A majority of the Pinellas County, Florida, School Board supports the inclusion of Intelligent Design in the science curriculum, reports the St. Petersburg Times.
Four members of the school board, including the chairperson and vice-chairperson, have made statements in support of Intelligent Design.
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.” — Nancy Bostock, Chairperson
“I’d probably ideally like to keep it all [evolution and Intelligent Design] out of the classroom. If it’s going to create this much controversy, how important is it?” — Peggy O’Shea, Vice Chairperson
“I think that students should be given the opportunity to view all theories on how man evolved and let their science background and their religious background take over as to which one they believe in.” — Jane Gallucci, Member
“To teach one [evolution] as if nothing else existed, I think we’re doing our students a disservice.” — Carol Cook, Member
You can read the news article here.
The PCSB website states: “The public is encouraged to contact the School Board members on any issue.”
I suggest we contact the school board and let them know there are more than two theories of our origins. Pastafarianism is built on similar tenets as Intelligent Design, and has much greater support from the academic community. If you decide to write, please be respectful.
Contact Info:
Office: (727) 588-6300
E-mail: Board@pcsb.org
Individual E-mail addresses:
Nancy Bostock: bostockn@pcsb.org
Peggy O’Shea: osheap@pcsb.org
Jane Gallucci: galluccij@pcsb.org
Carol Cook: cookc@pcsb.org
@erik
If you had any appreciation for the philosophy of science you would appreciate that no scientific law or theory is truely ‘proven beyond doubt’. This is because inductive reasoning is unable to account for the multitude of other phenomena that may explain an observation. However, it is the best we have as the alternative is theology which generates one explaination for every observation, ‘God did it’.
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A new voice, that of Bill Foster, a lawyer and former St. Petersburg City Council member, has been added to the Pinellas COunty School Board’s questioning of evolution. Bill wrote saying that the study of natural selection led to Hitler’s crimes and belief in racial superiority. I sent the following letter to the St. Petersburg Times, which ran the story.
To: The Editor, St. Pete Times:
I read with stunned unbelief that Bill Foster thinks the study of evolution could lead to another Columbine shooting or could have been the genesis of Hitler’s super-race beliefs. He apparently thinks that there is no scientific proof of evolution, despite what top scientists state about the firmness of that proof. He also said that some homeless “choose” to live on the streets. Does he also believe that the moon is made of green cheese? How about UFOs being alien spaceships?
Yet, you claim that this uneducated former City Council member is “…widely considered to be a leading contender to be St. Petersburg’s next mayor in 2009”? This boggles the mind. Are there no intelligent or educated people willing to run? Is St. Petersburg to become the latest laughing-stock municipality in the nation?
Beam me up Scotty!
Ian MacFarlane
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Pastafarians believe above all else that it is our duty to enlighten others to our beliefs. We believe the Flying Spaghetti Monster (FSM) visited the Earth more than 5 billion years ago and left a deposit that created all of the plants and animals. Although the Flying Spaghetti Monster may be the most intelligent being in the universe, we believe the creation of life on earth was accidental. We want to make sure that FSM is included in any science textbooks that the Pinellas County School Board approves.
In the FSM we trust,
Eric Elder, Palm Harbor
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Hi all folks,
When dealing with these stupid ID promoters, just ask them:
You get 10,000 dollars within 5 minutes, if you hand over one of your Scientific Reports declaring ID is Science. Low risk of loosing your money.
Good work Bobby and everyone else.
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The creation myths (disguised under the name intelligent design) are all based on hearsay from stories told prior to 1000 BC. Note that was when intelligible writing was developed. Writing, itself, was an evolutionary process.
Sumerian cuneiform (pictograph) about 4000 BC
Egyptian pictographs developed about 3100 BC; developed hieroglyphs and begining of the alphabet, about 1700 BC.
Various scripts were developed between 1000 BC and 100BC
Scraps of writing found back to approximately 1000 BC on clay tablets, stone tablets; Papyrus and animal skins. later
Many telling the stories now incorporated in Christian, Jewish and Muslim scriptures; all claiming to be worshipers of the God of Abraham and descendants of Isaac and Ishmael.
Noah and the Flood 2400 B C. based on Archbishop Usher’s date of creation 4004 BC
Stonehange village outside London carbon dated at 2600 B C; same time as villages in Orkney Islands.(National Geographic)
GReat Pyramid in Egypt built about the same time. No indication in Egyptian history of Flood.
Moses born 1291 BC (Asimov’s guide to the Bible p. 174)
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Just checked the Tampa Schools blog. From my reading of the report, it seems that ID is out of the curriculum but not everyone is happy because the new curriculum isn’t as strong as it could be in outlining how strong the evidence in favor of evolution is.
http://blogs.tampabay.com/schools/2008/02/and-the-decisio.html#more
There is also talk of litigation or legislation into the future, so this battle may not be won yet (even if you count what passed as a victory, which some pro-science board members don’t seem to).
