A majority of the Pinellas County, Florida, School Board supports the inclusion of Intelligent Design in the science curriculum, reports the St. Petersburg Times.
Four members of the school board, including the chairperson and vice-chairperson, have made statements in support of Intelligent Design.
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.” — Jane Gallucci, Member
“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.” — Carol Cook, Member
You can read the news article here.
The PCSB website states: “The public is encouraged to contact the School Board members on any issue.”
I suggest we contact the school board and let them know there are more than two theories of our origins. Pastafarianism is built on similar tenets as Intelligent Design, and has much greater support from the academic community. If you decide to write, please be respectful.
Contact Info:
Office: (727) 588-6300
E-mail: Board@pcsb.org
Individual E-mail addresses:
Nancy Bostock: bostockn@pcsb.org
Peggy O’Shea: osheap@pcsb.org
Jane Gallucci: galluccij@pcsb.org
Carol Cook: cookc@pcsb.org
And the hydra sprouts a new head. I’m particularly appalled by Ms O’Shea’s idea of teaching nothing controversial because it can’t possibly be important. Can we offer them a re-written curriculum that educates no-one in anything controversial – religion, politics, science, history, sociology, literature etc. What would they be left with?
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emails away
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I’d like to note that none of the above commentators are pirates who are for intelligent design in the classrooms.
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” Well yeah I mean unless it can be proven it’s considered scientific theory. But how does ID balance it out anyone? Can I get a Ramen?
Regardless, we throw in ID we must then offer the different views of ID which means more people will learn of the great FSM.
Pasta be with you.
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Oh yeah and another thing, someone on the original article brought this up as a comment.
“”To teach one as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.”
I wonder if Ms. Cook would say the same about abstinence-only sex ed? that’s not showing the full picture either”
I totally agree alot of people that are pushing for ID in the classrooms are being hypocrital when it comes to other issues like sex ed and teaching kids all the methods of safe sex.
sorry I’m done done.
Pasta be with you.
Ramen.
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Dear board,
I recently heard that you are going to teach the ID theory next to the theory of evolution in the classrooms.
To me, this is a very, very serious matter so that’s why I’m sending this.
May I point out the fact that there are more than 2 theories of our origin?
It is of course a great idea that students “should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved”. (quote Ms. Gallucci)
I like to point out that there is another theory; the theory that a Flying Spaghetti monster created the universe, earth and man.
A few things that you need to know and why this theory receives so much support from the scientific community:
1. He created the Universe first. The FSM needed a few days – we’re not exactly sure how many – to do this (being it such a huge thing and all). Then he created a mountain with trees and a Midgit. (a sort of midget, but not exactly).
I know, I hear you ask… “if this is Intelligent Design, then why are asteroids colliding, are there still traffic jams. Why does my husband need glasses and do I choke when inhaling while I drink my coffee??”
That, my dear board, is a very good and useful question and I will answer it:
2. This might sound a little strange, but when you believe it, it will make sense. He was a little drunk while he created it all. He even forgot that he did it, and made another world. He then sort of melted them together and that’s why there is a heaven with beer volcanoes. Really.
3. He controls everything with his Noodly Appendage – but not always. Being the world so large, he can’t be everywhere all the time, so sometimes you really need to keep your eyes on the road while driving. Trust me on that one.
4. All proof of evolution on this world is placed there by the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Although he didn’t leave a note, we’re pretty sure.
I don’t want this email get too long, but I’m sure you understand why I strongly feel that the children know who created them.
You can find more info on our website http://www.venganza.org
Sincirely,
Theo Westgeest
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Thats just ridiculous.
.
“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?”
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You often have to struggle before the truth can be found. Nothing in life is easy, nor is it handed to you. All this ‘controversy’ is necessary for growth.
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“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
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How exactly is it balanced out? A highly probable explanation for how things came about that has been tested and viewed accurate…and something completely idiotic that was created by a group of people with no real testable evidence?(who were probably bored at the time, eatting their non-noodle based substances.)
“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
.
I answered that already, and decided to come back and comment on everyone else :]
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.” — Jane Gallucci, Member
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Meanwhile you’re only actually giving them two theories, and not the complete spectrum.
“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.” — Carol Cook, Member
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And to pollute the minds of young impressionable children with senseless dribble is a disservice. I’m of course speaking of ID.
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The most interesting thing to note here is how incredibly stupid these people are. Perhaps we shouldn’t be wasting our time trying to change their obviously non-existent minds, and should instead take up a collection to pay for crayons, finger paints and other bright/shiny objects. This would keep them more usefully occupied and away from positions of responsibility where they can do great damage through their complete inability to understand the subject.
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quote — “I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?”
*blinks*
also calc is hard… is it realy that important also? can we leave that out so my kids don’t have to think. please no big words in the english books and more pictures.
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Unfortunately, the debate is not only at the county level, as another part of the same article in St. Pete Times reports,
At least one member of the state Board of Education has objected to the proposed standards. Donna Callaway told a religious newspaper in Jacksonville that evolution “should not be taught to the exclusion of other theories of the origins of life.”
Additionally, Selena “Charlie” Carraway, program manager for the state Department of Education’s Office of Instructional Materials, has urged fellow Christians to fight the inclusion of evolution in the science curriculum.
As a science teacher, we appreciate the recognition that the CFSM has brought, and encourage your members to post at the education blog, “The Gradebook”. At least one board member is reading the blog, as she responded to a post. http://blogs.tampabay.com/schools/ is the link.
Thanks!
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I’d really like to see a form letter that we can all use to send to these people. Something so I don’t sound like the pissed-off person that I am.
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Sent an e-mail to them… lol
Hello, I just heard the good news that the Pinellas County, Florida, School Board supports the inclusion of Intelligent Design in the science curriculum. I think that a broader science curriculum is what the students of Pinellas County needs. Also, I hope that this step forward in science education is complimented with Pastafarianism, or FSMism, the Flying Spaghetti Monster. We believe the FSM is responsible for the source of all creation, DNA strongly resembling rotini pasta, (two inch lengths of thick screw-like pasta), single-celled string like primitive life, etc.
Pastafarianism is built on similar tenets as Intelligent Design, and has much greater support from the academic community.
Sincerely,
-Dillon L Karchner
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“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
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o_o That’s a whole new level of stupid.
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When will it all end!!!! How do these people get elected?!!!!
I guess I will warm up my keyboard for another e-mail onslaught!!
Ramen!!
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“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
-but it is a scientific theory with many facts to back it up. Intelligent design is a religious theory with no actual facts.
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.” — Jane Gallucci, Member
-Well then this includes FSM of course, and every other religion in the world?
“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
-Well it’s better than the others..
“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.” — Carol Cook, Member
-Right! So lets teach a theory with no evidence! WOO! Service the students with lies!
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:) I sent them a lovely, polite e-mail to let them know about our theory.
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Priceless quotes… And they wonder why only the deluded take them seriously…
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“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
That quote is gold. PURE GOLD.
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“… all theories on how man evolved …”
There is only one theory on how man evolved.
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It’s amazing that even after the whole ID thing has been shot down and made out as the psuedoscience BS creationism it is…..these people are still endorsing it. I mean I know none of these people watch NOVA but come on. Is Florida really that full of existentially handicapped people as is seems?
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This is stupid. If we didnt have enough troble with polk, now this? The FSM is not pleased…..
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I can not beleive that another school board thinks this a good idea. So, hopefully we can track down the individual E-Mails and inform them of our tasty theory. Untill then, we should email them at Board@pcsb.org and hope for some results.
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i mean, this is really how it should be taught in one class
1.evolution(35min)
2.Flying Spaghetti Monster creation(20min)
3. I.D(5min)
any one disagree?
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*sigh*. Once more unto the breach my friends, once more unto the breach…
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I still cant believe this…….
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Okay, I sent a letter off to these people.
It’s funny. They look like such intelligent people. They don’t “look” like they would supoort ID without also supporting FSMism.
Since looks can be decieving, I propose that we devise a test to determine if individuals are truly intelligent, and therefore capable of comprehending Intelligent Design, or for that matter, anything more complex than opening a beer. I’m thinking something along the lines of measuring brain cavity volume with a CT scan, and looking for any voids created by missing brain mass.
Oh wait, nevermind: I forgot that He will be there to “adjust” our test results. I guess we’ll have to gauge people’s intelligence by gut instinct since empirical data cannot be trusted.
rAmen.
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I already emailed them and got a response back.
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sigh..
this kind of blind stupidity annoys me
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When will this end? It looks like every week another US school board decides to include one religion into science classrooms, while they ignore other theist theories. Leave them all out, or include them ALL!
Luckily activist school boards like this are utterly impossible in my country :)
Is it just me, or do these board members look like they just stepped out the nineteen-fifties?
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Seriously.
I’m first!?
Here’s the letter I’m sending!
—As a child I was always interested in history. This interest history led me to pursue a career in education. I currently teach HS social studies.
Throughout learning and teaching about history, I’ve learned that it is next to impossible to separate history and religion. The two are intertwined.
Sometimes in history class, one discussion leads to another, and that topic leads to another and next thing you know, you are talking about something you intended to talk about.
The result of one of the conversations has prompted me to write to you.
I was talking about how Christianity has the 10 Commandments, how I am a big proponent for hanging them in schools, and how most other religions don’t have such rules. Then a student corrected me. “The Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster has 8 ‘I Rather You Didn’ts’.”
I laughed this off. She then informed me that she has as much proof as I do; there is as much proof that a flying monster made of spaghetti created everything as there is as much proof that Jesus’ dad created everything.
“It all came out of a book. No one was around to see what was described in Genesis. For all we know, The Flying Spaghetti Monster created everything with his noodly appendages.”
I then asked her what she knew of these 8 “I Rather You Didn’ts.”
“I don’t remember all of them. But the ideas are;
-Just play nice with each other, don’t go killing or beheading people in my name.
-Don’t do anything that might hurt other people’s feelings
-Don’t spend millions making churches and what-not to worship me. Use that money more effectively; such as feeding the homeless, finding a cure for some disease. ”
She then added that, to the best of the Church of The Flying Spaghetti Monster’s knowledge, no one has ever been killed in the name of his Noodly Deity. “Can you say that about any other religion? Can we say, The Crusades and the Inquisition?”
These simple ideas appealed to me and I told the class I’d “Google” the Flying Spaghetti Monster when I get home.
I read up on this Noodly Deity. I must say that I am convinced that there is as much of a chance that the Flying Spaghetti Monster created the universe as did Jesus’ dad.
If you insist in teaching Jewish-Christian belief of creation, I implore to you please consider teaching the idea of Carbo-Hyrdate-Creationism. I also encourage you to teach the main beliefs of the 8 I Rather You Didn’ts. These simple tenets encourage all men and women to do their best to get along, respect each other, and to try to help each other.
As we say,
Peace and RAmen
C. Felix
(A nice and simple contraction of Amen and Ramen [As in Ramen Noodles.])—
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– Ah, I love instructing people in the ways of the FSM, i guess that’s two schools in the past couple weeks to mention their interest in ID. Quite concerning, eh? Well, in case anyone is interested, though doubtful, I’ll show ya what I wrote to them.–
Hello Pinellas County School Board,
I don’t want to take up much of your time, so I’ll make this as short as possible.
Just today I was looking in the news, and noticed an article concerning the schools interest in adding ID (intelligent design) into the science curriculum alongside evolution. I’m not against the addition of such content in the science curriculum, but I am rather distraught that there is only interest in the teaching of one form of ID. If the school does indeed end up teaching ID, then it would only be understandable and fair to incorporate other forms of ID, such as my belief, and the belief of many others, that the world, and it’s inhabitants, and even everything in existence, was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. And if the one form of ID that you school is so intent on teaching is the only one that is taught, and the Pastafarian ID (Flying Spaghetti Monsterism) is left untouched in the classroom, then legal action must take place. I know you will be reasonable and teach both though, so hopefully no one will have to worry about that.
Not only does the Pastafarian ID have just as much evidence as any other form of ID (maybe more), but we have many very respected scientists/doctors/etc that are completely for Pastafarian ID being taught at school. If need be, I could supply this list for you.
Anyways, this is turning out a bit longer than I expected, so I’ll go over the rest as quickly as possible. The teacher MUST wear complete pirate regalia while teaching the Pastafarian ID. For brevities sake, I won’t explain why, so best to not question it. My fellow Pastafarians and I can instruct the teachers in the ways of Pastafarian ID, so the teachers would be well versed in our teachings before hand. Lastly, I would like to make a toast to a time when ID, Flying Spaghetti Monsterism, and logical conjecture based on overwhelming observable evidence can all be taught side by side.
Have a good day, and may your curriculum be touched by His noodly appendage.
- ******* *******
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“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.”
Balances it out? Balances it out? AAARRRGGGHHH!
“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?”
Oh, it’s very important. So much for politicians knowing what they’re talking about-yet another example.
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.”
Then teach ID in religion class, and Evolution in science class.
“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.”
See above. There is more fact around evolution than ID, that ’s for sure.
More politicians jumping on the ID bandwagon. Sigh.
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This kind of thing really gets me worried. It’s bad enough having to deal with people pushing religion outside of school, but once it gets like this…
Anyway, here are my replies as a loyal Pastafarian Discordian Unitarian Universalist Atheist:
.
Nancy Bostock:
I have yet to see ANY convincing evidence for Intelligent Design. Evolution, on the other hand, has a massive amount evidence supporting it, which you should NOT have to ask me for if you actually have a science/biology teacher in Pinellas County. So saying that we should “balance out” science with something that is not even slightly scientific seems a little like saying the best way to lose weight is through complete disembowelment.
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Peggy O’Shea:
One of the biggest signs of importance is controversy. In the science classroom, students should learn science. It is that simple.
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Jane Gallucci:
Out of curiosity, would it change your view if we gave you a list of all the different “theories” you should now be supporting? Just keep religion seperate from science, please.
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Carol Cook:
Oh, I think most of them are aware that many other theories exist. If they want to learn them, there are plenty of sources to do so. But for now, can you just go back to teaching science in the science classroom? Intelligent Design is not science.
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How have these school boards not learned?
Gold!
But seriously, there was Dover, Kansas, and a few recently, I mean seriously, this is the problem with education: stupid idiots are in charge.
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“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.”
I like it I like it – as long as pastafarianism is given as much consideration as Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, Sikhism, Judaism, Confucianism, Jainism, Zoroastrianism, Shinto, Taoism, Wicca and any other beliefs people hold to be true as well – if you want to teach intelligent design then you MUST teach all intelligent design theories.
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“eye’d probubbly lyke to keep itt awl [speling and grammer] owt of the klasrum. if its going too kreat this much kontruvurse howe umportunt iss it.”
-ScienTastic
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out. Of course, I don’t know what the words ‘entire,’ ‘theory,’ ‘evolution,’ ’scientific,’ ‘fact,’ ‘intelligent,’ ‘design,’ or ‘balance’ mean, so take what I say with a grain of salt.” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
“To have someone like me on the school board, I think, does our students a disservice.”
— Carol Cook, Member
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.” — Jane Gallucci, Member
Wait. What? Does she even KNOW what intelligent design IS?
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I got a reply back from them, which has email addresses
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Here is my Letter:
To the Pinellas County, Florida, School Board
.
It may not be immediately obvious why a person from Australia would take an interest in what is happening in a Florida School district. The short answer is that developments in Australian public education open the possibility that we will move to a similar system to yours.
.
I would like to take this opportunity to applaud you on your brave decision to oppose the scientific establishment and include alternate theories on the origins of life on earth in your Science curriculum.
.
In light of this bold move, I feel it is only right that I bring to your attention another such theory which has even MORE evidence to support it than does the theory of Intelligent Design.
.
I speak, of course, of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
.
As a practicing Pastafarian I am passionately committed to educating others about the Divine Pasta and the abundant evidence of His Creation of our world. Accordingly, I beseech you, as responsible public servants with the best interests of your student body at heart, to ALSO include the Theory of the Flying Spaghetti Monster in your Science curriculum.
.
Details of the Theory and the evidence supporting it have been included in an Open Letter to the Kansas School Board, which can be found at http://www.venganza.org/about/open-letter
.
I thank you for your balanced and concerned consideration and anticipate your inclusion of this Theory in you curriculum with great hope.
.
Have a Wonderful X-FSMass!
.
Drew Dight
Pastafarian.
