Florida evolution showdown - part 2 - Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster

Florida evolution showdown - part 2

Published by henderob January 20th, 2008 in Intelligent Design and General FSM news.

My Clay Sun has published a report on the recent Clay County School Board meeting:

Despite impassioned opposition from science experts, teachers and some clergy, Clay County School Board members unanimously resolved Tuesday night that evolution should be presented as a theory, and not fact, in the classroom.

The board passed a resolution, proposed by Superintendent David Owens, asking the Florida Department of Education to reword its newly proposed state standards, which presents evolution as “the fundamental concept underlying all of biology and is supported in multiple forms of scientific evidence.”

The Baker County, Florida, School Board approved a similar resolution a month ago.

The Florida State Board of Education is scheduled to vote Feb. 19th on proposed changes to state science standards.

Creationists will likely continue their campaign that evolution is “just a theory”, and as such should not be presented as fact. Their argument is that unless a theory has been “proved”, it is no more valid than any other theory. They don’t realize - or choose not to acknowledge - that most theories in science have not been “proved”, and it’s not the purpose of science to provide dogmatic proof of anything.

Scientists will likely continue to get worked up and make compelling logical arguments that will go right over the Creationists’ heads. They’ll not accept that appeals to logic don’t work on those who have abandoned logic for faith.

Here are some links if you’d like to read more.

My Clay Sun report on the Clay County School Board resolution

Florida Today article on the upcoming State School Board vote

Florida Citizens for Science coverage of the issue

We need to decide how we’ll proceed …

What should the Pastafarian response be?

168 Responses to “Florida evolution showdown - part 2”

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1 - January 20th, 2008 at 1:31 am - Dr Dagger Says:

Lots of people say “there’s no evidence either way so it must be equal probability” about God, but there’s no evidence that there isn’t an element that tastes exactly like chocolate, is green, one millilitre weighs the same as a car and is normally 5000 degrees celsius, so is it equal probability?
2 - January 20th, 2008 at 1:35 am - Atheist Pitbull Says:

This is showing social evolution, by destroying their own education system they are condemning their children to an inferior future. If creationists are so afraid of evolution their faith must not be very strong. This is simply ridiculous, we have to keep Florida from demeaning evolution like this or other states will begin to follow suit and they may even begin to attack the FSM ‘theory’ of life.

I am ready to contact any board member, freedom from religion group, news group, anyone to bring this situation to the front pages and let the sensible people take action.

-Will
-Atheist Pitbull
3 - January 20th, 2008 at 1:38 am - flyingspaghettiapostle Says:

To hell with the counties - go after the heart of the education system the school board itself!!! RAmen.
4 - January 20th, 2008 at 1:44 am - bald pirate Says:

it is more powerful weapon to make them look IDiots, than simply reject ID/crea bull***t
5 - January 20th, 2008 at 1:59 am - Benji Says:

I am afraid that we cannot do much. Our best hope is that people in florida will be concerned about it and work out together against this political crap.

RAmen, my friend, RAmen… this country is going as crazy as the world, as crazy as any God who would create it… I am so glad that I found here some people to understand that. HE (the FSM) necessarily created it by accident, or being drunk.

But no time to despair, let work for the next generation. We certainly need to increase visibility, whitout to get shot. Hard task.
6 - January 20th, 2008 at 2:06 am - You_don't_know_me Says:

Evolution is a theory as much as Gravity is a theory. When will they learn?

Anyways, I say we try and get our theory of creation included.
7 - January 20th, 2008 at 2:21 am - Stevo Says:

Such a shame. I agree that logical arguments can unfortunately go no where.

I obviously don’t live in Clay County, and I’m curious: do schools in that area have “World Religions” classes at any level of public education? Some variation of this class exists at the majority of Canadian high schools - is this the case in the States?
8 - January 20th, 2008 at 3:37 am - Brandon Says:

I am from Florida Citizens for Science. It is apparent that you folks had quite an effect on Polk County a while ago. With that in mind, I would recommend that you go ahead and take the same approach with the other counties and the state BoE.

Scroll down a bit on the FCS blog and you’ll see a post that lists darn near every single person and county that has come out as anti-evolution. Reference and contact information is all there for your use.

Thanks,
Brandon
9 - January 20th, 2008 at 3:53 am - Eric Says:

Looks like I’m going to have to re-mail my letter and start advocating others to follow suit

This is a horrible, spit-in-the-face at science.

