I just came across your website through digg.com. At first I was intrigued and happy that a group was standing up for teaching pure science in schools. However after reading what FSM was supposedly about and then reading many of these posts, I see FSM is no better than the religions you are bashing, your posters/members sit in high judgment over religious people, demeaning them for their beliefs. Now I am an actual scientist, with a B.S. in Physics and a M.S. in Physics, however I have spiritual/religious beliefs.Here is my final point, stick to fighting the good fight to keep science in schools and make sure it is not replaced with absurd ID, I say this believing a God created the universe and let evolution run its course.
Stop bashing other people’s faiths and assuming they are ignorant because they have a faith, and stop making your atheism a religion onto itself.
-sty
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An elaborate spoof on Intelligent Design, The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is neither too elaborate nor too spoofy to succeed in nailing the fallacies of ID. It's even wackier than Jonathan Swift's suggestion that the Irish eat their children as a way to keep them from being a burden, and it may offend just as many people, but Henderson, described elsewhere as a 25-year-old "out-of-work physics major," puts satire to the same serious use that Swift did. Oh, yes, it is very funny. -- Scientific American
We try not to bash other’s religions unnecessarily. After all, the ideas that you’ve got a soul independent of your body or that some sort of man-in-the-sky watches and judges our every action are no less valid than our own beliefs. We have faith that ours are right, of course.
Sty,
Maybe it is late where you are but for a scientist you should be able to read the substance of most of these posts and understand what it is directed at. Most of the hate-mail comes from religious fundamentalists bashing us and telling us to go to hell. 99% of the time most of our comments are towards the poster not thee religion and yes most happen to be Christian. So I am surprised when you say we are bashing them when we are not the ones telling them they will go to hell. They claim to be good Christians yet their actions contradict the teachings of Jesus. So this in itself makes them ignorant. Having faith has nothing to do with it.
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I have no issue and many don’t have issue if someone has faith. To each it’s own as long as you do not try to push your belief system onto someone else. Most of the hate mailers are trying to do that with their abundant hatred toward non-Christians.
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We all agree science class should be science without any of the ridiculous ID crap in it. FSM is better than most because we are not going out to other websites saying that need to convert to Pastafarianism. We say the FSM loves all, believe if you want and if you do not that is alright too. Sometimes we may seem to sit in high judgment but look at the hate mail coming in. We have every right to defend ourselves and point out the shortcomings of the hate mailer, who probably come from the bible belt, live in a trailer park, and dropped out of school in the 3rd grade. Lately, they probably come from Florida where the debates with ID and evolution are taking place. It is no wonder there are so many voting issues in that state.
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In conclusion, I am happy to see you believe science is science and ID has no place in it. Please just realize that most of the comments you see are towards the people posting the hateful messages and use their religion as a right to be mean.
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Ramen!
“Stop bashing other people’s faiths and assuming they are ignorant because they have a faith…”
You totally missed the point. We are the ones who are bashed. Show me any other religious site that have a hate-mail section.
Sty, I do NOT bash people’s faith because i enjoy it or something like that. I bash bashers, people who tell me I’ll go to hell for not believing in whatever they believe in (in very bad English too). People like that piss me off and I let them know that. That’s all. But looking at their grasp of logic, language and general knowledge I am afraid that I am not far off in assuming the are ignorant fools.
*
I’m fine with you believing in a god. Go ahead, just leave me out of it and do not force it upon me in any way, form or shape. Thank you.
Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear. Sty tells us not to bash religions but is happy to talk about ‘absurd ID’. Wake up sty, ID is to you what christianity is to many of the frequent visitors here. And you’ve just called ID absurd, so you’re not bashing certain beliefs any less than we are. Welcome to the club. It’s wonderful, isn’t it, naming things what they really are. You do it, for the things you think are absurd. And so do we.
All religions have their share of people who’re quick to judge. Remember, His Noodliness doesn’t teach us that our religion is better than others, but rather than all religions are equal. Sure, some Pastafarians miss this important message, but hey, we’re all just humans here. I try to keep my posts moderate and only attack the arguments of people rather than their beliefs. I’ve yet to see someone attack *our* arguments, every hate mail is just bashing our beliefs for some reason.
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Also, most people here read the Bible and can produce actual arguments, how many haters do you think read the Gospel of FSM? We debate with poorly informed, misguided people here, no wonder it looks like bashing.
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I do believe as global education levels rise, all will be touched by His noodly appendage. Eventually.
We’re not bashing your religion. I’m even saying that your religion could be true.
But I’d like to add that our religion (that of the FSM) is just as probable to be true. They’re equaly valid.
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So I choose to believe that the FSM made the universe; until you proof he didn’t.
“However after reading what FSM was supposedly about and then reading many of these posts, I see FSM is no better than the religions you are bashing, your posters/members sit in high judgment over religious people, demeaning them for their beliefs.”
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Notice that the people that we do bash are the ones that visit this site and complain about how stupid the FSM is and what crack-smoking lunatics we are that don’t GET that there is a God that created us and has damned us to Hell.
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I can’t speak for everybody else, but I don’t run around pissing on other peoples churches, not in real life and not on the net. I don’t run around proclaiming that I have eaten your God and that I’m in the process of dumping him the toilet. And I don’t damn you to Hell for choosing another path than me.
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“Now I am an actual scientist”
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Then you should know better.
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“I say this believing a God created the universe and let evolution run its course.”
