I support your intent of countering the “intelligent” design “theorists” and their stealth efforts to bring in Creationism into the classroom (and kick out science). However, what’s this business of pirates vs. global surface temperature. Sure, you make a point that there’s a difference between correlation and causation. Perhaps you’re trying to point out that the true cause of GW may not be man-made green-house gas emissions. Well, the scientists have studied this problem and have come to the conclusion that it is. Please don’t give with one hand and take with the other. You support the scientists in Darwinian evolution and on the other hand don’t in GW science.
I suggest you remove your references to pirates and global surface temperature (your curve does look compelling though).
Regards,
Alan
[A response: No deal, Alan. I tend to agree with the Global Warming hypothesis, and I certainly think it makes sense to err in that direction whether or not you agree with it - I’m all for conservation and green technologies. But, there is an almost religious type of dogma surrounding the Global Warming issue that makes me uncomfortable. Global warming is probably happening, but that is a world apart from saying it is Truth that must be supported. I’m against dogma and a priori reasoning, not any specific beliefs. -bobby]
@ John
ooo! ooo! pick me!!! I have a term for clusters of millions of years!!
it could be “a really wicked lot” of years!!
pretty cool, huh?
mmm, only two nights till spaghetti night at my house…
@john (who reminds me of ‘pb’ on a certain British blog?)
You really are full of it, aren’t you? There’s really no point in debating it seems when you follow up your original post of gaffes with new gems like ‘the plant population and the human population are inversely proportional’. So just after the first humans appeared there must have been almost infinitely many plants then? (sorry that the math of this one is so far over your head)
Or the truly magnificent statement about Newton and Einstein saying ‘He originally proposed a notated theory which Albert Einstein later cleaned up to E=mc2 where E represents the energy-mass conversion, m= the mass, and c= the speed of light.’. Try this one in your local pub this Friday night when your buddies have had a good number of pints. Then they may swallow it. The Pastafarans on this site however aren’t so dumb.
What’s this i hear about pirates and GW?
When i first learned of Pastafarianism, I, being an athiest, of course, jumped at the idea of a group that actually sticks up for science, but this whole pirate - GW thing has effectively turned me off to pastafarianism. I just don’t see how a group that holds the beliefs of the scientific community can dismiss GW in such a rude and heedless manner.
You have disappointed me greatly, pastafarians.
Pluto: So in your mind It’s OK if the human race goes extinct?? After all it’s a natural process, some species goes extinct etc….
I find it hard to believe that you mean this.
I think that we, the human race, should try to survive as long as possible, and it will be easier for us to survive if we keep our habitat as stable as possible.
@ ET
Et, my sad extraterrestrial friend,
as a pastafarian, EVERY night is spaghetti night!!!
@Michael Cho, adamant athiest and pragmatic
“You have disappointed me greatly, pastafarians.”
.
I’m sure many of my fellow Pastafarians will join me in being disappointed at your failure to spot the ironic nature of the pirtaes-GW claim. Or was that in turn meant to be ironic?
Pluto Jan 2nd, 2008 at 2:42 pm said:
‘Changes in environment cause changes in life it self, that’s evolution.’
Err yes, but current estimates of change the environment due to Global Warming are likely to be a lot faster than human rate of evolution.
‘Every life form has an impact on its environment.’
The rate at which a species can change its environment, is likely to have never exceeded the rate at which it can evolve to suit that environment. Species that could would tend to be the ones we only find in the fossil record.
‘So wile I do care about such things I know life will go on, even if it’s no longer human life (but then why should we be special?)’
So exactly which species on the planet should be trying to stop humans making the planet unsuitable for current homo sapiens? Looks like none of the other species are likely to step up to the plate … Its up to us to do enough to maintain a balance in the environment, a balance that can support us.
I’m reminded of an old adage:
‘live like you will die tomorrow, but work the land like you will live forever’
Either that or pray to the FSM for a quick fix, perhaps he can send a co2 absorbing meteor on a near mis path with earth and skim the co2 off the top
Alan,
Just to beat this horse a little more, let me say: the point is that pastafarianism is NOT science, just as “intelligent design” is not science. Allowing things “not science” into the classroom opens the door to all things not science being in the classroom- assuming that the intelligent design people do have any sense of fairness at all. (OK, probably not a safe assumption.) The FSM designs quite intelligently, IMO, and should have the same air time in science classrooms as any other theory of intelligent design- that is, if anything other than science is allowed into science classrooms.
@ Michael Cho, so your all for Pastafarianism, but have just learned of the Pirates Vs GW graph?
