes? No?
5. Are you capable of rational thought? Yes? No?
If you answered “Yes” to any of the above statements, then you are a liar. A dirty, pitiful little liar. Have a pleasant whatever, just don’t have it around me.
This argument has been used many times. Your theory here is that:
1) A caused B, thus
2) A came before B, never at the same time, and
3) B had to have been caused
Your conclusion is, therefore, that the B (the birth of the universe) must have had an A (a cause of B), and you automatically conclude that that A is God.
In my personal opinion, that’s a little too fast to make a conclusion for several reasons. Why? Because:
1) The “A” subject could be anything, let it be God, Flying Spaghetti Monster, Pink Unicorn, Google, etc.
2) There are physical phenomenons that are spontaneous, such as Quantum Mechanics, and
3) Many things in nature are probabilistic, so much so, it requires equal attention as your own cause-and-effect theory.
.
Point is this. Don’t go off saying that everything must have a cause, a beginning, and a purpose. All of those theories came from Aristotle, and Galileo long ago proved his theories can be radically wrong.
.
To summarize, you’re theory is outdated, and currently being terribly abused. Do not try to convert us into the people of the past. We have already reviewed their many mistakes and terrible deeds, and all vow never to carry it out in our current generation.
Do you know any universe that you can prove had a maker? Yes? No?
If you answered “Yes” to this statement… please give details:______________________…
1. Do you know any building that can reproduce offspring with variation (or at all for that matter)? Yes? No?
2. Do you know any painting that can reproduce offspring with variation (or at all for that matter)? Yes? No?
3. Do you know any car that can reproduce offspring with variation (or at all for that matter)? Yes? No?
If you answered “Yes” to any of those statements… please give details:______________________…
Once again, we have some idiot quoting kirk cameron and ray comfort on here. see previous statements, my fellow pastafarians have it covered.
@all, but particularly the Jo(h?)nathans
.
An interesting bit of mail my wife and I got recently was from a humanitarian group called the “Smile Train”; it was concerned with poor children around the word that were born with cleft palates. If you care, it won’t be hard to find pictures of them; in happy outcomes, “Before” and “After” pictures.
.
Would any intelligent design advocates (most of which seem to be buddies or even bunkies with their Cosmic Pal) like to explain what the Intelligent Designer had in mind there? I mean, the odds of such an outcome are obviously less than infinitesimal unless A Really Serious Intelligence were at work….
.
And would you suggest that the surgeons who worked to repair that kind of damage are interfering with the will of the Almighty????
Of course, as a Pastafarian, I do struggle with the same kinds of questions: Did the Noodly One want us to use our loaves, or just roll over????
I’m all FSMism but has anyone noticed that these post and most other articles are a little one sided? I mean i’m as antichristian/religion as the next Pastafarian but still, you can’t argue with a group that gives no feedback? This is all just mindless reaffirmation of each other isn’t it?
1. Do you know any building that can procreate? Yes? No?
2. Do you know any painting that can procreate? Yes? No?
3. Do you know any car that can procreate? Yes? No?
If you answered “Yes” to any of those statements… please give details:______________________… (especially about the buildings and the car - I’d like a new house an car but cannot afford to buy them; hey, do you think if I bred my parents’ house with my car that the offspring would be a motor-home or a mobile home (i.e. a trailer)?)
Didn’t we alerady comment about this once before? Do these people not read the other hate mail, or do they just not get it?
1. Do you know any building that did not have a builder? Yes? No?
Yes. Ancient people used to live in natural caves. This is backed up by cultural debris found in caves, and the fact that people will still use one for shelter today. Those were built by forces of nature. You have no God.
2. Do you know any painting that did not have a painter? Yes? No?
There are many natural depictions of beauty that are equivalent to being painted, even if paint wasn’t the substance used. Those were built by forced of nature. You have no God.
3. Do you know any car that did not have a maker? Yes? No?
There are many methods of locomotion besides cars. Legs, fins, and even truly rotating bacterial propellers. Those were built by forces of nature. You have no God.
If you answered “Yes” to any of those statements… please give details:
The details are this: You refuse to believe that anything except for a creative entity could have created all that you know about. If you are right, then the being that created all of this is far more complex than the resulting creation, and must, therefore, have been created by something yet more complex, ad infinitum. To say that God has ‘Always’ existed is to simply deny that anything has a reason by way of proxy from the top down, so why would YOU need God as a _REASON_ if God itself exists without reason for existing(note that you would then be the one who believes in an entity that exists for no reason or explanation, not me). If you think that everything was “Intelligently Designed”, then why wasn’t it actually “intelligently” designed, rather than haphazardly thrown together in a big god damned hurry. If you still think there’s a God, then let me explain that you’re ABSOLUTELY CORRECT, because the ALMIGHTY Flying Spaghetti Monster is that God, and as long as you don’t have to explain what makes you wrong, my notions are backed by the same evidence yours are, as well as science itself on top of those reasons you use.