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What is it with Floridians now a days. we are causing so much ruckus. (Sex ed and Intelligent design)
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I think they need to talk to the idiots in polk county, you’d figure they’d here about us somehow…
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Seriously, Pinellas County is about 10 minutes away from me… I actually used to work there. You’ve got to be fucking kidding…. Good news is… I don’t have to travel very far to distribute propaganda!
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I don’t see my post, so I’ll post what I sent to this Board of Educators:
“I am a Pastafarian who is greatly concerned for your support of Intelligent Design being brought into the science cirricula of Florida schools, without also including the teachings of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. FSMism is an alternate theory of Intelligent Design that has the backing of the scientific community, and is proven to be scientific by many graphable, provable data. I strongly urge you to review the open letter to the Kansas Board of Education, found here: http://www.venganza.org/about/open-letter. I’m sure you will agree with all us pastafarians that FSMism deserves equal time in the classroom when compared to Evolution and the Christian based Intelligent Design. I hope that our 10 million members will not have to have any bake-sales to fund legal action aginst PCSB for discriminating against our beliefs.
Thank you very much. Andrew D Pohlman. ”
I got the canned response saying my lette rwould be forwarded to the Superintendent and the Board. If I actually get real responses, I’ll post them.
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OMFSM! I know this isn’t just particular to Florida, but some of the school boards in the state are just taking this issue and running with it.
.
And Ms. Peggy O’Shea’s comment: “If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” just demonstrates a fundamental flaw in American society. It seems if there’s some sort of debate and intelligent engagement involved, then it’s bad and should just be shoved under the rug. I’m sending them my email I sent to Polk County. This is just ridiculous.
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Where are these people getting their “science?” They seem ready to accept the DNA evidence that will help loved ones cure a disease or find their relatives, but not the evidence that supports the Theory of Evolution. Science is not just applicable where one wants it to be – and it constantly changes. Every time it does, it makes the Theory of Evolution more plausible. And, of course, if these people want I.D. taught, then they also need to teach the origins of man/woman/pirates as told in the Gospel of the FSM.
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The quotes from the 4 School Board members who support teaching “Intelligent Design” as science kind of say it all. No satire required when reality is just that stupid…
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.” — Jane Gallucci, Member
“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.” — Carol Cook, Member
They’re as good as any satirical comment I can up with.
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Hello,
I understand that a majority of your school board members support teaching Intelligent Design as part of a science curriculum.
In science, there are specific criteria for what qualifies as a “theory”. It’s not just an idea, or something that explains the data. The word “theory” means something very different in science than on TV, where detectives stand around a crime scene talking about their theories of the crime.
One of the criteria for a scientific theory is that it must be “falsifiable”. If you are not familiar with that idea, Wikipedia has a good explanation.
Evolution is falsifiable. Intelligent Design is not. So it does not belong in a science class.
That is not to say Intelligent Design is not what actually happened. Nobody can prove or disprove that, any more than they can prove or disprove the idea that the world was created 200 years ago, or even one second ago.
It’s just to say that Intelligent Design does not meet the criteria of science. If it is to be taught in schools, it should be taught somewhere else, perhaps as part of a philosophy course.
However, I can see where you might want to re-define science, throw out falsifiability as a criterion for scientific theories, and include things in the curriculum that have the support of powerful interest groups.
If that’s what you want to do, I strongly suggest you consider the theory of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. It’s not falsifiable, but neither is Intelligent Design, and they explain the data equally well. You may consider its proponents nut-jobs, but we are nut-jobs to be reckoned with, since many of us work in the computer industry, science, and engineering, and have plenty of money to contribute to lobbying and legal funds to promote our views.
Best regards,
Bob
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And so the emails begin. Do not let the equally valid theory of Flying Spaghetti Monsterism be ignored any longer!
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It’s always interesting to see which board members are the more rabid (and thus ironically more honest) and which try to cover their ideas with a veneer of diplomacy or hypocracy (e.e. teaching the controversy).
RAmen
(Gold, first time poster)
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Oh, again? Well, well. These seem to be really very intelligent persons. I especially liked the argument of Ms. O’Shea. I think Physics create some controversies, too. Let’s do away with it. Or Mathematics, come to think of it…. well, why go to school in the first place?
I always thought, it was a mistake leaving the trees….
(OK, that’s Douglas Adams).
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I sent the following email to Board@pcsb.org, and cc’d the superintendent (super@pcsb.org):
Hello,
I understand that a majority of your school board members support teaching Intelligent Design as part of a science curriculum.
In science, there are specific criteria for what qualifies as a “theory”. It’s not just an idea, or something that explains the data. The word “theory” means something very different in science than on TV, where detectives stand around a crime scene talking about their theories of the crime.
One of the criteria for a scientific theory is that it must be “falsifiable”. If you are not familiar with that idea, Wikipedia has a good explanation.
Evolution is falsifiable. Intelligent Design is not. So it does not belong in a science class.
That is not to say Intelligent Design is not what actually happened. Nobody can prove or disprove that, any more than they can prove or disprove the idea that the world was created 200 years ago, or even one second ago.
It’s just to say that Intelligent Design does not meet the criteria of science. If it is to be taught in schools, it should be taught somewhere else, perhaps as part of a philosophy course.
However, I can see where you might want to re-define science, throw out falsifiability as a criterion for scientific theories, and include things in the curriculum that have the support of powerful interest groups.
If that’s what you want to do, I strongly suggest you consider the theory of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. It’s not falsifiable, but neither is Intelligent Design, and they explain the data equally well. You may consider its proponents nut-jobs, but we are nut-jobs to be reckoned with, since many of us work in the computer industry, science, and engineering, and have plenty of money to contribute to lobbying and legal funds to promote our views.
Best regards,
Bob
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O FSM, why are these people even on a school-board? They clearly lack the understanding to decide on anything concerning education!
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“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
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‘I don’t know yet’=/=’God did it.’
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“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
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Generally if something creates a lot of controversy, it’s because many people care about it. Usually when a great number of people care strongly about a subject, it’s because it is important.
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“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.” — Carol Cook, Member
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And ignoring the scientific method for a myth isn’t? What’s so wrong with a religion class? ID can be presented as fact there, not just a competing ‘theory’ although it can barely even be called a hypothesis. At least if it was called religion class, the children wouldn’t assume it had been well researched as they would in a science class.
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Oh noes! They’re at it again!
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“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.” — Carol Cook, Member
The Flying Spaghetti Monster created everything. It’s not perfect, because he was drunk.
All evidence for something else is put in place by him.
RAmen
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I am so happy that I live in a country where the ID hoax is seen as just that.
I am all for religious believes, but the moment the belief is used for promoting oneself, to gain anything worldly, it no longer has anything to do with religion, at least not Christianity.
Religion and politics has nothing to do with science, in an ideal world, sadly both history and present events show that we don`t live in it yet.
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“If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?”
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Importance is a key part of what makes something controversial. Nothing trivial ever creates controversy. (If anyone disagrees, and thinks that irrelevant and inane topics are rife with controversy, try to foment a furor in the nearest large city to your town over which flavor of ice cream is the best. Then chart how much success you have.)
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-Avatar of Reason
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This is my effot
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I was horrified to see that the myth of Intelligent Design is being promoted in schools.
I’ll assume that those in support of it are part of the cowardly and undemocratic “wedge strategy” as there is no other explanation for insisting that a lie has any bearing in science!
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Evolution is theory supported buy observable evidence. Creationism (which is all ID really is) has no scientific founding or supporting evidence. In fact the evidence refutes ID!
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So I think those board members who are supporting ID should be ashamed of their selves! The use of such underhanded tactics to try to force religion into the science class is a despicable. Religion belongs in a church not in a school!
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If you feel your religion is so threatened by science that you have to resort to unfounded lies and sudo-science then clearly your faith is some what lacking.
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Stop trying to corrupt the minds of the young!
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If you whish to teach these ideas then you will also have to teach all creation myths. Hindu, Mayan, Seek, Buddhist and especially FSM which actually has some science to back it up!
There are many more, but to cover them all in full would require a year or so out of a child’s education in a state that is already failing behind in standards.
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Letter below just sent to them. I sent the brochure No. 2 as an attachment of anyoine wants to follow up with a different one.
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To the members of the Pinellas County School Board,
Although living in England your teaching decisions do not directly involve me, I have become aware that you are supporting the teaching of Intelligent Design. Intelligent Design is no more science than any other creation theory, and in fact has less scientific evidence behind it than some theories. If Intelligent Design is to be taught as science, I would strongly recommend that you also teach the Flying Spaghetti Monster in science classes. I have attached a leaflet setting out the main tenets of Pastafarianism, and you can find out more at http://www.venganza.org, should you be so inclined. There is considerable scientific support for this theory.
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There are a number of creation theories from different cultures around the world and, in order to give your students an detailed education in all of these, you would actually not have scope in the timetable to teach any other subject, such as mathematics or literature. I would suggest you select no more than half a dozen options to teach in addition to evolution, as your students would otherwise be somewhat overwhelmed. I would suggest you investigate teaching Christian Intelligent Design, as it will initially be the most familiar to any church-goers amongst the class. To balance this unscientific view, Pastafarianism is the most logical choice. Should your teachers be unfamiliar with the key principles you will be able to approach any Pastafarian for guidance in creating a teaching plan. As ancient Egyptian beliefs helped to define the Judeo-Christian tradition, I would suggest one of the Egyptian stories be taught as historic background. As I am sure you are aware, one of the earliest of these identifies the foundations of the Ennead in which Atum arose from the primordial waters (Neith), and masturbated to relieve his loneliness. His semen and breath became Tefnut (moisture) and Shu (dryness), respectively. From Shu and Tefnut, were born Geb (earth), and Nut (sky), who were born in a state of permanent copulation. Shu separated them, and their children were Ausare (Osiris; death), Set (desert), Aset (Isis; life), and Nebet Het (Nephthys; fertile land). I would advise balancing the old Egyptian theory with one of the tribal beliefs still adhered to. You could select any of these from around the world, but I particularly like that of the African Bushmen, as it forms a nice juxtaposition of 2 African theories. People and animals lived peacefully under the surface of the earth with the Great Master and Lord of All Life, Kaang, who made plans to bring them out onto the surface of the world. He created a tree on the surface and dug a hole down to the inner world, and then helped all of the people and animals to climb out and spread over the country. When night came, the people were afraid and lit a fire, the one thing they had been forbidden to do. This scared away the animals and they were never again able to communicate with them. In the interests of providing balanced views, I would recommend you also include one of the Asian cultures’ creation myth, for example Japanese. In that story, 2 gods created Japan together. They subsequently married and Izanami gave birth to three children, Amaterasu (the sun), Tsuki-yumi (the moon) and Sosano-wo. I would finally suggest that you teach at least one of the Native American traditions. I was able to find for you the Iroquois story of the pregnant Sky Woman being thrown down to earth by her husband and land forming on the back of a giant turtle, although I am not familiar enough with American prehistory to know if that is the most appropriate one for your students, geographically. You can read more on these and other stories at this website – http://www.cs.williams.edu/~lindsey/myths/myths.html
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You may argue that not all of these stories should be taught in science; however, if Intelligent Design meets the criteria to be considered science then so do all of these. It may be easier to work them into the curriculum under religion, with evolution as the only science subject. I note with great concern Ms O’Shea’s suggestion that neither be taught, as it cannot be both controversial and important. Intelligent Design is controversial precisely because it promotes ignorance of one of the most important foundations in the field of biology. Even if some children are taught at home or in church not to listen, you must teach it to all children in order that those who are not already completely closed off to the idea are able to understand those principles. There is no reason why they cannot decide for themselves that it is not the only answer, but without it forming a part of their education they will be severely compromised in any future educational or career choices. Without being aware of the mechanisms of evolution, you will produce a generation in your community which is incapable of understanding science, or of following a career path in medicine or many technological fields. By restricting them in this way, you will have to import doctors and nurses, while scientific R&D industries will be forced to locate elsewhere in order to find a skilled workforce. This is not only bad for the children whose futures you are responsible for, but also for your whole community.
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I would ask you to please give this further consideration. Listen to scientists explain what science involves and make your decision based on their expert advice, before you create an entire generation of students who are unable to contribute to the future advancement of society. Thank you very much for your time in reading this.
Regards,
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[JennyAnyDots]
An Archaeologist from England
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Bravo JennyAnyDots!
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@ Bascule – well, it is my last day in work for a couple of weeks, and it seemed a fairly good use of my time!
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Dear Board members,
I am delighted to notice that you plan to introduce Intelligent Design in science classes. As an European citizen, I would favor the following creation myth to be taught alongside Darwinian evolution:
“According to Norse lore, before there was Earth (Midgard), there was Muspell, a fiery land guarded by the fire sword-wielding Surt; Ginnungagap, a great void, and Niflheim, a frozen ice-covered land. When the cold of Niflheim touched the fires of Muspell, the giant Ymir and a behemothic cow, Audhumla, emerged from the thaw. Then, the cow licked the god Bor and his wife into being. The couple gave birth to Buri, who fathered three sons, Odin, Vili, and Ve. The sons rose up and killed Ymir and from his corpse created from his flesh, the Earth; the mountains from his bones, trees with his hair and rivers, and the seas and lakes with his blood. Within Ymires hollowed-out skull, the gods created the starry heavens.”
You surely will notice that, similar to the biblical genesis, in this story trees were created before there was light (”starry heavens”).
The Flying Spaghetti Monster creation myth, of course, would be a tasty alternative to this!
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Here my little contribution. I decided to try the patriotic argument, perhaps it will help:
Honourable Pinella County School board members,
I am writing to you from France, as even there I heard of your plan to teach ID alongside evolution in science classes.
Considering myself as a friend of your great country and supposing you consider yourself as patriots, I wanted to warn you of the harm you are risking to do to the United States.
First, because you seriously damage the image of America. It is precisely this sort of things that make Europeans in general and Frenchmen in particular think Americans are completely retarded (please excuse the rudeness of the expression).
Because wanting to teach as if they had the same value a theory that is supported by the overwhelming majority of the scientific community (actually, the question is not if it occurred, but how exactly it did), by a huge and every day growing amount of evidence and has not only withstood testing for 150 years, but has reinforced itself all that time long, and another that hasn’t any convincing evidence at all, that isn’t even a theory by scientific standards, that hasn’t been peer-reviewed, that is incapable of withstanding any serious testing and that has been shown to be pseudo-science and just wrong (I am of course thinking of the Dover trial) simply appears to be the summit of stupidity, making every reasonable person of my continent laugh about the USA.
Perhaps you should know that in Europe, every scientist supports evolution, though many of them are Christians, and that if you really want to teach religious theories in science classes, there are many others which should be taught, too (at least for the constitution’s sake), for example the theory of “Unintelligent design”, stating a Flying Spaghetti Monster created the world.
The whole civilized world laughing about you isn’t only a pity, it disqualifies America as a leader.
And this not only politically and morally, but potentially, at least in a few years, economically. Because the leadership of the United States is based on the economy and the military. And both are so strong because your country is so good in scientific research. By doing what you do, you destroy American science.
And by destroying American science, you will destroy America.
Do you really want that?
Robert Surcouf
I suppose it won’t work, these people showing once again faith is the reason of the stupid
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yay Jenny
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Just as a quick update – their poor overloaded admin person has just sent a standard response notifying me that the letter is forwarded to board members, the superintendant and his staff. She was probably expecting a nice quiet couple of days before the break, only to be deluged with stuff from us. I’ll post any reply I might receive in a couple of weeks. I just hope the admin assistant has a good sense of humour!
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I sent this today. I release any rights to it – you may change it, take parts of it for your own, or utilize it in its entirety if you so wish.
To whom it may concern,
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I have been apprised to the fact that four members of the Pinellas County School Board support the inclusion of Intelligent Design to the science curriculum.
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In life, we are in the habit of deferring to experts. You likely do not understand the science behind medical procedures that have prolonged the lives of people close to you, but you do not have to understand them – all that matters is that somebody, an expert, does understand them. Even scientists use equations in their work for which they could not educe any deep understanding – they have deferred to the experts, in this case, the mathematicians.
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Having read the quotes of the board members, they are abdicating themselves from the scientific authorities for a collection reasons that are deeply inadequate. These reasons boil down to the idea that we have an obligation to teach our children the religious community’s alternative to science as though a failure to do so would mean we were embracing obscurantism. This sentiment was echoed by Carol Cook, Jane Gallucci, and Chairperson Nancy Bostock.