As an Australian, I’m just so glad that this rubbish doesn’t happen in my country. I can’t believe that so many Americans refuse to accept evolution, or want ID taught alongside evolution in schools. There is no comparitive push for this here in Australia, nor in Europe.
Finally, congrats to Bobby for this whole effort. In centuries to come, I hope he will be regarded in a similar manner to Galileo, who was persecuted by the Catholic Church for making scientific observations about the universe which were not backed up by the Bible. Why don’t the ID crowd still insist that the earth is flat and at the centre of the universe – if it was good enough for their God to say this 400 years ago, why has he changed his position now? Why don’t physics majors need to learn about ‘Intelligent Falling’ alongside the theory of gravity? Their hypocrisy is unbelievable, but then so is everything else about them.
May His Noodly Appendage Touch You
Dave Liberts
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Five words: Separation of Church and State. I align myself with neither the Christian faith nor the FSM faith, and feel that if you want your child to learn Creationism, ID, Noodley ID, or whatever, you should send them to a private school. Public schools serve the public, and should be teaching what is generally accepted by the public – Evolution.
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This is what I sent:
As a studeny training in Earth and Environental Sciences I appreciate your open minded approach to teaching various theories of the origins of Man, the Earth and the Universe.
There are many theories and I hope you cover as many as possible. Even the Wapanoag Indian turtle myth though it does seem a little silly.
One theory that is not silly of course, should definirly be in the curriculum, That theory is Flying Spaghetti Monsterism. The theory that a Flying Spaghetti Monster created everything.
An open minded scientific evaluation of FSM theory shows it has more scientific validity than either Intellegent Design or Creationism and as such should be taught along side them in the classroom as an altenative to evolution.
I thank you for your progressive intellectual attitude.
Capkicks
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I recieved a reply from the Pinellas County School Board:
Your e-mail will be shared with the Board Members.
Debbie
Deborah E. Beaty
Adm. Assistant to the Board
Pinellas County School Board
Phone: 727-588-6300 Fax: 727-588-6477
my letter:
As a student training in Earth and Environental Sciences I appreciate your open minded approach to teaching various theories of the origins of Man, the Earth and the Universe.
There are many theories and I hope you cover as many as possible. Even the Wapanoag Indian turtle myth though it does seem a little silly.
One theory that is not silly of course, should definirly be in the curriculum, That theory is Flying Spaghetti Monsterism. The theory that a Flying Spaghetti Monster created everything.
An open minded scientific evaluation of FSM theory shows it has more scientific validity than either Intellegent Design or Creationism and as such should be taught along side them in the classroom as an altenative to evolution.
I thank you for your progressive intellectual attitude.
Capkicks
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If you are accused of being a Witch, would you want your judge and jury to be scientists or priests?
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You know what, am i supporting the right god? Im not sure. Because it is still going against my beliefs, that evolution is the only theory. ANd yes, FSM does make fun of the god factor, but still…. I need some reassurance
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If I may, Intelligent design stresses no god; it just states a theory that something(s) may have created. That includes the FSM. That being the case, I don’t understand the anger.
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Hello embarrassed,
You should be embarrassed, “intelligent designer” is the same thing as “creator.” In the book of Pandas and people intelligent design was pasted inside of creationism, in an edition of the book just after it was made illegal to teach creationism in schools, as science. Intelligent Design is not Science, there is no fact to support it, irreducible complexity has been proven wrong. I will gladly e-mail you with scientific information from selfe3@yahoo.com. The problem is that ID is religion, it stresses an intelligent designer who created all living things, yes all. It is unconstitutional for them to teach creationism… I mean ID as science, it has no scientific foundation, and therefore it is a violation of the establishment clause in the constitution, which separates church from state. Look up the wedge document, which shows one of the main organizations behind ID’s agenda. Evolution has countless fossils, DNA evidence etc. You cannot say because there is a gap in Darwin’s theory (of which I have seen no evidence) we are right. ID has to come up with conclusive evidence to be considered a scientific theory. So until you have peer reviewed evidence, which can be observed and tested, and there are 100’s of pieces of evidence, you will graduate from religion to science and therefore be legal to be taught in schools. But since ID is creationism, it is a breach of my rights as a student and the rights of every American to teach that garbage outside of a theology class. FUCK YOU.
-J.T.S.
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My response to this situation was thus.