Kudos to Dawkins for the reasoning I was missing. Too bad I’ll never get a response from this person. I’d be interested in knowing exactly why the FSM is immune from this sort of attack(though, he does generally alter facts to agree with his own existence), but failing a response, I can conclude that no such argument exists and that their god is unprovable, due to their lack of an acceptable defense, while the Almighty Flying Spaghetti Monster is completely safe from any attack by heathens of the sort who wrote the intelligent defecation message displayed above, because no defense for their puny entity could be found.
Yes to all three, but only because we have massive evidence to support it.
EPIC FAIL
Dear Matt,
Basil Baxter Loves You.
“This does not mean that I will run around Axe murdering everyone”
Basil Baxter is disappointed. Are you sure you would not like to try?
Ha ha…..linear thought makes me laugh…….and..cry….
Well, actually, there was this one time with an unstable lorry of paint, a large concrete slab and a very ingenuitive tramp….
Just kidding :P
But if your pointing our that the universe needs to have a maker, its no good trying to compare it to stuff on earth. It’s currently predicted that the first few minutes after the big bang were just filled with random particles and anti-particles. NO-ONE knows what it would have been like.
I believe stephen hawking has some interesting theories on the birth of the universe, read his book “a brief history of time”, it’s very interesting.
Show your workings.
But I do know of a clock without a clockmaker. The Dangerous Intersection blog attacked Paley’s argument with a computer program that “shook” a box full of watch parts repeatedly until they formed themselves into a clock.
The video is fascinating to watch (no pun intended, but welcomed nonetheless) and is an elegant and effective refutation.
http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/03/12/how-clock-parts-can-assemble-themselves-into-a-functioning-clock/
1. Did Zeus turn out to be real? Yes/No
2. Did Odin turn out to be real? Yes/No
3. Did Quetzalcoatl turn out to be real? Yes/No
If you answered “Yes” to any of those statements… please give details:_____________________
If god created the universe, what created god?
Yes, we know these things were designed. They cannot evolve because they do not reproduce with some variation under natural selection. If you sited living creatures I could answer no there is no creator. But since I know from documentation, common knowledge, and the fact that I see buildings being designed, that they have a designer. There is proof for that. But sadly, there is no proof for religion (aside from FSM of course.)
Answer to all three questions- Yes.
Building with no builder: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/newsnight/3135710.stm
.
Painting with no painter was a tough one, but then i thought of modern art- the likes of Jackson Pollock, and to a more relevant extent that of Hermann Nitsch. the works of these two “artists” are largely composed of paint splattered on a canvass.
For every person who has ever knocked over an open tin of paint, a painting with no painter(just a knock-overer) has been produced.
.
Car with no maker appeared difficult, but in fact most modern cars are made by production line machinery.
.
There’s really little more i can say…
@Henderob
I’m glad to see that you compare religion to other man-made things like painting and buildings, that seems very reasonable.
Buildings and religions are very alike; thought up, designed and built by mankind for mankind to provide shelter. Whether buildings and religions should have the same rights, I wonder….
By the way, if God (Allah, FSM) is behind everything, who’s behind God?
Hail to his Noodliness
Someone probably pointed this out already but…all you have “proven” is that things that have been created have a creator. This would only apply to the universe if you could prove it was created by something. In order to decide that the universe was created by some sort of being, you would need both another universe that created by some sort of being and a universe that was not created by a being to compare it to.
these are all man made things of corse there is a maker of them asking these questions is like who created the bmws or the twin towers and the the painting on the sixteen chapel. we know they where created by people but some people may not know the famous painter or designer. if you look them up on google you will find his or her name. the where not created by the same person. the macbook is ad example too steve jobs.
R.A.S.
Ok, i have heard this argument for a fucking billion times.
Do buildings/paintings/cars reproduce? Yes?No?
If buildings/paintings/cars cannot reproduce then can they be subject to natural selection in which the best adapted OFFSPRING live and PASS ON their genes to the NEXT GENERATION?Yes?No?