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This idea is patently absurd. Science is not a democracy. Science is a brutal field where concepts are tested, scrutinized, and rejected if they are found to be without evidential merit. This is the scientific process, and it exists as a check against bad science. If a hypothesis is subjected to the process of peer-review and subsequently rejected, the normal response is to incorporate the accompanying criticism, rework the hypothesis, and resubmit. This cycle of double-checks and self-correction is what separates science from other fields as the preeminent sphere of knowing. This is why science has given us quite literally everything that is reasonable to believe about how reality functions.
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It is to this requisite system of correction that Intelligent Design has been particularly aversive. They have submitted their hypothesis and had it summarily rejected for a litany of reasons. However, the supporters of Intelligent Design have been reticent to incorporate any standards or consider any of the critiques which would allow it to ascend to the domain of science. Instead, they are attempting to circumvent the scientific process by proliferating their ideas to a public that is religiously eager to embrace the idea. It is from this villainous tactic that we receive the notion that science, or any other evidence-based discipline, is a democracy or is subject to how many people it offends. No matter how put off I may be by the fact that the Earth orbits the Sun, in science the evidence trumps my feelings. The truth has never made any guarantees that it will conform to our intrinsic sense of wishful thinking in the way that religion has, which is precisely why the dispassionate adherence to the evidence on display in the field of science is so crucial.
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This thinly veiled creationist trick of insinuating that science has anything to do with who it offends has taken root in a four-member concentration of the Pinellas County School Board, and the concern I feel over this fact should be amplified one hundred fold for anybody living in that area – especially for somebody who has a portion of the responsibility for ensuring the quality of the education the local children receive.
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In Dover, it cost their district over two million dollars to lose and look like buffoons. If you are determined to follow the lemmings on the Board of Education towards whichever cliff they are marching, then it will also cost you over two million dollars to lose and look like buffoons. Do not do this. Our future resides in the hands of our children and we cannot afford to turn a blind eye to the miasma of willful ignorance.
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Defer to the experts on what is science.
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JT Eberhard
President, Missouri State University Chapter of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster
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“It has come to my attention that you have made the decision to include Intelligent Design in the standard science curriculum in Pinellas County . I agree that all available theories should be taught, and the children should use their own judgment to decide upon which theory is correct.
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However, you make a dire mistake in excluding the theory with academic support second only to evolution: Unintelligent Design. You see, look at all of creation we notice things such as war, disease, violence, crime, etc. These are all signs of a very flawed, and unintelligent, creation process. Of course, the creator himself must have been omniscient and quite intelligent in order to create the beautiful things in life (such as sunsets, rainbows, humans, Rice Krispies, etc.), which shows that such a being must have been heavily inebriated at the time.
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This theory is known as Unintelligent Design, FSMism, or the Theory of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. It is called such because we have evidence that the creator manifests itself as a being composed of many tentacle-like appendages resembling noodles.
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You can find the aforementioned academic endorsements here”
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Short but sweet, and got a message saying it’s being forwarded.
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“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
Yes, controversy in the class room is an altogether bad idea. We should probably stop teaching our students anything and instead have them watch a multi-colored flashing orb all day while sitting in a well padded room. This method works very well in preventing teen pregnancy and teen drug and alcohol abuse. We know that if our students don’t know about it they won’t do it.
Interesting correlation between big hair, pastel colors, neck scarves, and general ignorance.
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Let them teach ID. Its fine with me.
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I picture it happening this way:
There are two main beliefs as to how everything came to be.
1) A God or Gods snapped his/her/their fingers, did a dance or something and everything came into being.
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2) Things change slowly over time…now lets examine the evidence of this…etc…
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Seriously? I would love to see the content, the scope and sequence, the curriculum of ID. How much can be in there?
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If any out there can find, or does have an ID curriulum for a public school, let me know.
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Madame Chairman and Members of the Board:
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Where the premise of education is to teach *how* to think, rather than *what* to think, it is appropriate to present competing ideas with comparable credentials. Unfortunately, not every competing idea is equally valid; peer review helps weed out those which are not viable — or not relevant to a given discipline — from those which are relevant and lead to a better-informed population.
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However, neither public nor private schools are designed to allow students to “make up their own minds” about everything, nor to protect them from exposure to broader knowledge. If that were the case, there would be no need for schools in the first place. For those whose religious beliefs require that students be presented with options to choose whether to learn science in their science classes, please consider this reasoning as applied to other courses:
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1. Language Arts
All classroom instruction will be bi-lingual. Students will spend equal time learning both English and Spanish as there is debate regarding which is the oldest language. Students will make up their own minds as to which they believe is most correct for completing their assignments (and appropriate within their neighborhoods), without coercion of majority rule, or penalty due to instructor prejudice.
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2. Other Science Units
Science teachers will ‘teach the controversy’ between Alchemy and Chemistry, giving equal time to both. Chemistry is the modern, secular offshoot of Alchemy, which enjoyed a long and respected tenure in Western history. Many notable, devout men (and women) believed in Alchemy, without diminishing their faith or their other academic achievements. In order to Leave No Florida Child Behind, warning stickers will be affixed to handouts of the Periodic Table of Elements stating that, as its data is subject to change, it is of dubious value. Students will be required to transmute base metals into gold for the final exam, and provided with authorized 17th century English translations of Bronze Age texts as reference materials.
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3. Music
Band and Chorus students will no longer be constrained to so-called ‘music theory’. Since Western classical music is difficult or offensive for some listeners, each student will follow an independent study which best conforms to his or her existing experience and taste. Familiar composers such as Toby Keith and Trick Daddy will be given equal consideration with French elitists such as Claude Debussy or Joseph-Maurice Ravel. Of course, as the arts can be ‘controversial’, perhaps the safest course is to eliminate them from your curriculum entirely.
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4. Mathematics
Math students will no longer be limited to ‘theories’ they may find offensive, such as ‘Algebra’ (invented by Pagans and Muslims), ‘Game Theory’ (school is not for playing games) ‘Homology Theory’ (this sounds suspicious), or ‘Proof Theory’ (can they prove it or is it just a theory?). Besides, who cares what ‘x’ stands for? They’re never going to need that. Also, the Bible states that Pi = 3.
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5. Human Development
A) “The entire theory of Abstinence is not scientific fact. Education on fertility and contraception balances it out.”
B) “I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how pregnancy may be avoided and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.”
C) “To teach one [abstinence] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.”
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6. Civics
Finally, as freedom of religion *is* protected in the United States, all students may cite the scriptures and traditions of their personal belief systems in any and all classes where the curriculum is in discrepancy or causes personal anxiety, without challenge and without grade penalty for not embracing the teacher’s theories.
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- – - – - – - – - -
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Members of the Board, I refer you to an article in the December 5, 2007 edition of the Washington Post: “The average science score of U.S. 15-year-olds lagged that of students in 16 of 30 countries in the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, a Paris-based group that represents the world’s richest countries. U.S. students were further behind in math, trailing counterparts in 23 countries.”
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I understand that your constituency is dominated by different Christian sects, none of which is in complete agreement within its own members — let alone within the larger body — regarding any question. Please honor both your God and your country by allowing parents to take responsibility for their children’s religious education within their respective homes and churches. You, as stewards of the *public* school system, are accountable for providing the serious education they will need to compete in a world dependent on technologies requiring the ability to reason. You are not authorized to choose their religious beliefs and enforce your own.
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Sincerely,
[pieces o'nine]
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I was so excited — I got a response back!!!… but it was just to say my email would be forwarded to the board members and the superintendant. Darnit.
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I too got the response saying my email was forwarded to the board and superintendent. I’ll be very surprised if I get a response out of them, but I do appreciate the response (canned though it may be) from this innocent bystander. Like others, if I do get anything in response, I’ll let you know.
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Hey Mods:
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I posted those email addresses yesterday, but it seems you’ve moderated them out. Don’t you want them?
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St John the Blasphemist
Saint of Fruits of Labour
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I just sent them the following e-mail.
———-
I demand that all forms of ID (and/or UD, see below for a bit more on this) be included, along with
rational conjecture based on billions and billions of hours of observation and thought followed by
billions and billions of hours of critical study of the first billions and billions of hours in order to
come to reasonable conclusions that seem to agree with the world we see around us, in any school
cirriculum so that our young may have a fully grounded grasp on things.
It is my belief, shared by many others, that the Earth was created 5,001 years ago by the, “Flying
Spaghetti Monster.” At this point the difference between traditional ID’s position and our Church’s
may not be clear and you may wonder how the Pastafarian’s (thus we call ourselves) position differs.
The difference is in this, we Pastafarians have no quibble with science. Science is not wrong in their
findings, as far as can be shown or proven. It is a victim of the world as it actually is. The “Lord of
Lasagne” sees a scientest (or anyone else) making a measurement, and with his great “Noodly
Appendege” alters the measurement to make it seem that the observer’s data agrees with a Universe
that is 14 billionish years old. Why he does this we aren’t sure. And as the “Price of Pasta” doesn’t
generally converse with us (Evidently we just aren’t all that interesting to the “Maker of Manicotti”)
it may never be entirely clear.
Also, our Church has graphs!!!!!! Evolutionists and other scientists are all the time dragging in
graphs and stuff to support scientific views, well move over Newton, we gottem too. Not knowing
how to stick the graph in here you’ll have to take my word for it (unless you visit our site) that it
shows an almost perfect inverse relationship between the decrease in Pirates and the rise in global
tempature.
For whatever reason the “Giver of Gnocchi” is uncommonly fond of Pirates and is angry
over their decrease.
In addition to graphs the Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti contains a number of mathmatical proofs
that are made up of hard to understand symbols used in a manner not commonly seen in regular
cyphering. It doesn’t stop there either. We got proofs using all kinds of scientifical looking stuff. No
matter what your views may be, we think you will agree that this is something that is sorely missed
in the older religions.
A few words on, UD or, “Unintelligent Design.” There is in the “Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti
Monster,” (available at Amazon.com should you be interested) on page 30-31 a brief passage that
lays the groundwork for the concept of, “Unintelligent Design.” I feel that the title of this line of
thought says enough that a full explanation is not necessary at this point.
I will, however, add an emperical observation that may help. Early last month I was called to the VA
and was subjected to all the usual indignaties that a man of 60 must endure. During this pleasant
interlude I was informed that I was now the proud possesor of hemorrhoids. And just to top it off,
next Monday, I have to go in and have a camera poked up my pooper.
You know. . . you’re the master of everything, you got all the power there is, you got your blank
canvas to work with, it looks to me like some thought and planning would have gone a long ways
toward toward not having these little problems. I’m sure you can come up a few examples where
some basic groundwork before actually starting creation would have been real handy.
For those of you that are ignorant, as was until recently, of the “King of Calamaretti” you might
want to stop by his site at http://www.venganza.org/ and check it all out.
There are several good reasons to join (if you will allow me to evangelize for just a moment):
1. Flimsy moral standards.
2. Every Friday is a religious holiday.
3. Our Heaven is way better. We got a beer volcano and a stripper factory.
4. Even our Hell isn’t all that bad. The beer volcano dispenses only stale, and probably warm (the
scriptures aren’t clear on this point) beer and the strippers are older and like those in Las Vegas tend
to have various veneral diseases.
5. We don’t have 10 commandments but rather 8 “I Really Wish You Wouldn’ts.” We’re pretty short
on dogma too.
6. Try our 30 day guarantee. After 30 days you don’t like us, your old God will probably take you
back.
So, it is the desire of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster that our, equally valid, revealed
theory of how we came to be on the earth should be included in any debate over whether or not there
will be changes to any public school’s science curriculum.
If, and when, this should come to a debate rest assured that we will be right there with you fighting shoulder to shoulder to have all equally valid theories presented to the students of this country.
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To the esteemed members of the Pinellas County School Board:
Ah, what a breath of fresh air you bring to the curricular debate. I must wholeheartedly congratulate you on your courageous decision to throw caution to the wind. For as you know, American jurisprudence is based upon the theory of stare decisis et non quieta movere, whereupon your decision to allow other theories to be taught alongside evolution sets the precedent, opening wide the floodgates of the mind–ushering in an era when all theorists and theologians alike may sue for inclusion in your schools’ teachings. While more timid school boards would shy away from the budgetary burden of legal hearings and lawsuits, you are boldly saying, “I will not be cowed by my fiduciary responsibility to my constituents!” If critical programs must be eliminated merely to afford the expenses associated with this unpopular choice, if our children must pay this price so that future generations will be blessed with the freedom of deciding that truth is whatever we think it should be, then so be it.
I, for one, thank you for lifting the bonds of conformity, and know that He looks favorably upon your actions to let His word reach the minds and hearts of our children. By administratively removing the burdens of proof normally afforded the determination of valid scientific theory, we are no longer shackled by the rigors of empirical thought, which–let’s be honest–are really tough.
For years I have been rebuffed for my theories that conventional history, too, is nothing more than a hyperspectral multidimensional projection onto the collective consciousness of humanity starting at the beginning, with creation, and continuing until October 24, 1979. (Not coincidentally, this is the date of first use of the trademark for Prego® brand pasta sauce.) Such a mental manifestation, of course, serves as the ultimate test of faith, being an artifice of His omnipotence. It is also serves as a clever means to distract His followers from the questionable reasons for our creation, namely the drinking.
So by your actions, you will finally give voice to my desire to have this serious alternative theory taught alongside so called “accepted” history, and reveal the Truth of His Noodly meddlings in not just natural history (a.k.a. science), but history itself.
Lest I misrepresent my views as those of a single united voice, it must be stated that followers of the Flying Spaghetti Monster have interpreted their perceptions in myriad ways, and in acknowledgment of the fairness doctrine, their diverse views, as well as those of Zoroastrians, Yam Worshipers, Buddhists, Shinto, and even practitioners of non-conventional religions, be afforded equal time in explaining science, history, mathematics, and the vocational arts, insofar as their faith speaks to the basis of these fields of study.
A rousing huzzah to this brave, new, discordant academe that, by your convictions, shall be foist upon our credulous youth. I look forward to your consistent, unwavering support as we embark upon the lengthy and arduous task of rewriting the entirety of Pinellas County’s syllabus.
Praise be to the Flying Spaghetti Monster!
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Has anyone noticed they have retro hair cuts? It’s like looking back in time to the early 80’s
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Wait…let me get this straight-if it causes controversy, it isn’t important. So that means the Iraq war, the debate over religion, and pretty much all politics isn’t importnat? Great to have those things off my chest…
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“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.” — Jane Gallucci, Member
Okay then, teach the science version in the science class and the religious version in religion class. Of course, as we all know, his Noodly Appendage will touch all and prevail. Which sounds a bit disturbing for a classroom, admittedly. Golly gosh! It’s so complex.
RAmen
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I got the same canned response as everyone else. But it’s better than nothing, right?
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Since everyone else is posting emails here is the one I sent. Feel free to use any piece of it or the whole thing in its entirety.
Dear Pinellas County School Board,
I recently read a report in the St. Petersburg Times which suggested that the majority of you held the same point of view regarding the teaching of the scientific theory of evolution and natural selection, and inclusion of the religious idea of Intelligent Design (ID).
I, first and foremost, would like to start by reminding you of the (fairly) recent decision in the Kitsmiller vs Dover suit in Pennsylvania. As I am sure you are aware, the court found that the concept of ID failed all three criteria of the lemon test for violation of the Establishment Clause of the Bill of Rights, and as such is not permitted to be taught (at least in the context of a science class). If you are unaware of the particulars of the case, or even if you are, may I suggest a number of videos regarding the trial and the scientific validity of ID, including the recently aired NOVA program (available at http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/id/program.html) and a number of presentations including those by Kenneth Miller (Brown University), and Eugenie Scott (National Center for Science Education) both of which are available on http://www.youtube.com and google videos. Even though the case only holds precedent in that particular federal district I hope you see that when challenged in a court, even in a religious district, with a Bush appointed federal judge, this concept of ID is exposed as having no scientific validity.
I would also like to point out that, based upon the quotes each of you (ID supporters) have given to the St. Petersburg Times, you don’t seem to quite grasp the, possibly subtle, difference between the popular usage of the word theory and the scientific use of the word. The popular usage of the word usually points to any unsubstantiated idea that one comes up with, however, in the scientific community an hypothesis only gets the label of theory after rigorous testing and, usually, refinement.
I would now like to point out to each of you, the holes in logic/reason/judgment you have displayed in your statements to the St. Petersburg Times.