Isn’t that like a 43 yo avid Christian, just finding out about Xmas?
Anyone else not convinced ‘Alan’ is a scientist?
@ Eric - why on earth does the human species deserve to survive as long as possible? Yes, we’ve achieved some reasonably ok things historically - I wouldn’t be an archaeologist if I didn’t believe that - but we’re about the most destructive species there is and quite frankly if it’s a choice between humanity dying out themselves or killing off 90% of other species, I’m all for giving something else a chance to make a better job of things, and the more people who make a conscious decision not to have kids because there are too many people already the better. To quote Bill Hicks - we’re a virus with shoes.
Um, sorry all - think the New Year hangover only just hit when I got up this morning (stopped at about 6am on the second so not unreasonably I guess) and I apologise if anyone thought my previous comment was unacceptably harsh or grouchy. I stand by the sentiment but would maybe have preferred to word it better ordinarily. Happy New Year anyway.
I may be a heretic to your little “church” here, but I must call into question the entire pirate graph altogether. Piracy is actually a considerably large and growing problem in shipping channels worldwide—particularly in the Middle East and Africa.
http://archive.gulfnews.com/articles/07/12/31/10178403.html
Thank you Cho for showing me that it doesn’t take a Fundi to totally misinterpret satire and take it way to seriously.
Sofa King
Jan 4th, 2008 at 11:08 pm
I may be a heretic to your little “church” here, but I must call into question the entire pirate graph altogether. Piracy is actually a considerably large and growing problem in shipping channels worldwide—particularly in the Middle East and Africa.
*
They are not REAL pirates! They are just thieves on water. WE are real pirates (and wenches) and keep the true faith alive. Always important to remember :)
Dont be sexist- wenches are pirates too.
In fact, without them, we wouldn’t have any pirates.
Hi Jenny. It’s not at all a matter if we deserve it or not. The goal for us a a specie is simply to survive and keep the specie going. As an archaeologist I’m sure you are familiar with this basic principle of life. Therefore I believe we should handle the earth with care, and avoid killing those 90% of other species (which we need in order to survive + it’s a moral issue).
Do you really mean that it is OK for the human race to go extinct? No offence, but I hope you don’t get childrens then, as it would contribute to the survival of our species.
btw: The population in my country are quite stable
I, too, have a problem with your pirates and global warming conjunction. As the (retired) CIA pirate analyst I assure you that the number of pirates has not declined over time, but has increased. Of course modern pirates do not operate in quite the same way as ancient ones, but are practitioners of the AK-47 and Zodiac boat more than cutlass or sailing ship. They board and rob ships more often than stealing the complete ship, although that has happened recently as well.
Modern pirates operate in the tropics more often than not, thus preserving the link between temperature and piracy, but correlated opposite to that in the graphic. Most modern pirates can be found in the Malacca Strait, off Somalia, in the Red Sea, and off Nigeria and other coastal areas of West Africa. The Caribbean remains a haven for pirates, especially those who target pleasure craft (yachts) rather than commercial shipping.
My research would indicate a positive correlation between piracy and global temperature as well as a positive correlation between pirates and icebergs.
No offence taken, Eric - I hope I don’t get kids either. And, yes, I really do mean it’s ok for the human race to go extinct. Besides which, whether or not I or anyone else thinks it’s ok, it’s almost inevitable that one day it will happen, given the fact that something like over 90% of all species that ever lived are now extinct. Generally I’m pretty happy with the thought that it’s going to happen one day. It has to be a really bad day for me to want it to happen immediately!
@Jennyanydots Jan 7th, 2008 at 2:02 pm: “No offence taken, Eric - I hope I don’t get kids either. And, yes, I really do mean it’s ok for the human race to go extinct. Besides which, whether or not I or anyone else thinks it’s ok, it’s almost inevitable that one day it will happen, given the fact that something like over 90% of all species that ever lived are now extinct. Generally I’m pretty happy with the thought that it’s going to happen one day. It has to be a really bad day for me to want it to happen immediately!”
.
The state we humans put the planet in, makes it a very tough decision to have children, when you see at what pace everything degradates. As a kid, looking at the time line fixed to the wall of the second grade class, I wondered about events in history becoming more and moredense when approaching our era. I didn’t know of the word “exponential” back then. The degradation of the planet follows a similar curve, and the belief in the unlimited powers of science and technology during the 19th century kinda orientated people in the wrong direction, when you look at it now… Maybe it won’t be too late before the people in power not only look at the power of our technology, but actually DO something with it before it is too late.