If you answered yes please explain…
That argument never converted anyone, it never made anyone stop and think, it never made anyone question their beliefs. All it did was make a bunch of atheists laugh their asses off at creationism, and it still does. I think people are not things like buildings/paintings/cars and that they are more important. So you say people are things, i say they are animals (the most advanced and smartest animals on the face of the fucking planet), which is worse?
If you answered things….. PLEASE EXPLAIN!!!!!
Please read what we say when we tell you your argument doesnt work!!!!! I have seen this particular one on this site a few times already, and i still come here.
The thing that really gets me about this type of hate mail is the frame it posits. In this mail, the author is saying he’ll be the judge and it is imcumbent on us to PROVE IT TO HIM TO HIS SATISFACTTION OR IT ISN’T TRUE. That is exactly the frame that fundamentalists employ from their pulpits when they proclaim evolutions is “only a theory” and creationism is “science”.
While I would never want to in any way restrict free speech, these kind of tactics employed by these unprincipled televangelist types underscore the need for education in critical thinking and the art and psychology of persuasion in our schools. These assholes can only get away with this shit because of the dismal state of public education in our country. When you have a populace that does not know how to evaluate what they are being told, especially by people who have a lot to gain by lying and misrepresenting the truth, you get people who think lik the author of this missive.
You also get a hard core 30% who think Bush and Cheney (the torturer) are doing a great job. Nuff ced.
nice try, but its all been said and debunked already. you must have thought that you sounded pretty bad ass quoting Ray Comfort. better luck next time, maybe some original thoughts too.
Dear Pastafarians,
Basil Baxter Loves You.
It is, in Basil Baxter’s humble opinion, fultile to argue with Christians. They have their One True Friend, and they are sticking by him even though even the early Romans saw him for the tree-hugging hippy he was and made him hug a tree all of his own for three days.
See:
http://www.basilbaxter.com/42/world-religions-christianity/
And for good measure:
http://www.basilbaxter.com/54/world-religions-pastafarianism/
http://www.basilbaxter.com/53/basil-baxter-has-dinner/
The thing is, the really important thing is, that there is but one One True Friend, and since your FSM was quite tasty, Basil Baxter humbly proposes himself as the most likely candidate. The one great advantage is that youcan do away with the floppy boots and false hooks. And instead of saying ‘Arr’ at Christians, you can simply kill them and get it over with.
@ Sarah April 11 908 pm,
I loved your post!
And to answer your question, you CAN bred your house and car as long as it is a female house and a male car. Sadly, most of the motor-homes produced by this process are stillborn - they lack an engine and have a severly retarted suspension. (this is because houses have 50 cromosomes, and cars have only 48.) So you will still need to buy and install an engine. Once you do this, the motor-home will likely worship you as its creator and swear that you have always just existed.
I’m gettin a big laugh out of the outrage some Americans are demonstrating toward having the Olympic torchbearer on our soil becuase the games will be played in Beijing, and the Chinese are currently involved in a conflict with Tibetan nationalists that involves human rights abuses.
Consider this comes against a backdrop in which ABC News is reporting that an Executive committee Chaired by Condoleeza Rice and having as its principals Dick Cheney, George Tanant, Colin Powell, Donald Rumsfeld and John Ashcroft appoved on a case by case basis “enhanced interrogation techniques” involving “slapping, sleep deprivation, waterboarding”being used on suspected Al Queda operatives at Abu Graib and Guantanomo. In short, the highest levels of our government apporved torture, as a program, in spite of thier denials at the time. Only it wasn’t torture because they had the Dept of Justice define torture to be nothing short of treatment which causes “organ failure.” Needless you won’t find that definition in either Meriam Webster or Blacks Law Dictionary.
Needless to say this gives us a window on the arrogance and sense of entitlement of this radical right wing “neo-con” administration. They are in effect telling the world that not only torure, but also truth is what they say it is, and no one else has a say. They are the “deciders and the definers”. But what can we expect when these guys came to power on the strength of a rigged and stolen election.
The real mind boggler here is the cravenness of the democratic opposition, you will hear the phrase “war crimes” bandied about on the blogosphere and on networks like MSNBC by Olberman and Mathews, but where else do you hear it? Where are the Fullbright and Ervin hearings of this generation? Where is the talk of impeachment? Are the Dems so intent on winning in November that they will overlook obvious high crimes and misdemeanors? And what of the Democratic Presidential candidates? Why are they silent, why isn’t this conduct being brought forth as an issue? What would the Bush Cheney administation have to have been proved guilty of before the candidates talk about bringing them to justice as the criminals they so apparantly are?
