“Billions of years ago, a big bang produced a large rock. As the rock cooled, sweet brown liquid formed on it’s surface. As time passed, aluminum formed itself into a can, a lid, and a tab. Millions of years later, red and white paint fell from the sky and formed itself into the words “Coca Cola… 12 fluid ounces.”Of course my theory is an insult to your intellect, because you know that if the Coca Cola can is made, there must be a maker. If it is designed, there must be a designer. The alternative, that it happened by chance or accident is to move from the intellectual free zone.
Here is another:
“The Banana: The Atheist Nightmare”
Note that the banana…
1. is shaped for the human hand.
2. has a non-slip surface.
3. Has outward indicators of it’s inward contents. Green - too early, yellow - just right, black - too late.
4. Has a tab for removal of it’s wrapper.
5. Is perforated on wrapper.
6. Has a bio-degradable wrapper.
7. Is shaped for the human mouth.
8. Has a point at the top for ease of entry.
9. Is pleasing to the taste buds.
10. Is curved towards the face to make the eating process easy.
To write that the banana happened by accident is even more unintelligent than to write that no one designed the Coca Cola can.
Test 1.
The person who thinks the Coca Cola can has no designer is:
A. Intelligent
B. A fool
C. Has an ulterior motive for denying the obvious
Now the document that I am referring from states that the eye has 40,000,000 nerve endings and focuses it’s muscles approximately 100,000 times a day. and that the eye has a retina that contains approximately 137,000,000 light sensitive cells.
The document continues and states that Charles Darwin stated:
“To suppose that the eye could have been formed by natural selection, seems I freely confess, absurd in the highest degree” Agreed… it does not have the reference recorded so I do not know if this statement is true or false. But let me get to the point at hand.
If man can not create the human eye then how can anyone in their right mind believe that it was created by chance? In fact… man can’t create anything from nothing… we just do not know how to do it. We can re-create, reform, develop… but we can not create one grain of sand from nothing. Yet the human eye… is a mere tiny part of the most sophisticated part of creation - the human body.
Again… another statement which I would have to research and verify if this person actually made this comment:
“George Gallup; “If I could prove God statistically; take the human body alone; the chance that all the functions of the individual would just happen, is a statistical monstrosity.”
Now this statement concerning Albert Einstein. This is confusing… why would this man contradict himself? If he stated this… then every other statement that has been quoted at this forum is invalid because the man appears to be speaking from both sides of his mouth. In this statement Einstein is quoted to have said:
“Everyone who is seriously interested in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the universe - a spirit vastly superior to man, and one in the face of our modest powers must feel humble.”
Test 2:
1. Do you know any building that did not have a builder? Yes? No?
2. Do you know any painting that did not have a painter? Yes? No?
3. Do you know any car that did not have a maker? Yes? No?
If you answered “Yes” to any of those statements… please give details:______________________…
Third analogy:
Could I convince you that I dropped 50 oranges onto the ground and then by chance fell into ten rows of five oranges? Logically, anyone with an intelligent mind might conclude that someone put them there. The odds that ten oranges would fall into a straight line is mind boggling. Let alone ten rows of five.
Test 3
Yes or No 1. From the atom to the universe is there order?
Yes or No 2. Did it happen by accident or must there been an intelligent mind?
3. What are the odds of 50 oranges falling by chance into ten rows of five oranges? ______________________________…
To declare that there is no God is to make an absolute statement. And for an absolute statement to be true; one must have absolute knowledge. Here is another such statement: “There is no gold in China.”
Test 4 What would I need to have for that statement to be true?
A. No knowledge of China?
B. Partial knowledge of China?
C. Absolute knowledge of China?
“C” is the correct answer. In order for the statement to be true, I must know that there is no gold in China.
Likewise; to state that there is no God and to be correct then you are stating that you are omniscient. You must have absolutely certain knowledge that there isn’t one.
Let’s say that a circle contains all the knowledge of the universe. And let’s say that you have an incredible understanding of one percent of all that knowledge. Is it possible that the knowledge you haven’t yet come across, that there might be ample evidence to prove that God does indeed exist?
If you are reasonable, you would have to admit, “Having the limited knowledge I have at present, I believe that there is no God.” In other words, you don’t know if God exists, so you are not an atheist. You are an “agnostic.” You are like a person that looks at a building and doesn’t seem to know if there is a builder.