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
Ms. Bostock, based upon this logic, gravity is not scientific fact and must be balanced out by the idea that god is pushing everything down toward the earth, actively holding all of the planets so they don’t’ float away, moving all of the stars around in the galaxy, pushing galaxies together to merge…wow god sure has a lot of hands doesn’t he? Also based upon this logic chemistry is not scientific fact and therefore must be balanced out with the fundamentals of alchemy…I’m really looking forward to turning some lead into gold. Furthermore, astronomy must be balanced out by astrology…It’s not my fault; the stars made me do it.
“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
Ms. O’Shea, the concept of Evolution and Natural Selection has been called the single most unifying principle of biology. Everything we know about biology only makes sense in light of evolution. Clearly it can’t be that important. Trying to keep evolution out of the classroom only hurts the students by making them ignorant. Clearly you don’t want your students to be competitive in the work place.
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.” — Jane Gallucci, Member
Ms. Gallucci, while at first glance what you suggest here sounds reasonable; there are a few problems with it. The first problem is, as stated above, only one of the ideas you want to put forward to your students is a theoryin the scientific form of the word, and therefore only the scientific theory belongs in a science classroom. The second problem here is that you yourself in this quote identify ID as a religious idea; this highlights your motivation for teaching ID as religious in nature and thus violates the test applied by the courts to determine whether an act violates the Establishment Clause (you should take note of this because right here you just lost the court case that will follow if you choose to adopt an ID teaching policy). The next problem here is that you are forcing a false dichotomy. In case you don’t understand what I mean or where I’m coming from I’ll expand on this point. I assume from your statement that you feel that acceptance of evolution and being a religious person are not compatible, and thus accepting evolution means you deny god. This is the way it seems you want to present it to your students, “Either you believe science or you believe in GOD.” This dichotomy does not exist. There are many, many people who do not see evolution and religion as incompatible, including the aforementioned Dr. Miller, and the previous Popes: Pius XII (who held in his encyclical Humani Generis that there was no opposition between evolution and the doctrine of the faith about man and his vocation), and John Paul II who said the following in an address to the Pontifical Academy of Sciences [Oct 22, 1996] :
“Taking into account the state of scientific research at the time as well as of the requirements of theology, the encyclical Humani Generis considered the doctrine of “evolutionism” a serious hypothesis, worthy of investigation and in-depth study equal to that of the opposing hypothesis. Pius XII added two methodological conditions: that this opinion should not be adopted as though it were a certain, proven doctrine and as though one could totally prescind from revelation with regard to the questions it raises. He also spelled out the condition on which this opinion would be compatible with the Christian faith, a point to which I will return. Today, almost half a century after the publication of the encyclical, new knowledge has led to the recognition of the theory of evolution as more than a hypothesis. [Aujourdhui, près dun demi-siècle après la parution de l'encyclique, de nouvelles connaissances conduisent à reconnaitre dans la théorie de l'évolution plus qu'une hypothèse.] It is indeed remarkable that this theory has been progressively accepted by researchers, following a series of discoveries in various fields of knowledge. The convergence, neither sought nor fabricated, of the results of work that was conducted independently is in itself a significant argument in favor of this theory…With man, then, we find ourselves in the presence of an ontological difference, an ontological leap, one could say. However, does not the posing of such ontological discontinuity run counter to that physical continuity which seems to be the main thread of research into evolution in the field of physics and chemistry? Consideration of the method used in the various branches of knowledge makes it possible to reconcile two points of view which would seem irreconcilable. The sciences of observation describe and measure the multiple manifestations of life with increasing precision and correlate them with the time line. The moment of transition into the spiritual cannot be the object of this kind of observation, which nevertheless can discover at the experimental level a series of very valuable signs indicating what is specific to the human being. But the experience of metaphysical knowledge, of self-awareness and self-reflection, of moral conscience, freedom, or again, of aesthetic and religious experience, falls within the competence of philosophical analysis and reflection while theology brings out its ultimate meaning according to the Creator’s plans.”
Furthermore, if you’re willing to bring religion into the science class then why are you only contrasting Evolution with ID? There are a plethora of other creation stories that hold just as much weight as ID does. If, as you claim, your students “should be given the opportunity to view all theories” then you must have no problem with them being told about: Izanagi and Izanami cast a jewel crested spear into the ocean from on top of Ama-no-ukihashi to create the land (Shinto), Brahma created the Earth from the lotus flower and then formed the plants and animals (one of several Hindu stories), or even how 400 years ago the Flying Spaghetti Monster created mankind by mistake while in a drunken stupor and then created a slew of evidence to make us think that evolution was true, just to test our faith (don’t forget to include the part about how the decline in the number of pirates is why global warming happens, no really they have a scientific graph and everything). Wow there are so many different stories that you will need to include in order for the students to hear “all theories” that you’re going to need a separate science class called “the origin of life”, so that the teachers in the other classes actually have some time to teach the rest of Biology.
“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.” — Carol Cook, Member
Ms. Cook, since every counterpoint I would make to this statement has already been included in this letter I’ll refrain from restating them.
In the end I’m not trying to convince you that evolution is right and ID is wrong because I feel that this would be tantamount to me bashing my head against wall. What I am trying to convince you of is that only one theory regarding the origins of life belongs in the science classroom, the one that is based upon science. Religious views regarding the origin of mankind belong in church. If you attempt to make policy that ID is to be taught alongside evolution, the results will be you losing in court and wasting a load of the school district’s money defending a policy that you should know ahead of time will not hold. Likely another thing will also happen, as we saw in Dover, all of you voting for imposing religious views on science students will be ousted from your positions in the next election and replaced by people who are either more reasonable or better educated, or both. Of course these predictions stem merely from my own personal hypotheses and are, thus, in need of testing, I would love for you to help me make them scientific theory.
Thank you for taking the time to read this (and I hope you did read it in its entirety),
Drew Walton
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Sent my support to the school board:
Dear Pinellas County School Board members
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I would like to offer to you my support for your stand in favour of intelligent design. It is wonderful that some people still have such admirable conviction that they stand behind their beliefs when faced with 200 years of scientific findings.
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I would like to offer one more to the list of possible theories on the birth of the earth and development of life. You have surely received great support from pastafarians advertising the Flying Spaghetti Monster version of this issue and I also hear that someone brought forth the Norse version. The following is the old Finnish version of things from The Kalevala: The daughter of the Ether lifted her knee from the water when she saw the pochard bird (a bird that resembles a duck) looking for a place to build her nest. The bird built her nest on the knee and lay 7 eggs, 6 golden and 1 iron, and began to hatch the eggs. This heated up the knee of the hapless water-mother (aka. the daughter of the Ether) so that she thought her knee was burning. She moved and all the eggs fell into the water shattering in pieces. The pieces then formed the earth, heaven, stars, moonbeabs, sunshine and clouds. Then the water-mother, who was pregnant, gave birth to the first man Wainamoinen.
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You can find the full story in the beautifully written epic Kalevala. An English translation is available at http://www.sacred-texts.com/neu/kveng/kvrune01.htm
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This story also corrects some of the gender bias that is present in many other version of this issue, since the dauther of the Ether known as Ilmatar is clearly a woman.
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I wish you all a wonderful celebration of the birth (or rebirth) of the sun or sun god – aka. Christmas. I am confident that people so learned in and pro ancient beliefs are informed that the upcoming festival is one of the oldest festivities of humankind and has been celebrated for many millenia around the time of the winter solstice, and only converted into the current birth-of-christ festival around 300 AD.
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Yours truly
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JT, your response was the bees knees man…
I noticed that many many people have spent considerable time responding to these . . . are they really former teachers?
I for one will take the time reading all of your responses.
I wrote:
As a student and teacher, a father and United States Citizen, I think classroom curriculum is the most important issue we face concerning education in our society. I also feel the education of our youth is our nations most important issue, even surpassing insurance issues and social security.
The question isn’t about teaching Intelligent Design. The question is which class should it be discussed in? It is not Science. Saying that our universe is too complex to have been accidental is an argument, albeit a weak one.
Teach I D in a theology class, a mythology class, a sociology class, and even a politics class, but leave the science classes to recordable pieces of information that are measurable.
Finding a bird in Africa and a bird on Madigascar that are almost exactly alike except for a stripe on the wing, points to evolution. These animals are distant relatives but have evolved seperately. THAT is scientific evidence. Fossils are scientific evidence. Fruit fly breeding and records of mutations are scientific evidence. I D theory has none of this.
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
Nancy, please read the last paragraph again.
“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
Peggy, how would you have handled the ‘controversy’ of segregation?
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.” — Jane Gallucci, Member
Jane, I think that children should be taught about all religioins and allowed to choose (or not choose ) for themselves which one they think fits best in their lives, but only when they are adults.
“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.” — Carol Cook, Member
Carol, my previous comment also applies here.
J to the C
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WONDERFUL! Soon FSMism will be taught too! We will have our day and this science and Intel Design business will both be driven out.
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Dear Pinellas County School Board,
Although I do not live in Florida I would like to congratulate you on the recent decision to include Intelligent Design in the science curriculum. Although I am not a Christian, I am glad to finally see that equally viable explanations to our existence are finally going to be taught to our children. I hope that since you have now broken down the wall to learning more teachings will be made available to students. I think it would be appropriate that at minimum the theory of Intelligent Design by the Flying Spaghetti Monster (FSM) be included in the curricula. If you look at the evidence that leads Pastafarians to believe that the universe was created by an invisible Flying Spaghetti Monster, I think you will find it at least as compelling in its documentation as that of the Evolution and the Christian theory of Intelligent Design.
As Jane Gallucci said,
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.”
Please let me know at your soonest convenience when you will consider introducing additional theories to the curricula, I would be happy to send you hard evidence that buttresses the FSM Intelligent Design theory, or travel to give an in-person presentation about it.
Kind Regards,
my name
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Whilst surfing the Wikipedia entries about ID, I noticed that people in Pinellas County have a history of trying to promote ID.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Of_Pandas_and_People
“In March 1990, the school board in Pinellas County, Florida rejected an appeal by a retired minister “to adopt the textbook Of Pandas and People that would offer a creationist’s view”. [23]”
in the “Kitzmiller v. Dover Area School District” case the book “Of Pandas and People” was the book recommended to the students to get the creationist view. It’s published by the texas group Foundation for Truth and Ethics (provided it’s their truth I guess) Perhaps some locals have been trying to change the board for one more amenable to their views since.
Yun Long
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Are these guys doing this on their own bat or have they been encouraged?
Further reading since my last post. It was suggested in Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_More_Law_Center#Notable_Cases_Involving_the_Thomas_More_Law_Center” that “theThomas More Law Center travelled the country shopping for a school board willing to withstand a lawsuit as a test case for the teaching of intelligent design in public schools”. Given that someone in Pinellas County previously tried to get ID in the curriculum perhaps the TMC is looking for another go at a constitutional challenge. It cost Dover $1 mill in legal costs which was only half the full bill, hopefully Pinellas County won’t be stuck with a similiar bill.
Still flying
Yun Long
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@JC,
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Thank you very much. I’ve had a bit of practice.
Yours was also spot on.
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JT
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@Surcouf
I was moved by this:
“The whole civilized world laughing about you isn’t only a pity, it disqualifies America as a leader.”
I may be a United States Citizen, but I totally agree with you. You’re right, our future doesn’t look bright.
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My letter to the fine folks at pinella county……….happy chriFSMas !!
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Esteemed members of the board.
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It has come to my attention that you are seeking to teach i.d.(intelligent design)
in the classroom, BRAVO i say to you.
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We(Canadians)are overjoyed that someone has at long last realized the importance of teaching our children of the omnipotent & omnipresent force that must surely be responsible for creating all we know & see. That you wish to teach this in a science class, where conjecture, speculation & baseless theories are quickly laid to rest, shows great conviction & clarity of thought.
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Im sure I speak on behalf of Pastafarians around the world when I offer you heartfelt thanks & sincerest congratulations. Just knowing the children(that YOU are CHARGED with EDUCATING) are going recieve equal parts “Flying Spaghetti Monsterism” & equal parts of the so called “evolutionism”… warms the cockles of my heart.
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I am however at this point, compelled to warn you of the arduous gauntlet you are about to run.Recently the Kansas school board sought to bring the glorious truth of the NoodleGod to its fine students. Unfortunately the board folded like a house of cards under the crushing weight of a most effective write-in campaign. This campaign was undoubtedly organized by angry, uneducated, biggoted & overzealous nutjobs!(in other words, EVANGELICAL christians.) Please do not be swayed by the pummelling or humiliation they absorbed.
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Your utmost conviction & steadfastness will be mandatory to overcome the lofty ambitions of the BIG 3(judaism, islam & christianity). Please do not lose sight of the fact that a science class is not the place for blasphemous, heretical half truths. Rather, it is fertile ground for the cultivation of the splediferousness(i think that is a word) that is FSM theory.
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In closing let me add that the FSM movement could use many more clear-thinking, open minded & passionate indivduals, such as yourselves. A hearty “welcome to the CLUB” to you all.
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Salutations & Solidarity.
Paul M.
Windsor,Ontario
Canada…confirmed Pirate.
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@Breakinpoint
“What is it with Floridians now a days. we are causing so much ruckus. (Sex ed and Intelligent design)”
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It’s ingrained in Floridians Breakpoint. ID or sex ed aren’t the first instances where Florida causes trouble. Remember that presidential election?
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@Bob
“Evolution is falsifiable. Intelligent Design is not. So it does not belong in a science class. That is not to say Intelligent Design is not what actually happened.”
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The Intelligent Designer concept is indeed not falsifyable. But in their attempts to give ID some scientific meat on the bones the IDiots have come up with various claims that are falsifyable. Irreducible complexity springs readily to mind. Behe had come up with some examples of systems that were supposedly IR. But parts the bacterial flagellum, the blood clotting cascade and the immune system all turned out to have useful funtions by themselves. So while the central point to ID is not falsifyable other parts of it are and indeed these claims have been falsified.
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@Jennyanydots
I just read your letter. Fantastic!
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Dear Dutch,
It seems that we Floridians, having enough of the “Flori-Duh!” jokes over recent elections are determined to refine the phrase in new terms.
Florida is not next to the bottom of secondary education rankings in the US for nothing! (And, remember, the US is 25th in rank worldwide for science education!)
Flori-Duh! Forever.
Let’s hear it for our school boards!
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My email :
Dear Pinellas County School Board,
I applaud your efforts to open up the curriculum to alternative teachings. While I am not personally Christian, nor do I personally agree with the theory of alternative design, I recognize that it is backed up by equal scientific proof as my own belief. As such, I cannot help but agree with your support of the inclusion of intelligent design in your curriculum – that is, as long as it is coupled by the inclusion of Pastafarianism as an equally viable explanation.
The exposure of students to alternate theories besides Evolution is a step in the right direction, as long as we make sure that all theories have to be supported by science – after all, it *is* a science class, not a religion class. It is only fair to expose students to alternative theories and let their personal beliefs help them decide which one they should view as accurate.
Pastafarianism states that the world was created by our deity, the Flying Spaghetti Monster. I recognize that you believe in a different God, but I am confident that my deity is the true one – still, I recognize your right to make your own choices. We believe that the Flying Spaghetti Monster first created the universe as a mountain, trees, and a midget, (spelled as the FSM sees it, “midgit”, most often). He (or she, based upon one’s beliefs) created this in one day, then finished the rest of the universe in three. It took so long because, well, it is a rather large place.
This explanation is widely endorsed as a viable explanation that goes alongside evolution and intelligent design. Many PHDs have expressed their personal support for this theory – a few can be found on http://www.venganza.org/evidence/endorsements1 and three other pages on the same site.
I know that your personal choice of intelligent design is backed up by many hard scientific facts, but I feel confident the theory of Pastafarianism will draw the support of at least an equal amount of the student body if taught alongside the other choices. After all, we have numerous well-regarded scientists endorsing our religion and its proposed explanations for natural phenomena. It cannot be denied that we have at an equal level of proof for our claims as your own personal religious choice. There is nothing wrong with your beliefs, nor is there anything wrong with them being taught in the school. To do otherwise would be a form of discrimination – the same can be said of not teaching Pastafarianism in schools as well. I am confident that you will see the sensibility of such an argument and will support our theory’s inclusion as well.
If you have any questions regarding our beliefs or our scientific basis, feel free to visit http://www.venganza.org or respond to this email address.
With Deep Respect,
x
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@DPG
“So while the central point to ID is not falsifyable” Falsifyable no, Fairytale yes.
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@Rumplestiltskin
“@DPG
“So while the central point to ID is not falsifyable” Falsifyable no, Fairytale yes.”