I can’t believe it, but it appears that the Bush-Cheney and all their people will skate into history with a free pass. By the way, expect that as the last official act of his administation, Bush gives free absolute and unconditional pardons to everyone and I mean everyone: Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, Wolfowitz, Patrues, Pearl, Tenant, and all their deputies, putting everyone beyond the reach of legal accountability. Except, maybe, the Hague. They better watch where they travel after 2009.
Which brings us back to the the issue of moral authority. How can the US place posit itself as a center of moral authority after the Bush administation, particularly if none of the officials of that administation are ever held accountable for their crimes. Answer, the US has surrendered its claim to be a center of moral authority, probably for the balance of our lifetimes.
Know what other institution has surrendered its claim? The Catholic Church. It’s elected an ex-Nazi pope. Moreover, this guy insructed his Bishops to delay release of any information regarding sexual abuse of children until after the statute of limitations expired in the relevant jurisdiction. Some moral authority. Guess this is another thing to add to the Vatican’s financial shenanigans in the ’80’s and its collaboration with the fascists and Nazi’s in the 20’s, 30’s, 40’s, as well as its role in helping Nazi war criminals escape justice by supplying the likes of Eichman with Vatican passports.
So these are the principal moral authorities in the world today, huh? WTF!
In his book Treatise on Human Nature (1740), David Hume proved conclusively that causality is a function of the mind - causality does not exist in what we call the “external world” or the “objective world”, it exists only in the mind. Immanuel Kant and others build on this observation and showed that reality is purely a construct of the mind.
The theory of ‘intelligent design’ and of the ‘prime mover’ are based on the mistaken belief that causality is a principle of nature, of the “external world”.
But as there is no such thing as “objective reality”, there cannot be a “prime mover” or “intelligent design”.
We have known this since 1740, yet people still believe in intelligent design.
And if there was intelligent design, would it have designed as world as messed up as this?
Guys, it is easy:
“No, I do not know of any man-made thing that did not have a maker. Do you? Yes/No”
|+|Gothic_Pink|+| said, “I’m all FSMism but has anyone noticed that these post and most other articles are a little one sided? I mean i’m as antichristian/religion as the next Pastafarian but still, you can’t argue with a group that gives no feedback? This is all just mindless reaffirmation of each other isn’t it?”
.
There has been some feedback (Rachel and darkcitymedia (Where is he, anyway?)) are two, but I certainly share your point of view. It does seem to just come down to “mindless reaffirmation.” Personally, I am getting bored with the same thing over and over.
.
I suppose that if I didn’t visit this site for several months or years, it would be the same when I came back. But, all-in-all, I do like supporting my fellow Pastafarians. I just wish there were more variety. Even pasta comes in many types and tastes.
.
RAmen
So, you are looking for a first cause. If everything requires a first cause, then who or what caused your god?
Please answer here:
_____________________________
If you cant see the inherent logical flaws in your argument, your unintelligence has made you destined for a life of losing, and not worth any more of my time.
Matt: Not to justify the argument of this poster, as it’s not a very good one, but I have to say something: I’ve never heard any Christian saying that they’ve never sinned. Everyone sins. That’s one of the main points of Christianity; everyone sins, and thus everyone is in need of God’s forgiveness. Christians praise God because He does forgive anything.
1. Do you know any building that did not have a builder? No
2. Do you know any painting that did not have a painter? No
3. Do you know any car that did not have a maker? No?
You forgot:
4. Do you expect us to take this seriously? Yes? No?
If you answered yes, you missed the point.
RAmen.
Actually, my car did not have a maker. Try to figure that one out!
RAmen
Have you ever met a creationist with an original argument? Yes? No?
1. Do you know any building that did not have a builder? Yes.
Building (Wiktionary): A closed structure with walls and a roof.
At the bottom of a canyon, the high granite cliffs are the walls and the sky above forms a roof … give me evidence that this canyon was created by a divine being some 5800 years ago and I too will become a creationist.
3. Do you know any car that did not have a maker? Yes.
It all depends on how you define a car, but if you define it as a mode of transportation requiring no physical work done on the part of the transported, you could call a river a car for the many people who used them before steel automobiles powered by internal combustion were invented.
2 (I saved this for last). Do you know any painting that did not have a painter? Yes.
Say you have a piece of paper and a can of paint next to it. A sharp, quick increase in energy (due to some random cause, like an earthquake) can cause the pain to spill. Now, this will cause no pattern you recognize, but we humans may be unrecognizable patterns to some other form of life in the galaxy.