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To be honest, this is the dumbest thing I ever hear! Right along with “If English was good enough for Jesus, it’s good enough for Texas schoolchildren”.
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But to have asked the question, seeing as you are a scientist, an actual one at that, why do you need to stick a God on top of the Universe? Why do you introduce a creator, that is more difficult to explain, as a solution to a problem that is difficult enough? This does not help any, and as a scientist, you should know better!
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“Stop bashing other people’s faiths and assuming they are ignorant because they have a faith”
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Then stop coming here!
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“and stop making your atheism a religion onto itself.”
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How the Hell can atheism ever become a religion? That’s like non-astrologers not doing astrology, organized!
“Here is my final point, stick to fighting the good fight to keep science in schools and make sure it is not replaced with absurd ID, I say this believing a God created the universe and let evolution run its course.”
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Agreed! Except the FSM does occasionally change the evidence for the age of our rock around a bit.
Looks like astronomers may have recently discovered the FSM’s base hang out for creating.
Note especially how the Arp 220 galaxy even closely resembles our venerable Noodly One.
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Life-Forming Chemicals Found in Distant Galaxy
http://dsc.discovery.com/news/2008/01/17/galaxy-amino-acid.html
If you read the posts, then you MUST have seen how hateful or how derregatory most of them are towards us. So what if we get offended when people tell us the we are fucking morons and that we are going to hell. Wouldn’t you?
Sty,
Though I am a recent convert to his Noodlieness, I must say that my impression has been that those who could be perceived as bashing religion are more often then not pointing out the absurdity of certain people bashing this or any other faith. Asking why it is any more reasonable or logical that a beared old man created the universe then that a drunken Flying Spaghetti Monster did it is not bashing the faith of another in my view, merely pointing out the absurdity of intolerance.
RAmen
I’ve read many a posting on this site, and I be seeing no bashing of other religions. We be not bashing religion, but dogma in itself, yarr. We be not bashing you’re god, but you’re gods systems and beliefs!
RAMEN
I have spiritual beliefs, too!
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That said, people telling me my religion is wrong (as most hate-mails says) needs to be more sensitive to what they say. In short, we don’t begin the bashing; they do.
I felt like we were the victims of a demeaning email just now, as Sty was looking down his highly educated, scientific nose at me. Sty, we don’t proactively seek out the religious to attack and berate them. We simply defend ourselves once attacked, by the divine, such as yourself. And another thing, who are you to tell us what we can and cannot do with our atheism? Are you my mommy? By telling us to, “stop making your atheism a religion onto itself” aren’t you demeaning our religious beliefs and our points of view? Who are you to say that what we are doing is wrong or write? Hypocrites bother me the most, especially educated ones, because they should know better.
sty, sty, sty… if you would thoroughly read through the replies to the hatemail you would see that no one on this site is bashing anyone else’s religion, other than the christian hatemailers who bash our religion. all we do is defend ourselves and bash the individuals who bash us, not their beliefs. this has been pointed out repeatedly as well.
What you and other hate mailers call “bashing your religion” to us is merely “poking holes in your religion”. It’s true that some posters go over the line but there are many more that provide actual substance in their responses. If you don’t like it then don’t read it. You came to us.
Has “bashed” now become a technical term?
Sty,
It is refreshing to see someone literate on the hatemail page! Finally someone we can have a rational discussion with!
You must keep in mind that most of the hatemail is coming from those you are bashing us. I now I can only speak for myself, but when I start to “bash” I try to use their same arguments against them. I am not trying to bash, I am just trying to show what they are doing to me and try to point out the irony that is most of these hate mailers. They claim to be from a religion that promotes piece and freedom yet they come here and act like total hypocrites.
I would never walk up to someone and start hating on their belief in god. That’s not how I roll, but when they come swinging at me you better believe I am going to let them have it.
I think you completely overlook what is happening in the culture at large. Within that cultural context there exists a wholesale attempt by a well funded extremely vocal, intolerant, mendacious and extreme group of Christ following fundamentalists to implement a fascist fundamentalist theocracy. Don’t believe me, go to web sites like American taliban where you will read the thoughts of a number of prominent American clergy and lay types who believe that only Christians are entitled to full citizenship in a nation where everyone’s human rights are and have been guaranteed for better than 200 years by our constitution and bill of rights.
Read how the present president’s daddy believes that athiests should not be considered full citizens, read how the likes of Donald Wildmon talks about abolishing the bill of rights when Christianity prevails, read how some preachers want to tie the right to vote to membership in an established christian church, and read how others believe that they have a golden opportunity to train public school teachers so they can prostheletyze in the public schools- in other words use public resources to indoctrinate all children (even and perhaps especially the ones whose parents want no part of such indoctrination) in the tenets of christian fundamentalism.
In the face of all of this, it is hardly unreasonable for some of us to rise up and just say no. These people are fair game. To be honest, I have little problem with Christians who wish to quietly practice their beliefs, and are willing to allow others to practice what they believe-even is their beliefs and practices differ from their own.
But the idea that America is a christian nation, and anyone who believes differently is just a guest in Gerry Falwell’s and Pat Robertson’s reality, and is required to live by the rules of that reality, simply will not fly. Not only will it not fly, but those people can count on the fact that there will be plenty of people like me who will use the power of the marketplace of ideas fully–to rip them a new one.
People just miss the point so consistently, it’s truly amazing.