I, a believer in the tenants of Pastafarianism as well as Deism, feel that, in spite of my Christian ties, intelligent design should not be taught in school, based on a few basic and unavoidable flaws in its practice. The first being that following the law there is to be a separation of church and state. Where can I find information on how you justify the creationistic teachings as not breaking this key law. The next point is that the word science has a definition. This is, as stated by dictionary.com;
1. a branch of knowledge or study dealing with a body of facts or truths systematically arranged and showing the operation of general laws: the mathematical sciences.
2. systematic knowledge of the physical or material world gained through observation and experimentation.
3. any of the branches of natural or physical science.
4. systematized knowledge in general.
5. knowledge, as of facts or principles; knowledge gained by systematic study.
6. a particular branch of knowledge.
7. skill, esp. reflecting a precise application of facts or principles; proficiency.
All of these definitions have one similarity and that is that they point to a study of factual, earthbound laws, not beliefs. Darwinism follows this and is science theory. A theory is not a fact and as such is not saying that ID is not right but instead that evolution is a possibility currently supported by the scientific community. I use this argument to say that ID should not be taught in a science class that or any class that it would, by being in it, be a contradiction to the very class.
Lastly my Pastafarian beliefs hold me to point out that ID could be done by many forces other then God. There are other divine forces in belief on the earth. God, Ala, Buddha, the Hindu gods, as well as the Flying Spaghetti Monster, as well as many more. My focus, however, will be on the latter. He has just as much grounds as all other ID beliefs and, to my knowledge, more scientific backing. Do we really have enough time in the school year to teach all of the possible religious creation possibilities that spring up. Do we base it on the number of followers of a given religion to give its support validity? I would assume that the only fair way to teach it is to teach all beliefs and in that it would cut down on all the other more scientific teachings in the already cramped curriculum. Is that fair to the future generations or society as a whole, I think not.
I would like to thank you all for your time. I hope my view may enlighten you to a new side of the issue. I do not expect to change your view on your religion or life in general, but I do hope you will see the other side for the sake of science and the constitution.
Sincerely,
Craig Schambers
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They’re teaching intelligent design? That’s is great!!! So are they going to teach how our lord and savior, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, intelligently designed mankind with his noodly appendages in 6 days, 7000 years ago? Everyone knows Jesus was the son of the Flying Spaghetti Monster…so spread the truthful gospels of the FSM!
Ramen be upon you
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I’m curious, is there an Intelligent Design II class that explains how the creator was created?
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PS, here is the letter I sent:
It is unfortunate that you are supporting the religion of Intelligent Deisgn. Such a thing is a violation of Tammy Kitzmiller, et al. v. Dover Area School District, et al., the Lemon Test, and other federal lawsuits (available: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kitzmiller_v._Dover_Area_School_District and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemon_test#Lemon_test ). Intelligent design is little more than a thinly veiled attempt to push the majority religion (in this case Christianity) onto the entire populace. Such a thing only goes against the Lemon Test.
In addition, the adoption of Intelligent Design is inherently flawed. In doing so, you are removing all other forms of religious creation stories, including the idea that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster.
Under the Lemon test, you (as a government lawmaking entity) must do the following:
1. The government’s action must have a secular legislative purpose;
2. The government’s action must not have the primary effect of either advancing or inhibiting religion;
3. The government’s action must not result in an “excessive government entanglement” with religion.
In adopting Intelligent Design, you are no longer having a secular purpose, as you are adopting a religious belief in the school setting. You are advancing a religion in this case, as Intelligent Design is primarily a Christian invention. In wanting to adopt Intelligent Design, you are possibly engaging in “excessive entanglement with religion” by taking a Christian Creationism stance.
It only takes one of those points to fail the Lemon Test, yet by adopting Intelligent Design you are clearly violating two points of the Lemon Test and possibly violating the third one. I urge you not to commit an unconstitutional and unscientific mistake.
Respectfully
Greg
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I think it’s extremely neglectful that the schools aren’t also teaching our children how to predict the future by reading the entrails of slaughtered animals, or observing the flight of birds. That would really balance things out nicely.
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i am sure there will be classes about the designer of the designer. but whatever that may be, i’m also sure that fsm is the designer of all designers :D hail mighty spaghetti! ramen.
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Email Sent:
Members of the Pinellas County School Board:
My name is Chris Green, I am currently in my third year of study working towards a combined honours degree in Chemistry and Biochemistry at Dalhousie University. I am writing in support of your decision to expand the scientific curriculum in your school district, but I must also express my concern that you are taking the wrong route. The alternative evolutionary theory that has by far the most support from the academic community is the creed preached by the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, and I think that any science curriculum that does not include His teachings is unbalanced.