Of course, Henderob, we all believe that the world had a maker, it’s obvious, and furthermore, it’s obvious that the maker was His Great Noodliness, the Flying Spaghetti Monster! If you think your argument is truly convincing, you have to look at all of our evidence for the FSM. His Noodles are at work all the time! Sure, it was my religious experience over a plate of spaghetti that began my faith, and irreducible complexity and the watchmaker argument that started my reasoning for the FSM, but surely His proof is all around us!
The only difference is that we believe he was drunk while creating the world, which you probably don’t believe about your deity, but it’s a perfectly easy thing to see when we look at the chaos and hardship in the world, what with the asteroids, vast amount of unpopulable worlds, Brittney Spears, the appendix, etc. it obviously was created by a very intelligent, but not all-powerful or perfect being, just a Great Noodly wonder.
Also, our Heaven is better than yours, and our Hell more tolerant, so I think it’s obvious that our Noodly Master is the one you are looking for with your inquisitive line of questioning! Brothers, let us not turn away anyone seeking with questions of ignorance, let us turn them towards His Noodliness!
RAmen
Have you ever seen someone/something create an eye? Yes? No?
Have you ever seen someone/something create a dog? Yes No?
Do you even ever think for yourself? No?
Spread the word religion is a doomsday device :D
@ Basil Baxer:
Oooh. You “Ate” our god! Wow. And here I thought the fundie idiots did that weeks ago. No, months. No, years… come to think of it, it’s about the oldest, lamest attack on Pastafarianism ever.
Tell me. How does it feel to share something with the people you hate so much. You have descended to their level. You looked in the mirror and saw them in your place. Have a nice dinner.
Oh wait….I once made a painting! Therefor……logically……I AM GOD!
Do you know any painting that did not have a painter? Yes? No?
Yes. The Painted Dessert. No one said that it had to be painted on a canvas, did they?
Ummm
this has been published before. Marion Sudvarg, a brilliant response. And RedBearded Pirate, I totally agree but remember henderob is entitled to his opinion too.
We will never know who is in the right here, but I continue to maintain a firm belief in the FSM.
Peace Love and Pirates to all!
RAmen.
Your argument is flawed. By defining God as the creator, you suppose that the only way that something can come into being is that it was created, like a building or painting. But what created God? How can you argue that a building must have a builder, a painting must have a painter, therefore God created the earth and all life, but He has always been and nothing created Him?
I answered “no” to all of those Q’s. the FSM is the maker.
RAmen
Here’s one…
Have you heard of the watchmaker analogy? Yes? No?
I would guess no. You should look it up however, as it shows that your argument is not only wrong, but famous for being wrong.
1. Have you ever seen the blueprints for a tree?
2. have you ever seen the prelimary scketches of a sheep?
3. Have you ever seen the design specifications for carp?
If the answer to any of these is yes, please see your psychiatrist.
Oh I get it. Because man-made things are build by someone and do not spontaneously appear, then nature and evolution my natural selection must therefore also be designed. Quite brilliant non sequitur. If you could please show me how buildings etc replicate through sex thereby passing on their genes to the next generation.
Dear anonymous poster:
This is nonsense. If you have a point, please try to be clear about it. People making things out of other things (houses, paintings, cars) is not “creation” in the sense that I suspect you mean it, it is just rearranging things that already exist into new and more useful or pleasing shapes. You are most likely an idiot.
The aparment I rent did not have a builder. No one fitting that description would build walls that thin.
Paintings without a painter? Don’t get me started on modern “Art”.
And, my last car did not have a builder. It was a Ford. However, I switched to Japanese and have not had to think about the bits ever since.
@StJason
Dear StJason,
Basil Baxter Loves You.
It is quite impossible for Basil Baxter to descend to anyone’s level. As he noted on his Blog: (http://www.basilbaxter.com/) he is Sick, demented, he prowls the streets at night naked, wearing nothing but sunglasses and carrying only Polly, his trusty, rusty, chainsaw. He is quite obviously as low as one can get already. And he Loves You.
Basil Baxter strives towards killing anything that lives in inventive and interesting ways. As such, perhaps eating was not the most novel method to pick, Basil Baxter concedes. Thing is; he had all these mock pirates to push through the industrial pasta-machine, and felt like a snack.
