I don’t understand why you all hate God. Why don’t you believe He exists? I read in an earlier message that the Bible is filled with historical errors. Actually, it is very historically accurate. Christianity has been around since the beginning of time - it just didn’t have the name Christianity. The belief in God was the very first religion, until man sinned.
-COG
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An elaborate spoof on Intelligent Design, The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is neither too elaborate nor too spoofy to succeed in nailing the fallacies of ID. It's even wackier than Jonathan Swift's suggestion that the Irish eat their children as a way to keep them from being a burden, and it may offend just as many people, but Henderson, described elsewhere as a 25-year-old "out-of-work physics major," puts satire to the same serious use that Swift did. Oh, yes, it is very funny. -- Scientific American
The FSM would kick your God’s ass. Want to fight about it for 2,000 years, heathen?
May the beer volcanoes bring you fresh, perfectly chilled beer.
If I were to posit myself a member of some group and wish to be respected, I would have a particular distaste for others who called themselves members who did things which I believed were not respectable.
While I can understand your vehement rejection of being associated with these others, you clearly choose to call yourself by the same name as they do. The other denominations also declare the differences and ask other people to read your entire mutual histories and understand them. Yet you use the same label and human curiosity has limitations.
There exist common fundamental issues which all Abrahamic religions fail to address by which I have yet to recieve adequate answers in spite of having personally educated hundreds of people to the point of choosing the potential of going to hell over living with the contradictions and contraindications.
As you profess yourself Christian, I shall focus the rest on you particular branch of the Abrahamic religion and perhaps you may see why I paint it with the same brush.
You say you believe in Kristos, which is the more enduring term for the concept of salvation by a savior deity. I assume you mean to believe in the merged concept, formed by the council of Nicea by emperor Constantine and the vote, rather than the older concept espoused by Prometheus, Horus, Krishna, Mithra, Dionysus, Attis, etc. who were also said to each bear several of the attributes of the merged form?
Then, may I ask, how are you certain that that particular emperor of Rome made the right choices? The Romans might argue it was because he was divine, but you clearly disagree?
Are you aware of the significance of the attributes of Kristos? Such as that December 25th is 3 days after winter solstice, the end of year? That, in the northern hemisphere the sun reaches the lowest point on December 22nd, stays dead for 3 days before it begins it’s ascent towards the azimuth of the sky? That the 3 wise men are the ancient names of 3 stars that shine most brightly every year on December 22nd? Are you also aware that the 12 apostles refer to the constellations and division of time? The “end of the jaguar, age of aquarius” etc. due to change in 2011/12. The halo represents the sun’s corona, as Kristos happens to be the sun deity.
These are but tidbits of information well known to atheists, do you indeed know your deity personally?
If I may, the more ancient form of Kristos imply that December 25th is not the celebration of Kristos’ birth, but it’s rebirth. This is why I would hypothesize that it doesn’t matter that Jesus’ birthday was sometime between May and August - you celebrate it on the 25th.
I might argue that Jesus as a person is only ever documented in three unique sources between 0 and 50 AD, one is so vague as to only mention “a man had caused a ruckus when he rode into town on a donkey”. Another is the apologies of Pontius Pilate to the emperor of Rome. The third is thought to be aliased “Paul”. Nobody knows the original authors name, but he was thought to have started writing at great length after 50AD.
Of note, post-infant life expectancy was roughly 30-60 years, probably closest to 45 years. Literacy rates at the time were roughly 1-5%, probably closest to 2% and I don’t recall any of the disciples being scribes, accountants or nobility at the time.
Patiently awaiting your reply,
Daniel
Darkcitymedia said “The focus of Christianity is friends, family, and community.”
Really? Because I kind of thought the focus of Christianity is Jesus. I think he thought that too, which is why he said:
Luke 14:26
If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.
@pastafari
So true, /agree
RAmen
Pluveus,
There are just as many Democratic Christians as Republican Christians, just like there are tons of Democratic Atheists as there are Republicans Atheists. Political agenda has very little to do about the topic at hand and anyone who views the Republican party as some zealot fueled religious organization is severely exaggerating the situation. Pat Robertson doesn’t have any governmental influence, as a matter of fact more republicans laugh at him and see him as a joke than any other political organization.
Further more, what does Crusades, Jihad, and Witch hunts have absolutely nothing to do with you at all. No Christian is trying to burn you at the stake and to use events of centuries past to perpetuate your own hatred and that of others is absurd. After the most recent event you have listed has take place, all the way to the present There have been over 100 military actions with not one having to do with Christianity at all. People have been killing people throughout history, long before Christianity ever came into existence and they were killing people after Christianity came to pass. So to even suggest that Christianity is the reason behind all the ills of this world is idiotic.