Test 5 The man who sees a building and doesn’t know if there is a builder is:
A. Intelligent
B. A fool
C. Has an ulterior motive
In summary: There are plenty of things that we have faith in that we do not fully understand. Most of us do not have a complete understanding that when you turned your computer on as to why it worked. You took a step of faith that turning it on… that somehow that it would work. You accept the unseen electrical waves that appear right in front of your eyes when you type your comments here. We do not see the reason for why the messages appear… because the powers that be are invisible to the naked eye. For them to be manifest, we need a monitor… so we can enjoy the experience of this forum.
God is not flesh and blood; He is an eternal Spirit. Immortal and invisible… like the computer waves. He can can not be experienced unless the monitor is turned on. One should approach the Bible in the same way as the monitor. If it works, enjoy it and if it doesn’t, forget it.
Or do you have an ulterior motive? Could it be that the “atheist” can’t find God… as a thief can’t find the policeman? Could it be that your logic is clouding your good judgment?”
-Jonathon
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An elaborate spoof on Intelligent Design, The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is neither too elaborate nor too spoofy to succeed in nailing the fallacies of ID. It's even wackier than Jonathan Swift's suggestion that the Irish eat their children as a way to keep them from being a burden, and it may offend just as many people, but Henderson, described elsewhere as a 25-year-old "out-of-work physics major," puts satire to the same serious use that Swift did. Oh, yes, it is very funny. -- Scientific American
Misc.
Test 1: Of course, there’s a designer. Where do you think Coca-Cola plants got the idea from?
Test 2:
1. No.
2. No.
3. Yes. Unless you count a fog as a maker…
Test 3:
1. There is never order, thus constant chaos.
2. Not on accident, it just happened. No intelligent mind, just actions occuring. Ever heard of the Big Bang? Don’t think there’s a mind behind that.
3. Pretty darn good. Imagine if you were a midget, or you were stooping. You could drop them and make ten rows of five.
Test 4:
1. C. In order to be correct, you’d need quite a bit of information about China, as well as some proof. And here’s your proof. If there is a God, may he smite you now. You still alive? Thought so.
Test 5:
1. A. Did the planets have makers?
And for your final points, of course it works, nothing is immortal, and I’m pretty sure I’m nnot running from God, like a thief is from a policeman, because he doesn’t exist. The only true god is the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
The connections you are making have nothing to do with whether there is a god or not. Thus, what you say is meaningless, anyone can make connections to things such as, “there is water, there for god cant exist” (hey, im pretty good at this, how bout another =).) There is no proof that god exist, and saying ” prove me wrong ” does not make you right, even if you think you are… There is a likeness of our god among us, You see pasta most every day. So, as i see it, we have more proof =), prove me wrong =D.
you know what else a banana is good for? it fits in you vagina.
I love the fact that most people on here seem offended by this person’s apparent lack of reason and logic, and yet when I attempt to challenge people on here and try to enter into logical discourse, I am ignored. A sign of hypocrisy? Perhaps…
I always wonder where these ‘Intelligent Design’ weenies think their god came from. Surely such a complex & powerful being had a creator. Could it be… the Flying Spaghetti Monster?
Seems to be a much more likely explanation than the old theory that it’s “Turtles all the way down, young man!” (look it up at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turtles_all_the_way_down :-), though even that is more cosmologically satisfying than the argument that “the universe was created by god, but god’s just always been there”.
I’ve always enjoyed reading ID “arguments from incredulity”, in which they claim that there must be a god because they can’t imagine it being otherwise. Wonder if my Dynamics prof in college would have bought that argument… “I don’t see why you marked this answer wrong; I can’t imagine the world working other than as I’ve shown it”. It’s a shame that the ID crowd continues to poison their kids’ minds with this kind of illogical drek. As long as they do we may never manage to move our average level of cultural maturity beyond its current 19th century level.
But there is room for hope; after all, they almost never try to burn witches anymore, and most of them admit that the earth isn’t flat and that it’s not the center of the universe. It’s only a short jump from there to admitting that they’re venerating the substantially edited wisdom of bronze age shamans, and that their own beliefs are roughly on the same level as the ‘pagan’ gods they look down their nose at.
There’s a very simple answer to your banana argument: artificial selection.
“You took a step of faith that turning it on… that somehow that it would work.”