But Basil Baxter would like to assure you that several other One True Friends before The One True Friend met a nasty fate, to quote:
“Given his dislike of false friends, the kind of friends people might hold over Basil Baxter as The One True Friend, it is also strongly hinted that he was not, as he himself claimed, “on his way to build a new shed” when Judeans saw him trudging around with timber and long nails near Golgotha hill.”
http://www.basilbaxter.com/28/how-basil-baxter-came-to-be-part-1/
And:
“Basil Baxter thought about this for some time. He thought about it for a very long time, as he stared out the window to the playground full of, for the day safe, potential victims. He was slacking off. Meanwhile in space a missile reached the end of an automated launch-cycle…”
http://www.basilbaxter.com/56/basil-baxter-slacks-off/
But if it makes you feel any better; Basil Baxter still owns the Pasta plant and would quite happily make you a new One True Friend, if only he could get the pirates to dough ratio right.
@Real
Valid points you brought up Real, but I must ask, what does that have to do with anything we are discussing?
Precisely. So who created the creator? We already know who built him, painted him and drove this
archaic point of view down our collective throats.
Landlubber said it perfectly and i’ll say it again…
Your argument is flawed. By defining God as the creator, you suppose that the only way that something can come into being is that it was created, like a building or painting. But what created God? How can you argue that a building must have a builder, a painting must have a painter, therefore God created the earth and all life, but He has always been and nothing created Him?
Creationists and proponents of I.D. Theory try to target small unexplained (for now but we will get there) pieces of Evolution Theory. While everyone has a right to their own beliefs, they should hold the responsibility to at-least logically think through what they believe in before they demand all others follow in stride of their beliefs. Case in point, the anti-evolutionists claim that Darwin’s theory lacks an explanation backed by evidence for how everything began/was created. Where is their evidence? Written in the man-made Bible? A burning bush atop a mountain that spoke to a man thousands of years ago? What created your so called God??? I’d love to hear a reasonable explanation for this one? Maybe he evolved from the Flying Spaghetti Monster himself….it makes about as much sense as any creationist explanation i’ve ever heard.
Oh my goodnes, you are so full of air…I meant to say shit, but that will mean that you actually have something in that hole called head.
Please read, religion is about being ignorant…so stop trying to be intellectual.
How long did it take you to come up with this one? Don’t you think that time might have been better spent, oh, I don’t know, DOING SOMETHING WORTHWHILE TO BENEFIT YOUR FELLOW MAN?????
Do you know of any building that had a mother?
Im sorry, please tell me who created your god…
Your questions have fogged and subsequently cleared my mind. I now know that the one, true, Christian god built my lead-paint-and-asbestos shack, painted the dirty sayings on the outside, and is responsible for the recent demise of my yellow Dodge Dart.
I HAVE SEEN THE LIGHT!
Wait, no…it was just a police cruiser going by. Nevermind.
“Pleased to met you/Hope you guess my name”.
Never woulda guessed Basil Baxter. Somehow it seems way to pedestrian, like the humor on the webite. Plus, seems every time I go there, my computer locks up. Can you say malware? Tisk, tisk.
OK lets say there is a GOD and he created everything we see around us. I therefor have one question that must be answered before I join your cult..I mean religion..religion.
If GOD created the heavens and the earth and is omnipitent all knowing all seeing and forever….Then what was he doing for the mellenia prior to the earth project? What was he doing for so long with out light, stars and matter?? Was he just sitting around and just think you know what would be fun making a universe. Ok I have a second question. Where did GOD come from? If you can answer that without using “he was always there” then Science would be obligated to find where the big bang came from and how life started.
Does anyone believe Basil Baxter “Drove a tank, held a general’s rank/ When the blitzkreig raged and the bodies stank”?
Evil should be more entertaining, far less derivative, and perpetrated by someone other than a wooden shod goth dutch boy.
I made a tuna casserole… am I its God? what if it worships me?
Reproduction with variation is the driving force behind evolution. Buildings, paintings, and cars do not reproduce with variation. Organisms do. Trying to disprove evolution by ignoring reproduction with variation is like trying to disprove heavier-than-air flight by ignoring the physics of aerodynamics and wing structure.
If I knew a builder who built a house… a painter that painted a house… an engineer (not ‘maker’)who made a car… that had gotten into the condition this world has found itself in… he’d never work again. How can you ignorant, american, christians, honestly believe these delusions? If this is the way a god wanted it, I refuse to worship him. However, by all means, please keep posting stupid shit on here. It keeps me laughing.
Well… I’m not Christian but I do believe in a God, an incomprehensable one. I dislike religion it is stupid, I do not actually practice anything in believing in God, I just believe in something and I believe our human minds are so pathetic and stupid that we couldn’t possibly even begin to understand what he is.