Thanks for acknowledging me as a great thinker, but the truth of the matter is that when you look at Fundamentalist Christians, only a fraction of them are true extremists. While another small fraction are those who leave these absurd hate messages all over the internet. If you want things to change, then stop using the same fear mongering used by many Christians and afterwards, let us deal with the problem. By 2030, Fundamentalism will be all but gone from this earth because just as many Christians are sick of it as Atheists and non-Christians. We are doing the best we can to reverse the wrongs and mistake caused by the KJV teachings. So go have a beer or something, lol.
Burndan23,
You don’t have the foggiest damn clue as to what I believe or as to what you’re talking about. Further more, having spent over a decade of research in the field of Theology, do you really think I a) Give a flying fuck about a religious opinion being pitched by video on YouTube. b) That video is going to say anything that I haven’t already heard. c) I am so weak minded that I find spiritual beliefs from pseudo-intellectual online sources.
There are 12 major demonimations of Christianity and over 3000 various branches of Christianity. None of them teach the exact same thing and not all of them teach Biblical Literalism and I am sure your YouTube video didn’t mention that, you wanker.
Orcodrilo,
I challenge my own beliefs all the time, just as many others. Further more, not every Christian sees the scripture as a historical document nor do they feel the need to prove that God exists, because the moment that God is proven, our choice faith becomes fear of ccnsequence and if it was proven that God didn’t exist on Saturday, I’d still be in Church the next day, because the Concept of God is only a fraction of Christianity.
Sean,
The only reason religion and science doesn’t coexist is do to people who dont know how to interpret one or the other.
Brendan,
Again, the Bible was never written as a historical document. It is a series of Parables, Songs, Poems, and Metaphors made of both symbolic and encrypted messages.
KraftDinner,
You obviously have trouble reading because I have clearly said that at least 10 times in this thread alone.
James,
Since you sent me an email, your response will be sent in a reply.
Daniel Lewis,
You’re use of numerology to to validate your suggestion is as absurd as numerology itself outside of the cryptic use.
Yahzi,
I don’t know if you understand English, but that verse advocates my point, not yours.
Hmm, really. i didnt know that the bible was historically accurate, i thought it talks about stuff that happened before anyone was around to see it. Science has proof, not a book of fair tails designed to keep people in order!
James,
I also want to publicly apologies for my harsh words towards you.
@Pluveus: Thanks for your message. That’s interesting about the three kinds of Pastafarians…so what inspires the “jaded Christians” who come here?
.
@Burndan23: You don’t believe in Jesus? Good for you. No one who’s carrying on a conversation now is trying to convert you (that I’ve seen). Believe what you want. Although your post concerns me a little. So “love your neighbor” is shit? Huh. “you obviously(correct me if im wrong) believe jesus died on the cross for us, etc. WE dont!” OK…like I said, good for you.
.
“i dont need to take the time to know what part you believe is true or not.” One might argue that I don’t need to take the time to know what you believe…in other words, I don’t really need to hear you announce that you don’t believe in Jesus.
.
“you give yourself away with the title christian.” I know you probably weren’t referring to me here, but I’ll respond: Yeah. I am a Christian. I “give away” that I worship Jesus. That’s not a secret, or I wouldn’t have announced it on the internet. I’m not ashamed to be a Christian, and if you respect me any less because I said that I am, you’re prejudiced. Bottom line is, your beliefs are as valid as mine, and mine are as valid as yours. I’m sorry if you’re unhappy with that.
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@Yahzi: “I kind of thought the focus of Christianity is Jesus. I think he thought that too, which is why he said: Luke 14:26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.” The focus of Christianity is the teachings of Jesus. This passage means that God has to be more important than anything else in a believer’s life. In Christianity, Jesus is considered to be God, so if Jesus is the most important part of one’s life, one must follow his teachings, which stress the importance of friends, family, and community. And taking quotes completely out of context is never a good method by which to attempt to understand them.
There’s enough annoying,self loving,bigoted,imposing,hate spewing,hypocritic,blind faithful people in the world as it is. in short i would rather burn in hell with the pagan hero’s of old then suffer in heaven with a bunch of holier then tho art asses. And if i remember correctly there were jews before there were christians and before jews there were pagans; so saying that Christianity was the first religion is pretty stupid considering jesus was born only 2008 years ago so are you saying that everything was created when jesus was born? Pray to your Vain Yaweh that i don’t find your stupid bigoted ass oneday.
‘Tar’ says:
“Anyway, I’ve been curious to figure this out, but if humanity started with two white people (Adam and Eve), where does Asians and Africans come from (as with other nationalities)? I doubt thin eyes and dark skin came out of nowhere.”