I and embarrassed to live in Florida.
10 - January 20th, 2008 at 3:54 am - Theo Says:

The more people know they’re created by the FSM the better!
Because uhm… you know. It’s good.
11 - January 20th, 2008 at 5:13 am - Jerad Says:

Evolution IS ‘just a theory’.
.
But so is Creationism.
12 - January 20th, 2008 at 8:04 am - BlackBard Says:

Praise be to our Lord the Flying Spaghetti Monster! We have another chance to ensure that impressionable children are taught the truth about the origin of man. Maybe “evolution” is just a theory, but our explanation is a FACT, and should be taught along side those other “explanations.”
.
Let’s show support for the inclusion of alternate “theories” of the origin of man and the proliferation of species all over the world. What a glorious day!!
.
RAman
13 - January 20th, 2008 at 10:09 am - cabose Says:

Seriously, nothing scientific is ‘proved’ as science deals not with truth, and science is not a hierarchy. When somebody says that a theory is ‘just a theory’ because it ‘hasn’t been proved’ they are showing their ignorance of science as a theory isn’t a second rate speculation; it is a well studied, peer reviewed, and consistent explanation of something observed.

Example: Person A claims there is a dragon in his garage. Person B asks for verification. Person A claims that the dragon is invisible and cannot be felt. As the dragon has no means by which to observe it, it is not verifiable or falsifiable, meaning that it is not science’s realm to deal with.

In the same path, creationism cannot be placed under the class of science, as it is not science, not even pseudo science; it is nothing but speculation based not upon observation but faith. Faith is not wrong, but it is not scientific, and to believe it is is not only disrespecting science but disrespecting the basis of that faith itself is, in most cases, not up for scrutiny.

Sorry if I’m taking things a bit seriously, but I personally get really peeved when I hear of individuals bashing on rational, scientific reasoning ignorant of the meaning of the terms they use. The only word for such things is quite honestly bullshit.

If they cannot see what it is the science is, then they must agree to teach the ways of our Noodly Master, lest they feel his saucy wrath (i think they have a creme for that now).

May your pasta never cool,
RAmen
14 - January 20th, 2008 at 11:10 am - Kendrick Says:

It should remain as a theory. Evolutionary Theory is a theory because it can’t be proven. Theories cannot be proven. Hypothesis’ can be proven, but not theories. Once there is a hypothesis, we will see, but for now, there isn’t. On the flip side, all religious doctrines are false by nature (except FSMism of course). Evolutionary Theory should not be considered “fact” (until there is a written hypothesis with parameters) and religion should be kept in church.

“If religion is scientific enough to be taught in science class, then that must mean that science is spiritual enough to be taught in church.” - 2 Gryphon
15 - January 20th, 2008 at 12:38 pm - MoJo Says:

It is my understanding that evolution IS theory.
Perhaps my definitions are wrong, but a theory comes from a hypothesis (which ID has never been able to “evolve” from, pun intended) and the hypothesis is put to test, quantified, and recreated - all based on facts (water freezes at 32 F, humans develop from the combination of both parents genetic material, 2 + 2 = 4, etc).
Hence I do not see what the big deal if the school board wants to state that it is a theory. Or am I missing part of the story here?
Instead we should make sure that they begin to explain to kids (and adults) exactly what a scientific theory is. Every frustrating argument I have had with a creationist breaks down when they use the term “theory” to describe intuition and/or any loosely put together idea…
16 - January 20th, 2008 at 6:19 pm - Fred Flinstone Says:

Religion is a hoax

But Evolution still is just a theory, at least from a scientific point of view.
17 - January 20th, 2008 at 6:42 pm - Starbuckaneer Says:

A victory for Pastafarianism!!! Now we can spread The Good Word (and The Good Food) to little children.
18 - January 20th, 2008 at 6:51 pm - Starbuckaneer Says:

BY THE WAY!!!!! Florida will be 100% more Pastafarian in the next two weekends. It’s GASPARILLA!!!!! There will be a dramatic rise in Pirate activity. The children’s parade was yesterday — AND it’s already colder!!!! Coincidence? I think not. Next weekend is the big one with all the GROG and drunken wenches. FSM be praised.
19 - January 20th, 2008 at 8:08 pm - Landlubber Says:

Gaar. I guess the mounds of evidence supporting truth and rationality can’t get past centuries of indoctrination. And really, the change in wording isn’t that bad. Honestly, taking the word “theory” out of it may help avoid confusion. Perhaps we should lobby the Church to teach the (non-scientific) “theory” of creation.
20 - January 20th, 2008 at 11:10 pm - ☠DutchPastaGuy☠ Says:

On another website (arstechnica.com) I read another quote from one of these county board meetings that gives such a clear insight as to the level of scientific insight we’re up against:
.
“evolution is presented as one of several theories as to how the universe was formed.”
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When the YECs can’t distinguish between the origins of different life forms and the origins of the universe anymore, isn’t it time to rethink the place of the democratic process in determining science curricula?
One of the ancient Greeks once summed it up slightly arrogantly but very correctly:
.
“Democracy is a pain if you know better.”

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