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Indeed, I was certainly not implying that the central concept of ID had any credibility just because it’s not falsifyable. For instyanmce, I couldn’t falsify the idea of the ancient Egyptian gods. I couldn’t possibly write down the 100% certain proof that Isis et al are not lurking behind some very distant, as yet undiscovered planet somewhere. But even the IDiots would agree that that doesn’t make the ancient Egyptian gods anything real.
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What do you expect from a place nick named “God’s Waiting Room”?
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@DPG
The ancient Egyptian gods were one of the first pantheons of deities to raise their ugly heads. Surely that must give them some credibility? Everything since is really just plagiarism. I’ve seen Star Gate, there are many logical explanations for the possible existence of such divinity.
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Dear Mrs. (schoolboardmember),
My name is Elliott Averett. I recently was informed of your support for the teaching of intelligent design in schools. Excellent! At last, valid scientific theory can be brought down to the level of baseless conviction! However, I have one small concern. I myself am a member of the Church of The Flying Spaghetti Monster. Needless to say, I am all for intelligent design in schools, but only as long as out version of creation is taught alongside yours. You can learn more about my faith at http://www.venganza.org As you may be aware, our faith dictates that Pastafarianism must be taught while wearing full pirate regalia. I am afraid that if you do not meet our demands, legal action may be taken.
Noodly Holidays,
Elliott A
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Quite obviously, based upon the quoted remarks, Nancy, Peggy, Jane and Carol are intellectually and spiritually impressive gals.
So impressive I can’t help but try and picture the four of them in swimwear. Does anyone know if the awesome foursome has ever posed for a magazine, calendar or video or something?
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@Rumplestiltskin
“The ancient Egyptian gods were one of the first pantheons of deities to raise their ugly heads. Surely that must give them some credibility? Everything since is really just plagiarism. I’ve seen Star Gate, there are many logical explanations for the possible existence of such divinity.”
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I’ve seen Star Gate too. That ‘divinity’ was indeed distinctly technical in nature. :)
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Ironically, our children will not be entirely sheltered from the fact that there is controversy on this issue. Kids are curious. It will become a hobby for our kids to seek out evolutionary studies and think for themselves at some age of reasoning. Feed the controversy!
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I just sent this to the individual geniuses and the whole Pinellas School Board. Again, thanks for the e-mail info!
I personally don’t believe in Heaven or Hell. However if you want to cling to the belief in an afterlife, a better way to look at it is that THOSE WHO EMBRACED HONESTY WILL BE REWARDED WITH HEAVEN WHILE THOSE WHO PROMOTED SUPERSTITIOUS LIES THAT GO AGAINST ALL LOGIC AND EVIDENCE WILL BE PUNISHED WITH HELL.
Scientific investigation not only fails to prove religion right, it exposes as fallacious what is written as truth in “Holy Books”. I believe that this is your objection to teaching evolution. The real question is; Why? You are bringing woe upon yourself when you promote authority over truth, instead of truth over authority.
Darwin’s discovery of evolution completely rules out the possibility that man came from some dirt that a God used to make an image of Himself out of, and that woman came from a rib of this dirt-man.
Compare the amount of interlocking data from every applicable scientific field including geology, physics, and even molecular biology, all having observational experiments done, that test and prove the hypotheses of evolution occurring, with the DISCREDITED FAIRY TALE – A BIG INVISIBLE MONSTER THAT NOBODY HAS EVER SEEN OR HEARD DID IT.
Adapted from various posts on Church Of The Flying Spaghetti Monster website. Edited and with additions from Fizzmick PaChee
Reverently,
Fizzmick PaChee
E-mail fizzmickpachee@gmail.com
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Here’s my letter. I sent to Ms. Bostock who was quoted…“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” I took this idea of “balancing it out” and ran with it.
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Hope ya like it!
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———————————————-
Ms. Bostock,
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As the subject line states, I’m with you…I like the idea of introducing more topics and/or topics with a different point of view to help ‘balance’ things out. To the best of my knowledge, nobody has a ‘lock’ on the correct idea. No one has a ‘lock’ on the correct theory. (At least to the best of my knowledge…)
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Apart from teaching Intelligent Design (ID) to help balance out Evolution, I would suggest that other alternate theories/ideas are also taught.
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May I suggest a few…
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-Gravity is at odds with the second law of thermodynamics. They work towards different goals. Gravity helps order things, while the second law of thermodynamics states that everything is working towards disorder. Imagine 30 bowling balls floating around in space. Eventually, gravity will bring the balls together. There is more order in this system. One clump of balls is a more ordered system than 30 balls spread out. Why would gravity make things clump together (a more ordered system) when the second law of thermodynamics states that the balls should not clump together and there should be disorder. The only conclusion is that one idea is wrong. I believe, among others, that gravity is wrong. We believe that an intelligent being is pushing or pulling things together. “Things fall not because they are acted upon by some gravitational force, but because a higher intelligence, ‘God’ if you will, is pushing them down,” said Gabriel Burdett, who holds degrees in education, applied Scripture, and physics from Oral Roberts University. Those of us who believe in Intelligent Falling advocate that Intelligent Falling should be taught in school along with the theory of gravity so that students can make “an informed decision.”
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-The moon is made of cheese.
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I thank you for your time.
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Sincerely,
C. Felix
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I had sent a letter to Polk County Board and now I am going to send one to these ones as well. Being proactive pays! Thank you to Bobby.
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The inevitable flooding of the state of Florida as a consequence of global warming is beginning to like a plus, no?
Here’s tweaked version of my letter to Polk County now addressed to the Pinellas Board.
To The Pinellas County Board of Education:
I applaud you for your courage and conviction in advocating for a balanced science curriculum in Pinellas County.
Despite the fact that science embodies logic, reason, evidence, and the peer review process, nothing can trump our faith that there is another, greater explanation for the universe. That’s what my parents taught me, and that’s what their parents taught them, and so on. Could all of my ancestors stretching back thousands of years be wrong?
But, I implore you all not to shortchange your students. While Intelligent Design (”ID”) has no physical evidence to support it as a scientific theory, it is not the only alternative to rational thought out there. Please consider incorporating the theory of the Flying Spaghetti Monster (”FSM”) into your science curriculum as well. While I grant you that there is far more logic behind FSM than ID, I can also assure you that, at its core, FSM is really based on faith and therefore passes your rigid test as appropriate material for your children.
I thank you for your consideration. If you would like to learn more about my faith, I would be most happy to enlighten you.
R’ Amen,
Daren Niklerog
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Dec 26, 2007
NOTE to Pastafarian Readers:
I sent this message to Chairperson Bostock, and a slightly modified message to Board Members Carol Cook and Jane Galluci. Amazing place, Florida!
Mike
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Dear Chairperson Bostock:
As a citizen of Florida, and a retired (2003) professor of Neuroscience at Florida State University who taught generations of ill-prepared Florida students for 35 years, I am writing to urge that you fully implement the kind of balanced educational program for Pinellas students in the life sciences as envisioned in the quote attributed to you below:
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out. ” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
It must be reassuring to parents in Pinellas to have a Chairperson of the Board as open-minded as you seem to be, and so concerned about balance in this one branch of science. But, surely there is balance required in physics and chemistry, too? For, example, a nice section on Georgia Governor Sonny Perdue’s recent initiative to override the laws of physics by his Call for Massive Prayer Campaign to stop the drought in the Southeast would provide an excellent balance to scientists’ claims about why weather occurs. At this time of year, a unit concerned with virgin births would provide some serious balance to certain one-sided claims about reproduction made in Pinellas Biology classes. A unit on the raising of dead people to life could be inserted for balance at the Easter season. Please note that these suggestions are simply meant as examples to stimulate you and the Board to expand your “fair and balanced” approach more fully in the Pinellas science curriculum. Please don’t stop at Intelligent Design — it would be so unfair to your students.
But, since you seem to be focused on ID as providing “the” only balance to evolution in your schools’ science training, I must provide another specific recommendation that you seem to have overlooked.
A worthy competitor to ID that you should include for balance in your evolution units is the powerful explanatory system developed by the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster . You could instruct your life-science teachers to review, and become certified in, the Church’s ideas by studying the information provided on the web site: http://www.venganza.org/ . This is not meant as a crazy comment. It is dead serious. Just as serious as you must be about ID.
Good luck with your attempts to provide future generations of Florida students with the kind of excellence (and balance) in science training that will continue to keep Florida near the bottom of national and international scientific literacy and competitiveness.
Sincerely,
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They say that science should be balanced by religion. If that’s the goal, then I say you balance school with church. But you don’t put church in school. This school ruling would be just the beginning if allowed to run its course because this totalitarian mentality would lead to their own kind of forced busing. This school board evidently would make church compulsory if they could, with police forcing everyone onto buses on Sunday and guiding them at gunpoint to their pew. Nobody is hindering their religious practices, and they badly need some perspective. I’m not from Florida, but I blush for you.
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@ C_Felix…
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-The moon is made of cheese ?
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-I KNEW IT !!
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Paul m.
Windsor,Ontario
Canada…confirmed pirate.
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I’m wondering if this is now the only school district in the country attempting to get a biblical explanation of reality into the public school curriculum. If it is, then obviously a lot of progress is being made. I remember a few years back, “creationists” had made significant inroads into a number of school districts by running stealth “fundamentalist” candidates for school boards. I think a supreme court decision a few years back permanently put the kybosh on an explicitly theological set of teachings being advanced as an alternative to evolution to explain biological change and diversity.
ID is of course the counterpunch to society drawing that line in the sand. If only one school district in the entire country can get it advanced that is probably progress.
This hopeful counterassessment must, however, be counterbalanced by the fact that many of these fundamentalist parents have opted out of the school system for “home skulin’” where there are not governmental controls on the curriculum. You just have to wonder how many kids will be deprived of their birth right to a quality education (and not just a quality science education) because spineless politicians have chosen to function as enablers for agendas of these extremists. And you have to wonder what else is being taught–any literature but the bible? How about history–is there some sort of fundamentalist revisionist version of American and/or World history being taught? Civics–What is taught about the constitution and the rights of non-believers?, about civil disobedience? What is being taught about the history of the universe and the earth?
It seems incredible to me that homes that don’t send their children to school do not receive a visit from a truant officer. After all, how many of these parents have teaching certificates, and how many of these homes are chartered as schoold? How many of these parents can demonstrate they are competent to teach, and how many of these kids can pass standardized tests? It just seems that society allowing this movement to flourish is in many ways a capitulation to these American Christian Taliban types.
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My email sent to all board members:
There is no controversy between Creationism / I.D. and evolution anywhere on the planet outside of bible-belt USA. Why do you think that is?
Please educate yourselves, for the sake of future generations:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution
http://evolution.berkeley.edu/
If you didn’t follow the Dover County case, again, please educate yourselves so as not to become the next laughing stock of Idiot USA:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/id/
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All that’s missing from the mugshot line-up in this post is a picture of Sherri Shepherd. :)
Kirk T: “I’d really like to see a form letter that we can all use to send to these people. Something so I don’t sound like the pissed-off person that I am.”
I respectfully disagree with that. It’s better to get a variety of arguments, in the hope that one of them might work. If you’re pissed off, say so. Others can use FSM sarcasm / humor and others scientific argument. It’s all good.
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@Mike
Very good letter, thanks for composing and sending that.
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The Moon is made of Brie!!!
Curse the infidels who voice the heresy that it is made of Swiss Cheese.
The streets will flow with the blood of the non-believers!!!
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The moon is made of swiss.
Look at all those holes in it; and you were told they were craters from impacts.
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Here’s the response I got. Is that what everyone else received? It’s more than can be said for Polk county though…
Your e-mail will be shared with the Board Members, as well as with the Superintendent and his staff.
Debbie
Deborah E. Beaty
Administrative Assistant to the Board
727-588-6300 Fax 727-588-6477
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It seems like this school board believes that they should bring their religious ID beliefs into science classes. I think this is only fair if there is a regulatory “Church Board” formed where members of the community are able to change the curriculum of sunday school classes and the content of sermons, as well as make decisions on Church policies such as gay marriage and support of contraception. Fair’s fair right?
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When are these ID people going to realize that while they may disagree with evolution, evolution doesn’t disagree with them. Evolution has nothing to say about the beginning of life, it’s only a theory of the change of life over time. The theory of ID and the biblical scripture and the theory of cosmogenesis (where life came here from extra-planetary origins) are all genesis theories. They all address the question of abiogenesis, life coming from non-life… which presumably would have had to happen at some point.
I don’t think it’s inappropriate to make comparative studies of genesis theories part of a curriculum. Although, there is no evidence on either side that is conclusive. No chemist has created life from a soup of amino acids, and no ID proponent will ever be able to prove their theory. The chemist’s theory has not been disproven, which still places it in the realm of science. The ID believer can never prove their theory scientifically, it is not testable, and is therefore a philosophy, and incompatible with science. Perhaps a philosophy class could tackle this question more appropriately.
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irate Pirate
Dec 26th, 2007 at 9:38 pm
@ C_Felix…
.
-The moon is made of cheese ?
.
-I KNEW IT !!
.
Paul m.
*
Ramen Crusader
Dec 27th, 2007 at 3:56 pm
The Moon is made of Brie!!!
*
Goat’s cheese I hope :) Absolutely lovely cheese :)))
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What a wonderful example of the diversity of cultures that make up our Nation. Florida takes the Blue Ribbon, if it be awarded anywhere.
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On the one hand, we have the space launch center at Cape Canaveral; and on the other hand, we have the Polk and Pinellas County Boards of Education. Where else in the world can one find such a perfect contrast between intelligence and enlightenment and blithering ignorance and stupidity?
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Of course, one does have to remember that the intelligence and enlightenment are imports from elsewhere in the United States, while the blithering ignorance and stupidity are typical examples of what might be called native, or home grown Floridian.
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But the ultimate contrast is still priceless.
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Oh, how good it is to know believers still fight the good fight against rationality. Here is what I wrote to the four Pinellas County board members:
Dear Board Members of the Pinellas County School District,
I firmly support your courageous stand against teaching evil-ution to your impressionable and easily misled children. I am a devout member of a minority religious group, the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. You may not have heard of our beliefs but they are very sincere and also quite attractive to children who, as we all know, love spaghetti.
It may not be well known, but the term “noodle” is a nick name from the brain, as in “use your noodle.” This phrase descends, we believe, from the way the Flying Spaghetti Monster touched each human at conception and gave them a little meatball of their very own to use for thinking about where it all comes from and what it all means.
I am so glad to hear you will be teaching alternatives to evil-ution and insist that you include our teachings about the Flying Spaghetti Monster in your new, enlightened science classes. Your pupils may not be able to get into college but they will certainly get into Heaven.
Sincerely yours,
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Here’s my letter. Also, note that I’m from Pinellas County, and in fact helped campaign for Peggy O’Shea when she ran in the late 90’s. (I was dating her daughter, but that’s a story for another place and time).
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My name is Alexander ********, and I am a former student of the Pinellas County school system. I attended Bauder Elementary, Seminole Middle School, and Largo High School. I just wanted to send you a letter telling you how disappointed I am in the PCSB’s opposition to the new standards of teaching evolution in the classroom.
As a non-Christian student being educated in Pinellas County, I put up with the multitude of “holiday” events being passed my way. I was told that the decorated trees and wreaths in the classrooms and hallways were not religious symbols and that the lone menorah in the administration office counter-balanced it and made it okay. I wasn’t offended by the X-mas music being played on school grounds, or the seeming one-sided greetings of “Merry X-mas” I heard from countless teachers or administrators for 3 months every year. I was able to deal with the disbelieving stares and phone-calls to my parents to verify that I wasn’t skipping school but instead observing Jewish holidays throughout the year. I put up with all of this because I knew that, while I was subjected to religious material, it was not taught to me or delivered to me as fact.
Now I understand that a majority of the governing body of the entire school district believes that a religious theory, Intelligent Design, should be delivered to our children in textbooks and lectures under the guise of education. I realize that many people have strong beliefs on this issue one way or another. I also understand your concern with teaching an unproven theory in the classrooms without a counter-point. I’d like to point out a few other theories taught in the classrooms of Pinellas County have do not have counter-points taught along with them:
General Relativity
Plate Tectonics
Universal Theory of Gravity
As you can see, this short list shows ideas that are taught as fact in our schools, based on overwhelming evidence. I’m not saying I disagree with these facts, just the opposite is true. My Pinellas education has shown me to believe my eyes, and to believe the facts. While I am a religious person, I can not in my mind believe that gravity is just G-d pushing down on me. I refuse to believe that the continents of our planet have moved over thousands of years because a higher being is rearranging his living room.