If Adam & Eve actually existed, who says they were white? Scientists believe humanity originated in Africa. And wasn’t Jesus (if he existed) of Middle Eastern descent?
Irate Pirate,
The Bible isn’t made up of Fairy Tales and the fact that you do is a testament to your intellectual and philosophical short-comings, they are symbolic verses with symbolic encryption which was used during a time of oppression, so they were authored as a means to pass on information.
So grow up.
Zach,
you should recite that quasi-diatribe while in front of a mirror.
LR,
What the hell are you talking about? No one has said that Jesus is white in this thread.
COG —
We don’t hate God. We all love the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Geez!
Rachel,
.
Thanks for your post. You said, “Beliefs cannot kill people. A “practice, a way seeing the world, the place of people and things in it and the relationship of one to the other” cannot kill people. Not to say that ideas aren’t important, but it takes people to act upon those ideas for them to have effects, positive or negative. Yes, Christians have done terrible things in the name of their religion. This is not the fault of Christianity itself (which is clearly a nonviolent religion), but the fault of human evil.”
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My point was that ideas have consequences. Beliefs have consequences. Religion is more than just a set of beliefs. As you quote me above, religion requires a “practice” - people to act upon the tenets of their religion. Simply believing does not make for a religion. Action is required. People do not just act “in the name of their religion.” Their actions may reflect their religion. It is unreasonable to maintain that when people are good, it is attributable to their religion, while when they are bad, it is the fault of human evil.
.
You said, “The Crusades, for example - if Christianity and Islam had never existed, those people would probably still have been killing each other for some other reason.” We don’t know one way or the other. We do know, however, that religious leaders used their religion as a means to incite believers to war on each other. And, believers acted on their beliefs to justify going to war, killing and being killed, themselves. This applied to both the Christians and Muslims.
.
You quoted me as stating, “The practice of many Christians has been, and often still is, to regard any deviation from their view of the world and “set of mortal virtues” as being displeasing to God, subjecting deviants to eternal damnation if they do not change their ways. I consider this to be evil, in itself.” Although you may not like it, this is what a very large number of people believe that God has told them (through the Bible). To them, that is the truth. Period. It would be wrong for them to treat members of another religion as inferior, naturally, but if they simply believe that others are wrong, what harm does that do to anyone else?
.
You are right that believing, by itself, does no harm. The point I have been trying to make is that people do act upon their beliefs. You said that, “It would be wrong for them (Christians) to treat members of another religion as inferior…” Yes it would, but there are so many examples of “well-meaning” Christians acting on such beliefs with terrible consequences that it fills many books. The “mission system” of colonization by the Catholic Church in the seventeen and eighteen hundreds in the New World that enslaved and deprived native Americans of their culture and religion easily comes to mind. I could go on, but I am sure you get the idea.
.
One point of clarification, before your or anyone else gets the idea that I am writing about only Christians, please understand this. I view all “True Believers” as the problem. Anyone who claims to have “The Truth” should not be trusted. He/she is the most dangerous.
.
The knowing the questions is always more important than knowing the answers.
.
RAmen
Sounds like somebody doesn’t like reading that their perspectives are
unlikely to be correct.
Despite the fact that there have been many terrible atrocities done by humans
against other humans that may not have been directly attributed to a fundamental
religious scripture does not change the fact that the proponent mechanizing forces
are ALWAYS driven by their conscious and unconscious beliefs. Many of the current
atrocities are committed for the purpose of economic gain; if not fully to change the
economic systems of an unwilling general populace by those who feel their
interpretation of reality and constructive capability exceeds those of the citizens who
make the contribution to their corresponding systemic belief.
The danger word is ‘belief’. This entitles a common thought that is immune to
persuasion from outside influences. For our survival, at least, this is a dangerous
propoal to adhere to. Why have ‘belief’’s when you can have ‘idea’’s, whether they
be good or bad; contructive of destructive, astute or retarted in comprehension; they
allow for changed as experience is percieved, (experienced).
Religious doctrines base truth of reality on very outdated primary sources that
were likely written by DMT-rich denizens, or entirely dangerous schizophrenics, as you
see fit through reading. Science does less, but often evidence is formed around the
theory as opposed to the theory being fit to the evidence. This is a dangerous rationale.
The Big Bang theory currently accepted is a good ‘non-religious’ example. Many scientists
are trying to fit their data to the theory as opposed to actually keeping objective standpoint.