So far, the God I believe in right now is an Extra-multiversal infinitely self-creating entity that never exists in the same form at any one time but keeps creating over itself in direct violation of the laws of thermodynamics, which is fair, seeing how he’s extra-multiversal and therefore not bound to any laws of physics. Oh and he wasn’t Jesus and he never came to Earth.
Yes, by the way I know my belief have completely nothing scientific to be based on, but there is more than science in this world, even though science is by far one of the smartest ways of thinking. But, it is possible to be right and go down a completely wrong train of thought, a lot of scientists have proven that.
Anyway, my belief doesn’t particularly impede on anyone, personally I don’t believe anybody should burn in a christian hell but you know, whatever happens… I don’t go to church, I don’t ask God for things and I don’t go door knocking telling people that the God I believe in is the only God. The closest I get to shoving religion in people’s faces is if they ask about religions or ask what I believe, and I reply, I believe in a God.
P.S. Hopefully I don’t get hated on because I’m not scientific enough, I just wanted to point out that a belief in God is fair if it doesn’t impede on other people, which I believe the Flying Spaghetti Monster is all about. Bobby Henderson didn’t create the FSM, stupid christians trying to shove religion into a place where it don’t belong did.
The grand canyon had no builder it was created by itself.
Are you saying its that tale Paul Bunya did it! HAHAHA!
Do you know anything man made that was not made by man. That is not an arguement, it’s retartedness followed by irrespinsible assumptions.
Yes to question 1 and 2, but not sure about 3.
For question 1: I visited a cave last month.
Question 2: Some hundred meters from where the cave was, there was some nice patterns in the rocks from when the ice drew back after the ice ages. Not unlike modern art, though way ahead of its time.
Question 3: Are the Japaneese humans? I am not sure about this, but they work a LOT, so something tells me they might be robots. But I am not sure about this one.
I built 50 houses of brick. Am I called Thomas the Bricklayer? No. I make 20 pies a day. Am i called Thomas the Piemaker? No. I saved 10 men from death. Am I called Thomas the Healer? No. But suck 1 single c*ck….
Dear Pastafarians,
Basil Baxter Loves You.
@Neal:
“Pleased to met you/Hope you guess my name”.
Please do not Remind Basil Baxter of that band. Try as he might, they refuse to die. (All but one, But Basil Baxter was not at the party, nor were a few hundred other people, apparently.)
“Never woulda guessed Basil Baxter. Somehow it seems way to pedestrian, like the humor on the webite. Plus, seems every time I go there, my computer locks up. Can you say malware? Tisk, tisk.”
Basil Baxter regrets the trouble you have accessing the website but has to deny any active wrongdoing on his part. It is a quite innocuous setup of Wordpress running on a LAMP server. Have you tried a sane browser, such as Opera or Firefox?
Basil Baxter has trouble grasping the concept of “humour”, he surmises it is, like “good”, “evil” and “aggravated assault”; a human construct to help them make sense of a world without a One True Friend.
“Does anyone believe Basil Baxter “Drove a tank, held a general’s rank/ When the blitzkreig raged and the bodies stank”?”
Basil Baxter has never driven a tank. In fact, this is one reason he killed Santa.
http://www.basilbaxter.com/31/basil-baxter-writes-to-santa/
“Evil should be more entertaining, far less derivative, and perpetrated by someone other than a wooden shod goth dutch boy.”
Again with the “Evil”… If it is Death and killing you are referring to, however, Basil Baxter would like to comment that he finds that those have an appeal that far outweighs mere entertainment.
Basil Baxter has encountered the Dutch on a few occasions, they did not seem that special. One does provide his domain hosting though, while another kindly provides a proxy. The actual servers, however, are in Australia where (Basil Baxter finds) the climate is far more suited to wholesale killing. At least the spiders are more amenable. As for the so-called Goth: Some Dutch Goth type persons are, indeed, quite agreeable, while others… well, let’s say it is best, if you find yourself in a Goth bar, to not drink the coffee.
“It turns out that while the city council turns a blind eye as long as the corpses are just pretending and will wake up the next morning with a hangover and a slight case of face-paint poisoning, it does take offence at an entire bar’s worth of dysfunctional teenagers actually turning out to be deceased.”
RedBearded Pirate
Apr 12th, 2008 at 11:39 pm
Of course, Henderob, we all believe that the …..
ahh Red? who do you think Henderob is? and you call yourself a pirate?
bah! time to chop off yer other hand….