The thought of omitting BOTH the Intelligent Design and Evolutions theories from our science rooms is even worse. If we omitted material from our classrooms due to controversy, we would still believe the world was flat, blood-letting via leaches was healthy, and thunder was the hammer of Thor when he was angry.
This is not the Pinellas County schools I grew up in. I feel ashamed in my home town and my upbringing now. I have since moved away from the Tampa Bay area, and am serving my country in the US Army, stationed at Fort Benning, GA. At this point, I am glad my children will not have to attend public school in Pinellas, as I cannot see any reason to move back there now.
In closing, I applaud the members of the school board who oppose this position. I think we can all agree to keep religious ideals and discussions out of the science room, and in world religious and socials studies realm where they belong.
Sincerely,
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@Tim
I wish I could agree with you, as you bring a great point, but alas I have to disagree. While Evolution merely speculates the beginning of species, most ID people are concerned with the beginning of species. Evolution doesn’t explain the beginning at all, but it was Darwin himself who speculated that evolution causes new species to be born, regardless of size. THIS is EXACTLY what ID debates: sure, evolution can affect a proportion of a population of animals, but it it cannot create new species of larger sizes (such as humans), only God can. If anything, ID terribly distorts Evolution.
Furthermore, I heard about an experiment that physically simulated the beginning of earth in a vacuum as best as possible. While my current knowledge of this experiment says they didn’t manage to make a new life out of it, they DID make organic molecular compounds from it. The finding implies that the speculated beginning of earth can create life, as large amounts of organic molecules often leads to new cells. It may not be solid proof, but it’s getting very close.
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Letter Sent!
Members of the Pinellas County School Board,
It has come to my attention that you intend to include Intelligent Design in your science curriculum along with the theory of evolution. The following statements are included among your rationale for this decision:
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in. ” — Jane Gallucci, Member
“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.” — Carol Cook, Member
I wholeheartedly agree with these statements. Neither side can be proven, and evolution is offensive to a lot of people. We must teach alternate theories so that our children can be informed. However, given that you are obviously informed about the danger of teaching only evolution in the classroom, I’m surprised that you have chosen to omit other plausible explanations for the origin of species. For instance, the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster believes that all species including humans were deposited on Earth by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. This is a perfectly legitimate theory, which has garnered great support from the scientific community. Despite the best efforts of evolutionists everywhere, it has yet to be disproven. Certainly there is a great amount of evidence to support evolution, but since none of were around to witness this fictional process, we are forced to accept that this evidence was placed there by HIS noodly appendage in order to test our faith. (He’s a tricky fellow.)
Since we, as pastafarians are your brothers in your fight to ensure fairness in the classroom, I trust I can count on your support. I hope that if it comes to a vote of the Pinellas County school board, you will vote to have both Intelligent Design and Pastarific Deposition included in the school curriculum alongside evolution.
Regards,
Brian *****
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@Alex,
Great letter. However, blood-letting via leaches is an approved F.D.A. treatment used by plastic surgeons among others. Of course not to let out demons.
Sholom, Fellow Member Of The Tribe,
Fizzmick PaChee
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@ Tar,
I am not familiar with your posts so forgive me if I read your post wrong but it sounds like you are debating the beginning of a species with tim. Although I don’t agree with you on your religious beliefs, you are free to believe what you want. The debate here though is just that, beliefs. Until I.D. can bring something to the table other than belief or faith to support their idea, it has no place in realm of scientific theories founded on years and years of research and testing challenging their validity, or the classrooms they are taught in. Thank you.
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HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!! the ID guys are heading to Texas!!!!!!!!!!!! We have Bush’s choice as governor and he’s already fired the director of science education in the state for speaking out against ID. Please, Mighty creator of all and all creators and creations, Flying Spaghetti Monster, come to Texas and thump Perry with your noodly appendage!!!
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Members of the Pinellas County School Board,
Thank you for trying to teach theories other than evolution in our schools. You are right to stand by your decision. Evolution is not yet an absolute statement, but a theory. I would especially like to thank the following members for their statements:
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in. ” — Jane Gallucci, Member
“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.” — Carol Cook, Member
I can’t agree with you more. Evolution has offended many people, especially when it has not been proven yet. We must teach our children all theories on how men come into being so that they can make a rational decision themselves. If there is anything I object to, however, it is the fact that Intelligent Design seem to be the other “alternative” you are offering, particularly since there is another theory that is currently growing in popularity. Before you decide to change our school’s curriculum, please take some time to read over the materials available at the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
The church not only provides a theory that is becoming increasingly popular, it also provides many scientific evidence to back up its plans. Therefore, it makes perfect sense that all of us originated from an omnipotent being known as the Flying Spaghetti MonsterI, who created the universe out of his image, and deposited human beings on Earth. Furthermore, despite the best efforst of evolutionists everywhere, it has yet been disproven. On the contrary, there is so much evidence supporting the theory, we can almost say for certain that we are, in fact, created by the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
As a pastafarian, I would very much like to see my religion introduced in our classroom, and I trust that, since the Pinellas County school board would like to give students the opportunity to view all theories on how men come into being, you will also introduce our almighty Flying Spaghetti Monster to our student. Once again, thank you for your efforts to expand our students’ minds, and rest assured that my fellow pastafarians and I will continue to fight for your cause by introducing our supreme being to the world.
Sincerely,
William
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HELP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! cic is right. Bobby please post the texas situation on the board to alert everyone. I just googled Texas school board and sure enough, another weed of I.D. is attempting to pop up in Texas (State Board, TEA). I say it’s time to employ the FSM brand of weed control in that area before to many others pop up.
RAmen to all!!!
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Came across this from Florida…County and State situation..
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Florida Citizens for Science: Defending and promoting sound science in Florida
“This list is a reference for any and all pro-science activists out there so you can see where you need to concentrate your efforts when it comes to supporting evolution against anti-scientific “other theories.
These are people who have stated they have a problem with teaching evolution without some type of so-called balance…..”
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http://www.flascience.org/wp/
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Also…not sure if this has already been posted..
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“ACLU to Florida Board of Education: Don’t Allow Religious Groups to Force Their Beliefs Into Science Classes..Disguising Creationism as Science Would Be Unconstitutional” (FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:
Tuesday, December 18, 2007)
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http://www.aclufl.org/news_events/index.cfm?action=viewRelease&emailAlertID=3194&src=rss
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Wow..good to know being that I’m a mother of two children in Pinellas schools.. not too surprising though considering my son comes home from school talking about Jesus. I ask where do you hear this and he responds with “my teacher told me”.
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Was sitting in a hospital (!) waiting room yesterday and discovered a great magazine called “Skeptical Inquirer” – many Pastafarians may well have found it already. Anyway, a mid-year issue contained a nice article by a guy who actually debates creationists more or less on-stage; he had many important observations, amongst which were that you’re kind of in a double bind: debating creationisti lends them a sort of legitimacy they really don’t deserve, but NOT debating them proves you’re chicken. He also remarked that they generate more scientific nonsense in a few hours than you can refute in a week. So – be alert and crafty; Pastafarians, smite them with your cutlass hip and thigh – and ass!
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@Apprentice Frederic Dec 31st, 2007 at 7:45 am
“debating creationist lends them a sort of legitimacy they really don’t deserve,”
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Yep! I’m convinced of paid IDiots whose only job is to keep up the appearances of a *big debate*
They bring up the same fallacies over and over again on the same blog no many how many times their BS is adequately refuted with solid evidence. They change the subject after a solid thrashing, only to bring it up further down the line when they need to change the subject once again! Nothing but an endless circle. PB on the BBC Will & Crawley religion blog and Phillip on the “Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed” are just two that come immediately to mind as dedicated salesmen of *the Big debate*.
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“but NOT debating them proves you’re chicken.”
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I don’t think any of them have any serious intentions of convincing rational educated or simple aware objective people. I think they aim at preaching to the choir, (keep the sheep in the flock….lots of reputable easily accessible free info on net), and maybe convincing any ill informed fence-sitters. They basically try to run a popularity contest and it’s all *schoolyard* level at that!
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Their intention is to vote God in! Why they always exaggerate how many support them. A favourite of mine is when they pull out all the theistic scientists name but neglect to mention how many of them (not affiliated with DI or AiG) adamantly support evolution……kinda pisses them off when you remind them of that :)
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“He also remarked that they generate more scientific nonsense in a few hours than you can refute in a week.”
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Yep…in one post even :(
After over a year of dealing with them…they still leave me speechless at the crap they spout. Unfortunately their intended targets have no idea it’s absolute crap! :(
I think the thing is not to let them have the offensive of just trying to pick holes in everything and putting the other side on the defensive. His Noodlyness is a great help there :)
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They are the ones challenging so they need to present an argument in support of their IDiocy, rather than just trying to attack those they challenge. Just today I read a post trying to argue that evolutionists were only out to put God out of business, so it was therefore them who were the challengers. Fundi logic :p
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Hail His Noodly Appendages
RAmen
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@Wench Nikkiee:
I appreciate your note! It sounds like you’ve been in enough serious boarding parties to qualify as a Lady Pirate Captain-ess (you pick the rank). I would be honored as an apprentice to carry your cutlass….
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And may you be carried into the New Year safe in His Noodly Appendages
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This is my entry. It pretty much the same as the one I sent to the Polk County school Board with a few tweaks and a paragraph about the CoFSM
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Dear Members of the Pinellas County School Board
Please forgive me if you receive two copies of this letter, but I felt this issue is important enough that I should send it to the school board email address as well as each of you individually to ensure that you have the opportunity to read it.
I am delighted that you are considering ignoring Judge Jones’ ruling in Kitzmiller v Dover School District on the question of whether teaching Intelligent Design is in violation of the First amendment of our Constitution. As you probably know in that case Judge Jones ruled that :
“The proper application of both the endorsement and Lemon tests to the facts of this case makes it abundantly clear that the Board’s ID Policy violates the Establishment Clause. In making this determination, we have addressed the seminal question of whether ID is science. We have concluded that it is not, and moreover that ID cannot uncouple itself from its creationist, and thus religious, antecedents.”
In short, the judge ruled that Intelligent Design is not science and is so bound in religion that it is the same as teaching religion and therefore violates the first amendment.
But I digress, as I said I am delighted that you have taken up the question of teaching alternative theories to the origin of the universe and couldn’t agree more with Ms. Gallucci when she said “I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all (italics mine) theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.” . The operative word here being ‘ALL’.
I believe the reason Judge Jones was able to rule against the Dover District using the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment is because they were only presenting a single alternative faith based theory to evolution. If you do in fact choose to add Intelligent Design to your science curriculum, I would respectfully suggest that you include other theories to avoid conflict with the Establishment Clause of the Constitution of the United States.
While it would be ideal to teach every single theory of the origin of the universe as Ms. Gallucci suggests, we all know how impractical that would be because, well, there are just so darn many. To that end, along with intelligent design, I would suggest that you add these competing theories to your science curriculum : Hindu, Buddhist, Shinto, Native American, Zoroastrian and Wiccan. In addition you should probably include at least some traditional African theories for balance, and please, don’t forget the Dreamtime theories of the Australian Aborigines (one of my favorites). The ‘classic theories’ such as the Greek, Roman and Old Norse can probably be safely ignored as they have so few adherents today that you are not very likely to receive many complaints about their exclusion, but you should check with your legal advisers to be sure.
I would also like to encourage you to examine a new and and exciting theory for your science curriculum: Pastafarianism . In brief this theory states that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster in such a way that mimics the scientific data we have collected to support the theories of the big bang and evolution. Pastafarianism is quickly being accepted by many people around the world and I am sure will be considered a mainstream religion in short time. I would like to add that along with offering an alternative explanation for life, the universe and everything, Pastafarianism also offers an alternative theory to the thorny problem of global warming. Followers of the Flying Spaghetti Monster have amassed data that shows a direct correlation between the rise in global temperatures and the decrease in the number of pirates in the world. By teaching Pastafarianism, you can teach alternatives to two established scientific theories at the same time. I am sure you can see the economy of adding Pastafarianism to your curriculum. You can find detailed information about this theory at http://www.venganza.org/. I do hope you will take a moment to learn more about Pastafarianism.
In closing let me once again applaud your courage in ignoring Judge Jones’ ruling and encourage you to continue your quest to teach our children ALL competing theories of the origin of the universe.
Respectfully yours
Nicole XXXXXXX
“There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly
what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There
is another theory which states that this has already happened.” -
Douglas Adams
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Ug, it just shows their ignorance of things scientific. It always boils down to their lack of understanding of the word theory in the scientific sense.
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These people are right on, but they need to go farther. As a wiccan, I think universal gravitation is only a theory and the Wiccan theory of Intelligent Gravitation ought to be taught. Teach the controversy I say.
Specifically, we could dress physics teachers in wide brimmed floppy conical hats with long flowing black robes. They could put on silly putty noses with several warts (complete with hairs growing out of the warts). And teach that well designed broomsticks and unwavering belief in Wiccanism converys the power of flight to all.
For a final exam, the treachers could find two ten story buildings each with flat roofs, and have the children prove that Einstein and Newton were espousing unproven theory by having the entire class, brooms in hand, step off the roof of one of the buildings and fly to the neighboring roof several hundred feet away.
Imagine the triumph over secular humanistic materialistic science we would have on that day, the day on which gravity was proven to be “only a theory”. There would not be a dry eye in the nation when they heard of the triumph over rationalistic science that the school board had given them.
Teach the controversy!
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@ Daren Niklerog – yes, I got the same, but can reassure whoever it was a few pages back that it isn’t just a canned response – I wrote back after, feeling slightly guilty that the poor innocent admin person was being swamped in what should have been a quiet few days, and received a nice reply stating “Yes, we were hoping for that winding down time after the assignment plan issue – but, I do what needs to be done! Merry Christmas to you and yours.”
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Has anybody heard any more substantial follow up yet?
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This morning (in Australia) is the first time I have visited your site.
Have you thought about extending your parody to include an attack on the teaching of Intelligent Weather alongside Meteorology?
In the UK last year when storms caused flodding in Yorkshire, a Bishop publicly lamented that god’s wrath in sending the floods had to do with the diminution of religious belief in the UK and that country’s acceptance of gays.
I emailed a letter to the good Bish. of Carlisle detailing about 12 or so biblical quotes that indicate the different forms of weather attributed to god.
It may behoove you guys to include weather patterns that can be attributed to FSM as a foil against the christians who hold the same view as the good Bish.Is it worth a thought?
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HaHaHa,
here in Europe we are laughing at those crazy ideas some American people have. HaHaHa, it must be a joke to include ID in the school teaching.
It can’t be true, noway.
We teach Science 100% separated from Religion. In the future we are planning to REPLACE “Religion” in school with “Human Relation Knowledge”.
To the Schoolboard: All people of your great country (USA) is only 5% of the world-population. Still 95% think ID is a joke and a repacked creationist stupidity.
Take care, I love your contry and plan to spend 3 weeks in it for vacation, but NOT in Florida.
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This is the letter I sent:
Good day Ms. Bostock. I am writing in response to your comments in the St. Petersburg Times, where you stated, when asked to comment on the specific mention of evolution in the new science standards to be voted on this February, “The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” Ms. Bostock, I couldn’t agree more and I applaud you for taking a stand on this issue.
Evolution is a theory. It is well established, peer-reviewed, so far verified and is accepted by the vast majority of the scientific community, but it still remains just that: a theory. Theories are not 100% fact and should not be threated as such. And that’s my biggest criticism of the scientific method- if you can’t say that something is 100% guarenteed to be true, why bother? Intelligent design answers all of our questions easily- the designer did it! A Christian will say that it was God, an Arab can call the designer Allah, etc. This makes intelligent design so beautiful: there are so many different versions of it!
If you will continue fighting the liberal media and the snobby scientific elite in the name of unbiased science and giving our students a choice, you will have done a great service to America. We’re a democracy, why can’t we let the people decide for themselves what the scientific truth is? But, because science is a democracy, we’ll need multiple viewpoints to be decided on. Evolution, intelligent design, and a third excellent theory known as Flying Spaghetti Monsterism. This theory, which I have decided is the scientific truth, states that the Flying Spaghetti Monster (FSM) created the universe, the mountains, the trees, and the midgits. He created the universe a mere 5000 years ago, but because He is mischievous, He uses his Noodly Appendage to alter the data we think we are empirically observing. I believe that FSMism is the truth. Try to disprove it: you can’t! All your ‘evidence’ against it is only there because the FSM wants you to think that! With a theory so unfalsifiable and therefore true, surely you must agree that students are being done a disservice by not being taught it.