This doesn’t mean the data is wrong, much of it is quite consistent with current objective
findings; but when one bases their beliefs around something they percieve to be reality,
regarless of evidence for such an ideas credence to truth/reality, they are making the same
mistake that makes many of us scared to wake up in the morning with the possibility of
being killed by Judaic/Islamic/Chrisian warriors who value their lives so little that they
are willing to spin the high-roller table with hope that they will be rewarded in an afterlife
that NONE of them have evidence of, aside from compromising documents that give
virtue to hartred based on abstract thought and have provided a good scenery for the
worst examples of human nature to EVER BE REALIZED IN THE ENTIRETY OF OUR
HISTORY AS A SPECIES CAPABLE OF UNDERSTANDING SUBJECTIVE PAIN.
I may not be qualified as a religious or philosophical scholar, but I have legally died twice.
Both times from unintentional drug overdose using prescribed substances. I do remember what
happened during my “deaths”, as vague as it was, I remember a sense very similar to
that which was there before I was born into this state as a human. I value my life. I value my life
enough to be able to tell people that have been important to me in this life that I love them, and to
then support them. There is a real higher power, and this power is not represented in ANY
currently accepted ‘HOLY’ documents. As soon as such a thing claims infalliablility, it looses any
credentials one may believe/accept.
But I would not trade my life for the destructruction of the human species in hope of better later…
once it’s way, way, way, way too late for myself. Possibly for everyone else.
~Monk
nudemonkei@nc.rr.com
May all of us one day live in a unity that current systems of faith
I don’t hate God. Hating something that doesn’t exist makes no sense at all. I also don’t hate people with faith. I just don’t agree with them.
I do get slightly annoyed by the introduction of unnecessary emotion into the whole issue. Why does it have to involve love or hate or any other emotion? Why can I not rationally and calmly hold a different opinion?
Christianity is not the oldest religion. It’s the second youngest of the major religions (I’m discounting scientology and th other weird cults for the purposes of this post). In fact, there is a strong case that it’s not really a religion of its own at all. The mythology is basically Jewish and the philosophy is a blending of Jewish and Buddhist ideas which all predate Christ. Christ didn’t really say anything that hadn’t already been said by Moses or Buddha.
Moses said - worship good and follow his rules and you’ll get into heaven
Buddha said - stop worrying about how rich you are and try to be nice to other people and you’ll live a good life
Jesus said - er, yeah, what those guys said
Ah. religious people. It took them 40 years to cross the desert which would be crossed (even in that time) in 10 days (yeah, I’m talking about Moses leading “chosen people”).
Should I say anything more about them?
@Darkcitymedia
We have the same amount of evidence for existance of Jesus as for existance of FSM.
And religions ARE about gods. And worshiping them. If your parents were brainwashing you since you were born with religion, it’s really hard to see something beyond things you were brainwashed to see.
I was raised in that way. When I reached thinking age, I grow up and tossed the religion aside; everything was against it. It was kind of opening your eyes and realizing that you can see.
I have no problem with religion, but when morons want to make ID science, I must ask why?
ID is science as much I am planet.
I love retards who say that our world is too complex to appear naturally, and take that as an argument for ID. That’s just retarded. If we’re too complex to appear naturally, then how god appeared out of nothing when he is more complex than us? He appeared naturally? Then, there can be many gods. Then if something that complex can appear naturally how can’t we? God was always there? For all we know time doesn’t exist outside our universe, so God couldn’t been there always before he created time?
“Religion is considered by common people as true, by wise as false and by rulers as useful.”
OPosum,
No, actually you don’t have the same amount of evidence for the existence of the Galilean Teacher Jesus who is the symbolic message in the New Covenant gospels as you do for FSM. I can’t provide historical documentation that Jesus was the conduit of miracles which is stated in biblical scripture, but I can provide documentation of his existence at the time claimed.
Further more, no deities are nothing more than celestial enforment of morals established by religion, while religion itself is centered around the moral virtues and community which choose to follow and practice the virtues and rituals associated with the morals.
Next, no one has brain washed me, I took the time to educate myself and provide myself with the necessary tools to investigate my beliefs before I adopted my beliefs. While you just tossed the literalist interpretation you were provided for science. Therefore your thought and consideration on the matter went no further than the primal consideration of fundamentalists, which alone places question on your personal scientific understanding.
If you were unable to spot the symbolism and encrypted teachings provided in the original gospels, while unable to utilize gematria and all other encrypted legends to decipher these teachings…
then the only retard you’ve identified is yourself.
Darkcitymedia,
Thanks, I don’t think I received a reply, sorry, just no ID in schools. Religion is cool it can just be used to control people sometimes. Which I guess I’m apart of now. Whatever, thanks, sorry for my cursing, I just do that kind of thing. I still disagree with you.
-J.T.S.