There was nothing… Now there is everything what happend inbetween I don’t know. However there is a major flaw in your logic because it’s not that a house is created so on and so on it is rather that a house or car or painting is a compilation and reorganization of other materials. “Materials” rather it be a 2×4 or subatomic particles are for all intensive purposes MATTER!!! matter can not be created nor distroyed.
HERE IS WHAT I AM GETTING AT… the creation of all matter (what FSM did for us) is 100% diffrent from organizing matter to build an object.
If you don’t get it it’s ok. Have a highschool kid explain it at sunday school they would know.
Totally agreeing with Logical Sean.
Why not ask questions that are actually relevant.
ask us something like:
.
1. Do you know any rock that did not have a builder? Yes? No?
2. Do you know any Water that did not have a painter? Yes? No?
3. Do you know any species of animal that did not have a maker? Yes? No?
If you answered “Yes” to any of those statements… please give details:______________________…
.
Then we can say stuff like;
Yes, you dumbass, try Evolution for a change, and stop reading books that explicitly tell you that one dude and his family managed to knock out a 200*35*25metre ship in a few weeks and managed to get two of every animal (Seven of the clean species, even) on it, with food to last for forty days.
I do not believe that…
1. Caves: They offered shelter for animals and humans alike long before we were ever capable of building structures like buildings.
.
2. Ever seen a sunset? That beautiful painting comes every day and no human ever took a brush to it.
.
3. Who needs a car when you have feet. This was a natural feature that many creatures developed over time as land became a primary habitat.
.
And just to say - your little attempt at sarcasm is ridiculous. When you can prove using scientific method that there is a god then you can denounce my belief. Until then feel free to believe what you will and let me be.
.
p.s. Do you know any being to exist without a creator? If you answered no, then please explain the nature of god’s existence. If you cannot or you believe he has always been then accept the fact that this is not enough of a ‘fact’ for me and again let me be.
.
May His noodly appendages touch you
Most of you probably remember a moment in school, say, math class, where you finally GOT a concept, but it still escaped your fellow student, Joe. “How can ‘i’ squared equal negative one?” Joe would ask. “How can “i” equal anything?” he’d spout in a rising tone, the desperation evident in his voice.
You probably spent several minutes trying to explain it to Joe, and you may have even interrupted your instructor (who probably paused patiently, to allow you the chance to explain). If Joe then got the concept, it was because you were first able to bridge the conceptual disconnect, and helped him along the same bridge.
If he still didn’t get it, he probably hasn’t to this day, and likely never will.
Don’t spend too much energy on those who can’t see the forest for the trees. It just raises your own blood pressure, and probably disconcerts the hell out of the entire Pinaceae family.
Please see false dichotomy, and or straw man, because cars, paintings, and buildings are not in any way related to organic chemistry, or the laws of nature.
may the peace and love of His Noodly Goodness shine down
on your Home Depot!
“There was nothing… Now there is everything what happend inbetween I don’t know. However there is a major flaw in your logic because it’s not that a house is created so on and so on it is rather that a house or car or painting is a compilation and reorganization of other materials. “Materials” rather it be a 2×4 or subatomic particles are for all intensive purposes MATTER!!! matter can not be created nor distroyed.
HERE IS WHAT I AM GETTING AT… the creation of all matter (what FSM did for us) is 100% diffrent from organizing matter to build an object.
If you don’t get it it’s ok. Have a highschool kid explain it at sunday school they would know.”
Basil Baxter could not agree more. Basil Baxter Loves You. But do explain then why some people take such offense at killing. After all; it is merely an act of reorganizing matter into, often, more pleasing patterns.
Is “God did it” really a better answer than “I don’t know”?
Buildings, paintings, and cars are all man-made my simple friend. The earth and everything upon it, including man, are the result of Nature. Just as this planet was formed from the dust of space without any creative hand nudging it, man evolved from the dust of this planet without your god. Man, the creator of god…and what a terrible thing we’ve done. Like the drunk party guest who won’t leave. An annoyance, a burden, a liability. Go play in the street too little buddy.
Obviously a bad analogy…
Buildings, paintings, and cars do not reproduce by making slightly different copies of themselves. Those copies do not go on to reproduce themselves - or not - based on their survival, suitability to their environment, and other identifiable factors.
Evolution is such a simple, beautiful, logical - and most importantly, demonstrably true - explanation for the appearance and variety of life on Earth. Why do people have trouble understanding it? Is our educational system that bad?
Do you know a plant that doesn’t have a maker? Yah. A couple. They’re genetically made by humans. Do you know the smartest person ever? Who was an athiest? Einstien. If you are going to try to use logic, you probably shouldn’t do it in d