In conclusion, thank you for taking the time to hear my views and beliefs. I hope I was able to convey the importance of teaching this theory to your students. The Church of the Flying Spagheti Monster will of course be able to train the teachers in this alternate theory. I am eagerly awaiting your response, and hope dearly that no legal action will need to be taken. I think we can all look forward to the time when these three theories are given equal time in our science classrooms across the country, and eventually the world; One third time for Intelligent Design, one third time for Flying Spaghetti Monsterism, and one third time for logical conjecture based on overwhelming observable evidence.
Sincerely yours,
J.D. Hutton
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@Pontius Pirate
Nice letter, thanks for sending.
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I am actually a student in Pinellas County and I am appalled by the mere mention that Intelligent Design should be taught in schools. They will not actually be teaching Creation “Science” but Christian Creationism. I can only hope that this intellectual atrocity will be shot down iin our fine system of government.
Don’t pray in my school and I won’t think in your church.
RAmen
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@Esan – Florida has a fine system of government? Where do they hide it?
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Since I have been shut out of registration despite my love for all things pasta, I am using this response as my only available means to start a new campaign. The Texas Higher Education Coordinating Board is considering granting some sort of recognition to an anti evolutionist religious outfit.. See my correspondence below.
Everybody – Get on their case!! The email address for the individual who responded to me is DeJ.Lozada@thecb.state.tx.us
Message:
Dear Mr. xxxxx:
Thank you for your comments to the Texas Higher Education Coordinating Board.
Please find below a link to information that should prove useful. After reviewing the material, please feel free to contact us with further comments and questions.
We are all stakeholders in ensuring the highest standards of excellence for our students and higher education professionals throughout the state, and as such, applaud you for your involvement in this process. We welcome your feedback at any time.
Sincerely, De Juana Lozada Asst. Communications Director Office of External Relations Texas Higher Education Coordinating Board
http://www.thecb.state.tx.us/AAR/PrivateInstitutions/
NOTE: Scroll to bottom of page.
You wrote:
The Institute for Creation Research is clearly, by the declarations on their website, a religiously based group intent on propagandizing against the well established Theory of Evolution. To grant them any authorization to award academic degrees would give credibility to their position and advance the real possibility of their adherants undermining science education in Texas and elsewhere.
There is no scientific controversy about the fact of evolution. The claim of the Creation Research Institute to “present both sides” is empty.
They deserve no degree granting authority. The internet has enough diploma mills churning out questionable degrees.
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I wrote to the members of the Pinellas County School Board urging them not to neglect teaching of FSM’ism in schools.
I received this reply:
Dear Shane Sody,
Over the past few weeks we have received several emails about the article written in the St. Petersburg Times. While I have chosen not to respond to everyone I do want to clarify one issue. A St. Petersburg Times reporter called and asked our opinions and then wrote the article.
We as a Board have not had this discussion, nor are we going to discuss this curriculum. It is the state that will tell us what the curriculum will be and we will make sure it is taught.
Thank you for taking the time to share your concerns,
Carol Cook
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This is the letter I sent
Dear Pinellas county school board,
I would first like to applaud you on your support of alternative theories to evolution. To many “scientists” are trying to make this theory seem like fact. While supporting Intelligent Design is an important first step, there is still more work to be done. ID is not the only alternative to evolution, after all. Another popular theory is the FSM theory of intelligent design. For those unfamiliar with FSM, this theory states that a Flying Spaghetti Monster created the universe, and that pirates are his chosen people. Their is numerous evidence for this theory, all conveniently compiled at http://www.venganza.org. I would give some examples , but I fear loading this email with evidence would make it far too long. I will instead allow you to peruse the evidence yourselves at the aforementioned website.
Ramen,
Tony Russo, concerned student
……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………..
“As a scientist, I’d like to say that the currently accepted scientific theory is evolution. But, some competing ideas have been proposed, such as ID and FSMism, and discussion to include one should include the other, as these ideas are equally valid.“
– Mark Zurbuchen, Ph.D.
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Only “several” e-mails? However, that does at least sound reasonably positive. As long as the state doesn’t tell them ID should be included, anyway.
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@ Landlubber- I was being sarcastic
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Ok, I agree totally with this mail i wish I heard about this stuff before you guys so I could beat you to it in spreading the word about the FSM. I want to clear up one thing with some of these posters who are apparently 5 years old and have never been inside a school in their lives: The definition of a scientific theory is proven beyond doubt. Some of you say that is not true, a law is proven beyond doubt. A law is a physics theory proven beyopnd all doubt. A theory is irrefutable, backed by so much evidence that no matter how many of your stupid holy books tell us otherwise the facts will not change.
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@erik
If you had any appreciation for the philosophy of science you would appreciate that no scientific law or theory is truely ‘proven beyond doubt’. This is because inductive reasoning is unable to account for the multitude of other phenomena that may explain an observation. However, it is the best we have as the alternative is theology which generates one explaination for every observation, ‘God did it’.
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A new voice, that of Bill Foster, a lawyer and former St. Petersburg City Council member, has been added to the Pinellas COunty School Board’s questioning of evolution. Bill wrote saying that the study of natural selection led to Hitler’s crimes and belief in racial superiority. I sent the following letter to the St. Petersburg Times, which ran the story.
To: The Editor, St. Pete Times:
I read with stunned unbelief that Bill Foster thinks the study of evolution could lead to another Columbine shooting or could have been the genesis of Hitler’s super-race beliefs. He apparently thinks that there is no scientific proof of evolution, despite what top scientists state about the firmness of that proof. He also said that some homeless “choose” to live on the streets. Does he also believe that the moon is made of green cheese? How about UFOs being alien spaceships?
Yet, you claim that this uneducated former City Council member is “…widely considered to be a leading contender to be St. Petersburg’s next mayor in 2009”? This boggles the mind. Are there no intelligent or educated people willing to run? Is St. Petersburg to become the latest laughing-stock municipality in the nation?
Beam me up Scotty!
Ian MacFarlane
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Pastafarians believe above all else that it is our duty to enlighten others to our beliefs. We believe the Flying Spaghetti Monster (FSM) visited the Earth more than 5 billion years ago and left a deposit that created all of the plants and animals. Although the Flying Spaghetti Monster may be the most intelligent being in the universe, we believe the creation of life on earth was accidental. We want to make sure that FSM is included in any science textbooks that the Pinellas County School Board approves.
In the FSM we trust,
Eric Elder, Palm Harbor
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Hi all folks,
When dealing with these stupid ID promoters, just ask them:
You get 10,000 dollars within 5 minutes, if you hand over one of your Scientific Reports declaring ID is Science. Low risk of loosing your money.
Good work Bobby and everyone else.
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The creation myths (disguised under the name intelligent design) are all based on hearsay from stories told prior to 1000 BC. Note that was when intelligible writing was developed. Writing, itself, was an evolutionary process.
Sumerian cuneiform (pictograph) about 4000 BC
Egyptian pictographs developed about 3100 BC; developed hieroglyphs and begining of the alphabet, about 1700 BC.
Various scripts were developed between 1000 BC and 100BC
Scraps of writing found back to approximately 1000 BC on clay tablets, stone tablets; Papyrus and animal skins. later
Many telling the stories now incorporated in Christian, Jewish and Muslim scriptures; all claiming to be worshipers of the God of Abraham and descendants of Isaac and Ishmael.
Noah and the Flood 2400 B C. based on Archbishop Usher’s date of creation 4004 BC
Stonehange village outside London carbon dated at 2600 B C; same time as villages in Orkney Islands.(National Geographic)
GReat Pyramid in Egypt built about the same time. No indication in Egyptian history of Flood.
Moses born 1291 BC (Asimov’s guide to the Bible p. 174)
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Just checked the Tampa Schools blog. From my reading of the report, it seems that ID is out of the curriculum but not everyone is happy because the new curriculum isn’t as strong as it could be in outlining how strong the evidence in favor of evolution is.
http://blogs.tampabay.com/schools/2008/02/and-the-decisio.html#more
There is also talk of litigation or legislation into the future, so this battle may not be won yet (even if you count what passed as a victory, which some pro-science board members don’t seem to).
As an Australian, I’m just so glad that this rubbish doesn’t happen in my country. I can’t believe that so many Americans refuse to accept evolution, or want ID taught alongside evolution in schools. There is no comparitive push for this here in Australia, nor in Europe.
Finally, congrats to Bobby for this whole effort. In centuries to come, I hope he will be regarded in a similar manner to Galileo, who was persecuted by the Catholic Church for making scientific observations about the universe which were not backed up by the Bible. Why don’t the ID crowd still insist that the earth is flat and at the centre of the universe – if it was good enough for their God to say this 400 years ago, why has he changed his position now? Why don’t physics majors need to learn about ‘Intelligent Falling’ alongside the theory of gravity? Their hypocrisy is unbelievable, but then so is everything else about them.
May His Noodly Appendage Touch You
Dave Liberts
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Five words: Separation of Church and State. I align myself with neither the Christian faith nor the FSM faith, and feel that if you want your child to learn Creationism, ID, Noodley ID, or whatever, you should send them to a private school. Public schools serve the public, and should be teaching what is generally accepted by the public – Evolution.
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This is what I sent:
As a studeny training in Earth and Environental Sciences I appreciate your open minded approach to teaching various theories of the origins of Man, the Earth and the Universe.
There are many theories and I hope you cover as many as possible. Even the Wapanoag Indian turtle myth though it does seem a little silly.
One theory that is not silly of course, should definirly be in the curriculum, That theory is Flying Spaghetti Monsterism. The theory that a Flying Spaghetti Monster created everything.
An open minded scientific evaluation of FSM theory shows it has more scientific validity than either Intellegent Design or Creationism and as such should be taught along side them in the classroom as an altenative to evolution.
I thank you for your progressive intellectual attitude.
Capkicks
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I recieved a reply from the Pinellas County School Board:
Your e-mail will be shared with the Board Members.
Debbie
Deborah E. Beaty
Adm. Assistant to the Board
Pinellas County School Board
Phone: 727-588-6300 Fax: 727-588-6477
my letter:
As a student training in Earth and Environental Sciences I appreciate your open minded approach to teaching various theories of the origins of Man, the Earth and the Universe.
There are many theories and I hope you cover as many as possible. Even the Wapanoag Indian turtle myth though it does seem a little silly.
One theory that is not silly of course, should definirly be in the curriculum, That theory is Flying Spaghetti Monsterism. The theory that a Flying Spaghetti Monster created everything.
An open minded scientific evaluation of FSM theory shows it has more scientific validity than either Intellegent Design or Creationism and as such should be taught along side them in the classroom as an altenative to evolution.
I thank you for your progressive intellectual attitude.
Capkicks
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If you are accused of being a Witch, would you want your judge and jury to be scientists or priests?
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You know what, am i supporting the right god? Im not sure. Because it is still going against my beliefs, that evolution is the only theory. ANd yes, FSM does make fun of the god factor, but still…. I need some reassurance
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If I may, Intelligent design stresses no god; it just states a theory that something(s) may have created. That includes the FSM. That being the case, I don’t understand the anger.
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Hello embarrassed,
You should be embarrassed, “intelligent designer” is the same thing as “creator.” In the book of Pandas and people intelligent design was pasted inside of creationism, in an edition of the book just after it was made illegal to teach creationism in schools, as science. Intelligent Design is not Science, there is no fact to support it, irreducible complexity has been proven wrong. I will gladly e-mail you with scientific information from selfe3@yahoo.com. The problem is that ID is religion, it stresses an intelligent designer who created all living things, yes all. It is unconstitutional for them to teach creationism… I mean ID as science, it has no scientific foundation, and therefore it is a violation of the establishment clause in the constitution, which separates church from state. Look up the wedge document, which shows one of the main organizations behind ID’s agenda. Evolution has countless fossils, DNA evidence etc. You cannot say because there is a gap in Darwin’s theory (of which I have seen no evidence) we are right. ID has to come up with conclusive evidence to be considered a scientific theory. So until you have peer reviewed evidence, which can be observed and tested, and there are 100’s of pieces of evidence, you will graduate from religion to science and therefore be legal to be taught in schools. But since ID is creationism, it is a breach of my rights as a student and the rights of every American to teach that garbage outside of a theology class. FUCK YOU.
-J.T.S.
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My response to this situation was thus.
I, a believer in the tenants of Pastafarianism as well as Deism, feel that, in spite of my Christian ties, intelligent design should not be taught in school, based on a few basic and unavoidable flaws in its practice. The first being that following the law there is to be a separation of church and state. Where can I find information on how you justify the creationistic teachings as not breaking this key law. The next point is that the word science has a definition. This is, as stated by dictionary.com;
1. a branch of knowledge or study dealing with a body of facts or truths systematically arranged and showing the operation of general laws: the mathematical sciences.
2. systematic knowledge of the physical or material world gained through observation and experimentation.
3. any of the branches of natural or physical science.
4. systematized knowledge in general.
5. knowledge, as of facts or principles; knowledge gained by systematic study.
6. a particular branch of knowledge.
7. skill, esp. reflecting a precise application of facts or principles; proficiency.
All of these definitions have one similarity and that is that they point to a study of factual, earthbound laws, not beliefs. Darwinism follows this and is science theory. A theory is not a fact and as such is not saying that ID is not right but instead that evolution is a possibility currently supported by the scientific community. I use this argument to say that ID should not be taught in a science class that or any class that it would, by being in it, be a contradiction to the very class.
Lastly my Pastafarian beliefs hold me to point out that ID could be done by many forces other then God. There are other divine forces in belief on the earth. God, Ala, Buddha, the Hindu gods, as well as the Flying Spaghetti Monster, as well as many more. My focus, however, will be on the latter. He has just as much grounds as all other ID beliefs and, to my knowledge, more scientific backing. Do we really have enough time in the school year to teach all of the possible religious creation possibilities that spring up. Do we base it on the number of followers of a given religion to give its support validity? I would assume that the only fair way to teach it is to teach all beliefs and in that it would cut down on all the other more scientific teachings in the already cramped curriculum. Is that fair to the future generations or society as a whole, I think not.
I would like to thank you all for your time. I hope my view may enlighten you to a new side of the issue. I do not expect to change your view on your religion or life in general, but I do hope you will see the other side for the sake of science and the constitution.
Sincerely,
Craig Schambers
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They’re teaching intelligent design? That’s is great!!! So are they going to teach how our lord and savior, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, intelligently designed mankind with his noodly appendages in 6 days, 7000 years ago? Everyone knows Jesus was the son of the Flying Spaghetti Monster…so spread the truthful gospels of the FSM!
Ramen be upon you
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I’m curious, is there an Intelligent Design II class that explains how the creator was created?
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PS, here is the letter I sent:
It is unfortunate that you are supporting the religion of Intelligent Deisgn. Such a thing is a violation of Tammy Kitzmiller, et al. v. Dover Area School District, et al., the Lemon Test, and other federal lawsuits (available: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kitzmiller_v._Dover_Area_School_District and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemon_test#Lemon_test ). Intelligent design is little more than a thinly veiled attempt to push the majority religion (in this case Christianity) onto the entire populace. Such a thing only goes against the Lemon Test.
In addition, the adoption of Intelligent Design is inherently flawed. In doing so, you are removing all other forms of religious creation stories, including the idea that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster.
Under the Lemon test, you (as a government lawmaking entity) must do the following:
1. The government’s action must have a secular legislative purpose;
2. The government’s action must not have the primary effect of either advancing or inhibiting religion;
3. The government’s action must not result in an “excessive government entanglement” with religion.
In adopting Intelligent Design, you are no longer having a secular purpose, as you are adopting a religious belief in the school setting. You are advancing a religion in this case, as Intelligent Design is primarily a Christian invention. In wanting to adopt Intelligent Design, you are possibly engaging in “excessive entanglement with religion” by taking a Christian Creationism stance.
It only takes one of those points to fail the Lemon Test, yet by adopting Intelligent Design you are clearly violating two points of the Lemon Test and possibly violating the third one. I urge you not to commit an unconstitutional and unscientific mistake.
Respectfully
Greg
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I think it’s extremely neglectful that the schools aren’t also teaching our children how to predict the future by reading the entrails of slaughtered animals, or observing the flight of birds. That would really balance things out nicely.
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i am sure there will be classes about the designer of the designer. but whatever that may be, i’m also sure that fsm is the designer of all designers :D hail mighty spaghetti! ramen.