Well, no, not really. I was reasonably certain that the computer would not explode when I turned on the computer, and I had seen the computer turned on several times, and it worked, without exploding, therefore I turned it on, assuming that it would work because it always had. There was no faith involved. I assume that I’ll wake up in the morning, but I don’t “have faith” that I’ll wake up in the morning. I assume that I’ll wake up in the morning because I’ve woken up thousands of other times.
“1. Do you know any building that did not have a builder? Yes? No?
2. Do you know any painting that did not have a painter? Yes? No?
3. Do you know any car that did not have a maker? Yes? No?
If you answered “Yes” to any of those statements… please give details:______________________…”
Imbedded in your argument is the conclusion “The universe was created by a deity.” This is what we call circular logic.
To prove there is no gold in China I must 1st take the statement posed to be meaningful. It is. I know gold exists; I have a wedding band on my finger. I’ve not been to China but all the evidence I’ve seen seems to support its existence. Now I am willing to execute the proof.
How is that proof parallel to the statement that god does not exist in the universe? You would have to first prove to me that god exists, as gold does, for the premise of the proof to be valid. But you are attempting to prove god’s existence by proving that this statement is false. Your lack of logic is stupefying. According to your logic, the statement that the FSM does not exist in the universe proves the existence of His Noodliness. Brilliant!
Your logic also leads you to believe that everything has to have a designer. But your logic does not lead you to believe that god himself had a designer. If you are willing to abandon your logic at all, why not abandon it at the level of the known universe, and believe that it did not have a designer? In abandoning your logic you are forced to CREATE a god that fits the bill - eternal, intelligent (whatever that means in our pitifully limited minds), immutable, etc. Unfortunately, you’ve merely DEFINED your expectations of god, not proved his existence.
one word……idiot!!
I’m 17 years old and i know not to compare the creation of MAN-MADE-MATERIALS to the creation of Earth and evolution….if you saying that because a man invented coca~cola…the earth couldn’t be the result to a collision that after millions and millions of years…the sun melted the frozen surface..which led to condensation…which led to fertilization…etc…etc…then YOU are the one messed up here!! i usually respect peoples believes….but when someone tries to sound smart…with no knowledge or accurate facts of the subject with intension’s of insulting mine…it really bugs me! ohhh…and the banana thing….lets see …if “god” really gave it thought to make it easier for us to eat and peal a fruit…then why am i wasting my time eating watermelon…hurray!!! to the gift of a easy-peal-&-eat-penis-shaped fruit!!!
Dumbass.
Humans breed bananas to produce the outcome that you find in grocery stores. The ones you find in wild jungles are much smaller and less tasty.
Go educate yourself, then come back.
here’s a paradox for you. You say everything has a maker right? if god built the universe, who made god? Last time I asked this question I was told he always existed. So why is it the universe couldn’t have always existed? And if there is someone who made god then who made his/her/it’s maker? and so on. cause this paradox goes on and on for who is who’s maker so it has no end. or if you take the simple way out and say he just always been there. How can you mock people who believe the universe has always existed?
Did this guy ever come back and reply to any of our arguments?
.
If not what is the point of repeating them over and over again?
.
RAmen
@ James
Mar 25th, 2008 at 4:21 pm
“15. A more accurate statement for Test 4 would be- There is no gold floating around in outer space. It’s called common sense.”
Actually, there is gold in outer space. Every element that exists naturally on earth has to exist in space. However, there is probably no china in space. Not counting Chinese astronauts.
RAmen
Statistically, in a twice infinite universe (infinite in size, infinite in time), EVERYTHING can happen.
Being an atheist is not about believing firmly there is no god, it is not considering theories that are not supported by any evidence. Like god, the elves, ESP, and the Flying Spaghetti Monster. You do not need an evidence to not believe in god, you need evidences to believe. Evidences we do not have.
If you are honest with yourself, maybe believing that there is “something” that created everything is legitimate, but, certainly not the god from the bible. Because there have been many, many, many other relgions, and there still are. And there isn’t a reason to believe that this one is the right one. Actually, quite to the contrary. If the bible was true, then the new and old testaments would not contradict each other. A being as all-knowing as “god” would not change his mind about the essential reality. And he would not have waited 30 000 years to manifest it.
If there has been an “intelligent designer”, we have no clue of who he is. We don’t know if he cares about what we do (why would he?). We don’t know if he still exists. We don’t know if he’s one, two or many more. We don’t know how he acts, where he is, if he still acts, if he’s got a goal, if he’s nice or mean… So, not knowing any of this, why waste time with him?