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Email Sent:
Members of the Pinellas County School Board:
My name is Chris Green, I am currently in my third year of study working towards a combined honours degree in Chemistry and Biochemistry at Dalhousie University. I am writing in support of your decision to expand the scientific curriculum in your school district, but I must also express my concern that you are taking the wrong route. The alternative evolutionary theory that has by far the most support from the academic community is the creed preached by the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, and I think that any science curriculum that does not include His teachings is unbalanced.
I think this is particularly important because, unlike myself, hundreds of thousands of pastifarians around the world are still too afraid to make their views known to the world, for fear of persecution by their peers. I believe in my heart that if His teachings are taught in the science classroom, alongside the alternative theories of evolution and intelligent design of course, students will draw on their scientific and religious backgrounds and certainly make the right choice. Not only will the secret pastafarians of the world feel it is time to finally make their views public, but many non-believers will see the logic and integrity of His word, and convert.
Again I must reiterate, I think you are certainly taking a step in the right direction, but to not give equal time to the FSM theory of creation, which has such widespread support throughout the academic community, you are doing a great disservice to the children of your district. If you have any questions regarding how to incorporate the FSM theory of creation into your classrooms please do not hesitate to contact me. Also, if you would like more information about the church itself, I would be happy to help spread His word to you.
May His Noodly Appendages guide you to make the correct decision.
-Christopher Green
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Good letter Cris, I like the emphasis on widespread support of the acaemic community.
When I sent my letter I got a secretary’s response.
They have an election coming up and jane galucci wont be running but who knows the position of the replacement.
Good work Pirate!!!
Aaarrrr!!!
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Here’s the email I sent to all of them!
Hello, thank you for being open to ideas and accepting mail from the public! As a student of science, I am thrilled to hear that you are open to teaching various theories, and I have noted that you are now teaching Intelligent Design. I really think it is admirable that students are being taught to look beyond the evidence. But I am very concerned that Pinellas County Schools are not fairly representing all scientific theories equally! I am referring, of course, to the outrageous lack of Pastafarianism in your schools. We believe from our Gospel that the Flying Spaghetti Monster created a midget, trees, and a mountain, and that all people today are direct descendents of pirates. I know this is true because I have felt the touch of His Noodly Appendage in my life. But this is not just a religious feeling, it is a scientific theory! The facts are on our side. No one has disproven that the Flying Spaghetti Monster has simply made the world looking as if we all evolved from a common ancestor. In addition, humans share only about 96% of their DNA with apes, whereas they share 99.9% of their DNA with pirates! For more information concerning pirates and global warming, visit http://www.venganza.org. In the meantime, please give equal representation to everyone who has an idea about the way the world works! Or, of course, you could remove both Pastafarianism and Creationism (oops, Intelligent Design) from your classrooms and simply teach the only theory that the evidence supports and scientists accept: evolution.
I trust the Flying Spaghetti Monster will reveal himself to you. RAmen.
Sincerely, Daniel
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interesting. three out of four say they are in favor of, effectively, keeping an open mind and allowing both sides to be presented. and yet, somehow, that becomes simply that they support ID.
I thought one of the most commonly used refrains from the atheist / scientific materialist side against religion / creationism was that religion prevents original thought and critical thinking. Now, it seems, it is the scientific / evolutionist side that is most interested in preventing the propagation of what they see as opposing points of view.
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Wow…
I used to attend a school in that district.
Luckily, I moved to Kansas…
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Not at all, Henry.
What they are all saying is that they see ID as a valid ’scientific’ theory that can be taught alongside evolution. It is not someone’s belief in ID that upsets the scientific community, but the idea that it is science, where it is clearly not. Please see Greg’s letter above for how to get more information.
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Henry,
You can’t equate a scientific theory (such as gravity, relativity (specific and general), evolution, etc… ) to the common use of the word theory which in scientific terms is a “hypothesis”, at best. It has less to do with having an open mind (as you stated) and more to do with when do we as a responsible sociological group draw the line as to what we teach? If we want to teach hypothosis than we must not be selective. I could postulate that my hand is being guided about the keyboard at this very moment by His noodly appendage. Can you refute that? No. I would imagine that all of my Pastifarian bretheren can sense the truthiness of my words, though you might call it my own personal hypothesis. ID is selective in it’s teaching of Faith (I’m sorry, I know you believe it to be science…), but doesn’t it kinda discredit all of the other religions as well (WHAT!? you don’t want to teach Budism, Hinduism or any of the polytheistic religions?)? If you want to stop teaching evolution because of your faith, where do we draw the line? When it no longer becomes inconvenient to your belief system? Well next we’ll have someone into numerology that has a problem with Math and we’ll have to teach BOTH numerology and math. Ok, fine. Let’s do it. Just for fun, lets take a look at young Timmys NEW schedule =)
8:00 English
9:00 Math
10:00 Intelligent Design
11:00 Voodoo!!!!
1200 Lunch
1:00 Numerology++
2:00 Science (covering ALL of the science to include biology, chemistry, geology etc… and of course evolution)
(did I forget Music and Art? Oh right, they’ve been dropped from the curriculum due to all of the competing ‘disciplines’)
Finally at 3:00 Timmy hops on the bus, excitedly chatting with all of his classmates about his upcomming field trip to Salem, MA and his upcomming inquistion project which is due next week!
I feel that your “word” has spread quite well without the use of our federally funded school system. There is such a thing as secularity. Oh wait a minute, He has not guided you to read the first ammendment, has He?
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Here’s my letter to the Board, tailored (with the appropriate quote they’ve made) for each one.
Hope it’s not too late to get the Glorious Word out …
Greetings. I am writing to you from Switzerland, as a European Pastafarian.
May I applaud your open-mindedness in supporting the teaching of Creationism (crossed out) Intelligent Design in the schools of your area. It is always good to hear of someone bravely challenging the Theory of Evolution, despite the fact that Evolution is supported by a vast amount of evidence. We believers should never let a bit (or even a lot) of evidence get in the way of our faith.
As you state:
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.”
Indeed it does. And, in turn, the Pastafarian beliefs balance out both of them.
The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is spreading widely in the academic communities in the USA, and throughout the world. This glorious Gospel needs to be heard more widely. Your students need the facts so they can decide the truth!
I realise that you may take this amiss, coming as it does from outside the States. But please remember that true faith knows no boundaries. Even as I write there are Christian missionaries from the States working in far-flung corners of the world. We Pastafarians are similarly reaching out to non-believers across international borders with the Good News of his Noodly Appendage.
It would be so wonderful if you would support not only the teaching of the Theory of Evolution, and the beliefs of Creationism (crossed out) Intelligent Design in your schools, but also the beliefs of us Pastafarians. Then your students would get a truly balanced view.
May His Noodly Appendage touch you, and guide you in this brave decision of yours.
With my best wishes,
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I’m going to be calling these folks in the morning/Monday morning to spread the noodly goodness of the Flying Spaghetti Monster! :-D
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Seriously? I go to a Catholic school and they teach evolution
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Plain and simple …..ID is NOT science. For an excellent review of this fact read the Dover decision transcripts. Even the “experts ” for ID admitted that the foundations of science would have to be changed to allow ID to “pose” as science, and that such changes would make other non-scientific enterprises ( astrology, tarot card reading, necromancy, etc. ), equally acceptable. There is no evidence whatever for ID other than personal accounts from ages long ago. As has been shown in numerous cases eye-witness testimony is among the least reliable “evidence ” I doubt any of these ID supporters would want to go to trial with their life on the line and want evidence as flimsy as that for ID used in the prosecution’s case. Indeed there is at least as much “evidence” for the flying spaghetti monster or other alien interventions in human life as ID. Much to the chagrin of IDers and oters of their ilk..Science is not a democracy….facts and data are facts and data..like it or not. Until the time IDers can come up with a testable hypothesis, collect and analyze data from double blind experiments, to allow critical assessment of their “theory ” then ID will remain as it is ….pseudoscience at best .
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Secondary schools (and religion) are only the beginning! If we are to open our minds
to all possibilities, despite the absence of ANY proof, why are medical students not exposed
to the idea that “humours” in the blood are to blame for mental deficiencies? Think how much
we could save by shuttering insane asylums! Just slap some leeches to the temples of the
mentally feeble and let ‘em go!
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Question to just any old body…..
Why can’t evolution be the TOOL of the creator(s)? For many years I’ve pondered why it has to be so black/white.
There are religious beliefs to back up the IDEA that evolution COULD BE the tool of the creator(s). For example, Christianity teaches that it is impossible to measure the length of Jehovah’s day. If this is so, then why is it not possible that Jehovah has a 8 billion year long day? If this HYPOTHESIS is possible, then it is possible that Jehovah used evolution as the tool of creation.
The Hindu belief of the Universe being an never ending cycle of birth, life, death, and rebirth can also be observed in the big bang theory.
As far as being descended from pirates, this is not only likely, but DOCUMENTED. In which case, it’s just as valid a belief system as any other.
I now consider myself an eclectic Pagan Pastafarian.
RAmen.
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To the members of Pinellas County School Board. Europe is laughing at you. It is people such as yourselves that are responsible for the reputation Americans have of being stupid. Shame on you. It is no wonder so many US citizens have aquired this unenviable reputation if Americas educational establishments are run by the like of yourselves. Quite frankly, it is disturbing. Long live the FSM.
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I preach infallibly of a new religion. Pastafarianism. The Flying Spaghetti Monster, not Jesus, is the true God. I will convert the Catholic Church immediately to Pastafarianism. Those who do not believe are to be excommunicated. I dedicate the world, the saints, and the Holy Church to the Sacred Sauce of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Ramen.
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This is a case for da dara da da daaaa The Flying Spaghetti Monster. Let’s blow another school board away.
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Dear Pinellas County, Ms. Bostock, Ms. O’Shea, Ms. Gallicco and Ms. Cook,
Intelligent Design or any variation of it is not part of science.
Evolution is part of science. It can be tested. What can we conclude from the evidence is science.
Yet “Intelligent Design” states, here is the conclusion, and it’s complex, therefore it must have been done by a supreme god.
It is shocking that you would classify “beliefs” such as in gods and devils as part of science.
Learn what science is before you put your myths into the mix.
If you still believe that evolution needs to be challenged, with “belief” aka “a supreme god”, then provide the answer, just how many “supreme gods” created everything? For how do you know it’s only one god?
If you mix “Intelligent Design” into the class, then why is your “belief” being used? Because I hear that “SCIENTOLOGY” holds up better in a science class than the Christian-Judo god.
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Kids have it so easy these days! If they can get away with teaching ID in science classes because
“humans are so complex there must be some supernatural intervention here”, then what’s to stop
someone in say a math class stating that they TRULY believe the answer to an absurdly complex equation MUST be 7.4 and they would be truly offended if anyone said otherwise. Then refute any
“proof” the instructor proposed as the work of the devil.
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Suppose we were all robots without free will. I suppose we could be programmed to never “sin,” but nor could you take pride in your accomplishments any more than a Dodge Viper can claim superiority over it’s engineers. We all have choices in life, and unfortunately we don’t always make the right ones, but when we do, Man! does it feel good! You know what I’m talking about, when you take a risk and it pays off. Well, God made us to love him, but if we are to really have the opportunity to love him we must also have the opportunity to not love him. Follow me here. So you say that a loving creator would not allow so much evil in the world, but he does just because he loves us. He respects us enough to let us make our own decisions cause he knows we’re capable. His love for us is especially shown by God manifesting himself as Jesus and suffering through all men’s decisions not to love and dying for our sins. Yes, there is suffering and tons of crap in the world, but there is also great beauty and comfort. If you have experienced more of the former than the latter, then I am sorry, life can be hard. But please consider this advice that a Counselor/Psychologist friend once gave me. Stop worrying about what you can’t control (the crap that you experience day in and day out) and start worrying about what you change, the way you act towards others. Return love for hate, turn the other cheek, go two miles when only forced to go one! See if it doesn’t change your outlook on life! If you want to keep worshiping the FSM, feel free to, but I know Jesus died for my sins and that’s why I worship him. If you want to as well, feel free, but be warned, he will change your life!
So anyway, any of you that really think ID is so erroneous, I challenge you to read/see some literature or a video by an ID scientist. Then read something by a leading evolutionist. Challenge everything!
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could you please post my last comment as just being written by Steve and not Stephen Morse, please, thanks.
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I understand what you are saying Stephen/Steve but I already do all of those things without the need to worship Jesus. I also believe that any intelligent person realises that those traits are the best to exercise throughout life and should not need to worship anyone in order to do so. I’m sure you must have known that too before seeing a psychologist. What you have unwittingly have done here though is state that you must have been going through a hard time and therefore feeling a little weak. This is precisely what the Church and religion feed on. They snap up the vunerable who are struggling with life. If worshipping Jesus however makes you feel good then that is fine and I have no problem with that. You should not try, however, to push your beliefs onto anybody else.
As for Intelligent Design, I’m sorry but it is nothing but Creationism by another name. I challenge you to watch a video on the Creationist Museum and afterwards still think it is science or indeed sense. I find it hilarious. P.S Keep a look out for the vegetarian T-Rex standing behind Adam. He’s my favourite. Glad you are feeling better though. Take care.
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This page is set out in such a way that members of the school board will be able to understand the difference between the ‘Theory’ of Evolution and Intelligent Design.
http://www.kobrascorner.info/opine/evolution-is-a-fact.php
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@ Stephen Morse:
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You are right in your assertion that we each need to challenge our realities and learn for ourselves what truth is. The problem is that the debate of creationism vs. evolution has been fought so many times, the evidence is so overwhelming, nay, damningly in favor of evolution, that the study of human origin becomes one of an economy of speculation. If something has a .000000000000001 percent probability of being accurate, then why would I spend my entire life so vehemently trying to prove it is truth (answer: wishful thinking)? Creationists fail to study the record and in turn seek out new explanations (usually recycled – ID is just the latest iteration of this fallacious thinking) for why god created us in his image. It is time for you to move on. It is time for this debate to move on. The only thing creationists have come up with in the last 200 years is an appeal to emotion (God loves us, you will be rewarded, you are going to hell if you don’t believe this, etc.) to counter very rational, logical and evidentiary arguments in favor of evolution. The Theory of Evolution is validated time and again by various fields of study: anthropological, psychological, biological, geological. The mere fact that there are still large gaps – portions of the record that we have yet to discover – in no way gives you the right to arbitrarily insert your ill-fitting god. I assure you that if you continue to do so, this will only prolong your ignorance and guarantee the day where you will yet again have to pick up and move your god into a different, dark corner of human ignorance as we are enlightened by scientific knowledge. I appeal to you to have the mental discipline to recognize your own intransigence and take some of your own advice that you so imploringly dish out.
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RAmen
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Stephen, Stephen, Stephen. I hardly know where to start. For the sake of argument, I am going to grant that some entity named ‘God’ exists, even though we all know that to be false. The FSM is the only one and true living creator. But, I digress……
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Your notion that God made us to love him is so confused! Let me try to help you think this through. You said “God made us to love him, but if we are to really have the opportunity to love him we must also have the opportunity to not love him.” If God gave us the opportunity to either love him or not, then we were not made to love him. We were created (made) to decide for ourselves. Since God gave us free well to decide for ourselves, then whichever way we decide is in accordance with the will of God because we would be performing according to his purpose. If we make a choice that God does not like, that is his fault, not ours. No harm, no foul. No “sin” here.
.
You said, “Follow me here. So you say that a loving creator would not allow so much evil in the world, but he does just because he loves us. He respects us enough to let us make our own decisions cause he knows we’re capable.” I know just how you feel. I can feel the love now, as thousands of children starve in Africa. When that earth quake struck China, I could just feel the love when all those people died. I am sure they all felt the love, too.
.
Now you follow me here. If any parent treated his or her children the way your God treats his, any clear thinking human being would condemn that behavior. Children have free will, too, but no loving parent would allow his or her child to run out into traffic. Clearly, your God does not care about his children.
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I strongly recommend that you read “The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.” You will find a much tastier religion than the one you now have. And, in case you do not find that it suits you, we have a 30 day no obligation guarantee. You can quit the Church of the FSM and go back to your old time religion. They will take you back.
.
RAmen
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Wow, I remember back in June of 07 when I used to follow this websites articles daily. Now, one year later, I’m looking at what has been posted since then and I am just now learning that my home town (county) was being criticized! Thank You! I moved from that awful place last August and now I’m really happy I did. And now just hearing this makes me even more glad I moved from there. Amazing!So screw you Pinellas County!
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