PS: by the way, why did the intelligent designer make nuts so hard to crack, couldn’t he just do with every fruit like he did with bananas?
Why can’t you leave our religion alone? Do Christians (and others) have to attack any religion that’s not their own? And the one thing wrong with your theory is that it is not proven that God created us. It could just as easily have been the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
I think I’ll answer each of these points one by one.
“The Banana: The Atheist Nightmare”
Note that the banana…
1. is shaped for the human hand.
So are rocks. Besides, if your God really wanted perfect hand-held bananas, they’d be much more handy.
2. has a non-slip surface.
So do rocks. :P
3. Has outward indicators of it’s inward contents. Green - too early, yellow - just right, black - too late.
So are rocks- wait, crap.
No arguments here, it does indicate what’s inside by color. Of course, that’s all nutrient-based and stuff.
4. Has a tab for removal of it’s wrapper.
Are you kidding? I usually have to whack that bit off with a knife, the stem’s a bitch to peel off without mushing up the top a bit.
5. Is perforated on wrapper.
Um, what.
6. Has a bio-degradable wrapper.
So does your mom. ‘S true, think about it.
7. Is shaped for the human mouth.
Wait, shaped for the mouth AND the hand? Make up your mind.
8. Has a point at the top for ease of entry.
So you think cylinder-shaped bananas would disprove your god’s existence.
9. Is pleasing to the taste buds.
Depends who you ask. Just because something has the right chemical formula, doesn’t mean everyone loves to eat them.
10. Is curved towards the face to make the eating process easy.
That curve could poke an eye out.
AND SO THE BRAVE PIRATE HATH VERILY OWNED THE HEATHEN, AND ALL REJOICED IN A GRAND FEAST OF CARBS. RAMEN.
First of all even though the chance of it happening would be so slim it is nearly impossible (Which just so you know means that it is still possible) throwing around all of the atoms that make up everything yes a coke can full of coke painted with the logo and having an easy to open tab could be formed with out someone purposely making it. Second the banana, just because you find it tasty and perfect for your diet doesn’t mean it is divinely crafted. I know quite a few people who hate the flavor and even some who are allergic to it. The building question depends on what actually is defined as a building. There are many caves that have tunnels and catacombs that were carved out by wind and water and are and were used as houses and places of business. I know you would argue well the creator is God but to say that shows how stuck on your faith you are. If you don’t understand it or if you can’t think of anything else that could have caused it well then you will say it was in a god’s name.
-“George Gallup; “If I could prove God statistically; take the human body alone; the chance that all the functions of the individual would just happen, is a statistical monstrosity.”-
Well of course it is a monstrosity. If I could prove that anything happened exactly that way everything the same and no detail left out and then calculate that it would happen again the exact same way it would seem almost impossible.
-Likewise; to state that there is no God and to be correct then you are stating that you are omniscient. You must have absolutely certain knowledge that there isn’t one.-
I don’t know if you thought about it the other way but to say that there is for a fact a god would require the same omniscient quality as denying him.
The Worshiper’s nightmare.
“Fine everything is so complicated it requires a creator. This creator must be pretty complicated….so did he just happen or did someone make him to, cause that is who I want to worship.”
On the same note to say he always existed is a horrible argument if that were the case it would be like admitting that life could have always existed.
Is it really that hard for people to think hey I am here and it could have happened this way so who knows?
I don’t now if FSM is real but I know spaghetti taste better then those wafers at church.
It is also known that monkies( the primary consumer of bananas) open them from the bottom because it’s easier and not from the “easy open tab”
let’s use real facts and not just make them up…
I don’t know if anybody’s said this:
The banana argument was made by Kirk Cameron (of Growing Pains fame) after he got hooked up with that fundamentalist guy. Their group is, I believe, called “The Way of the Master”. It didn’t make sense to me then either…
Also, when you choose to breed bananas that are made for the human hand, perfectly yellow, a nice filling size, and have a wonderfully long stem, they are INDEED perfect for human consumption. But we did that, not a deity.
And besides, these kinds of things happen in nature too. Things that work with their environment better live to reproduce. If a fruit is very, very tasty, more animals will eat it. Those seeds are then more widely distributed in animal droppings, a wonderful fertilizer to be sure, and more plants are made. It’s a very slow process. Rome wasn’t built in a day, you know.
But then, if the earth is only 6,000 years old, what do I know right?