I think this is particularly important because, unlike myself, hundreds of thousands of pastifarians around the world are still too afraid to make their views known to the world, for fear of persecution by their peers. I believe in my heart that if His teachings are taught in the science classroom, alongside the alternative theories of evolution and intelligent design of course, students will draw on their scientific and religious backgrounds and certainly make the right choice. Not only will the secret pastafarians of the world feel it is time to finally make their views public, but many non-believers will see the logic and integrity of His word, and convert.
Again I must reiterate, I think you are certainly taking a step in the right direction, but to not give equal time to the FSM theory of creation, which has such widespread support throughout the academic community, you are doing a great disservice to the children of your district. If you have any questions regarding how to incorporate the FSM theory of creation into your classrooms please do not hesitate to contact me. Also, if you would like more information about the church itself, I would be happy to help spread His word to you.
May His Noodly Appendages guide you to make the correct decision.
-Christopher Green
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Good letter Cris, I like the emphasis on widespread support of the acaemic community.
When I sent my letter I got a secretary’s response.
They have an election coming up and jane galucci wont be running but who knows the position of the replacement.
Good work Pirate!!!
Aaarrrr!!!
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Here’s the email I sent to all of them!
Hello, thank you for being open to ideas and accepting mail from the public! As a student of science, I am thrilled to hear that you are open to teaching various theories, and I have noted that you are now teaching Intelligent Design. I really think it is admirable that students are being taught to look beyond the evidence. But I am very concerned that Pinellas County Schools are not fairly representing all scientific theories equally! I am referring, of course, to the outrageous lack of Pastafarianism in your schools. We believe from our Gospel that the Flying Spaghetti Monster created a midget, trees, and a mountain, and that all people today are direct descendents of pirates. I know this is true because I have felt the touch of His Noodly Appendage in my life. But this is not just a religious feeling, it is a scientific theory! The facts are on our side. No one has disproven that the Flying Spaghetti Monster has simply made the world looking as if we all evolved from a common ancestor. In addition, humans share only about 96% of their DNA with apes, whereas they share 99.9% of their DNA with pirates! For more information concerning pirates and global warming, visit http://www.venganza.org. In the meantime, please give equal representation to everyone who has an idea about the way the world works! Or, of course, you could remove both Pastafarianism and Creationism (oops, Intelligent Design) from your classrooms and simply teach the only theory that the evidence supports and scientists accept: evolution.
I trust the Flying Spaghetti Monster will reveal himself to you. RAmen.
Sincerely, Daniel
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interesting. three out of four say they are in favor of, effectively, keeping an open mind and allowing both sides to be presented. and yet, somehow, that becomes simply that they support ID.
I thought one of the most commonly used refrains from the atheist / scientific materialist side against religion / creationism was that religion prevents original thought and critical thinking. Now, it seems, it is the scientific / evolutionist side that is most interested in preventing the propagation of what they see as opposing points of view.
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Wow…
I used to attend a school in that district.
Luckily, I moved to Kansas…
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Not at all, Henry.
What they are all saying is that they see ID as a valid ’scientific’ theory that can be taught alongside evolution. It is not someone’s belief in ID that upsets the scientific community, but the idea that it is science, where it is clearly not. Please see Greg’s letter above for how to get more information.
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Henry,
You can’t equate a scientific theory (such as gravity, relativity (specific and general), evolution, etc… ) to the common use of the word theory which in scientific terms is a “hypothesis”, at best. It has less to do with having an open mind (as you stated) and more to do with when do we as a responsible sociological group draw the line as to what we teach? If we want to teach hypothosis than we must not be selective. I could postulate that my hand is being guided about the keyboard at this very moment by His noodly appendage. Can you refute that? No. I would imagine that all of my Pastifarian bretheren can sense the truthiness of my words, though you might call it my own personal hypothesis. ID is selective in it’s teaching of Faith (I’m sorry, I know you believe it to be science…), but doesn’t it kinda discredit all of the other religions as well (WHAT!? you don’t want to teach Budism, Hinduism or any of the polytheistic religions?)? If you want to stop teaching evolution because of your faith, where do we draw the line? When it no longer becomes inconvenient to your belief system? Well next we’ll have someone into numerology that has a problem with Math and we’ll have to teach BOTH numerology and math. Ok, fine. Let’s do it. Just for fun, lets take a look at young Timmys NEW schedule =)
8:00 English
9:00 Math
10:00 Intelligent Design
11:00 Voodoo!!!!
1200 Lunch
1:00 Numerology++
2:00 Science (covering ALL of the science to include biology, chemistry, geology etc… and of course evolution)
(did I forget Music and Art? Oh right, they’ve been dropped from the curriculum due to all of the competing ‘disciplines’)
Finally at 3:00 Timmy hops on the bus, excitedly chatting with all of his classmates about his upcomming field trip to Salem, MA and his upcomming inquistion project which is due next week!
I feel that your “word” has spread quite well without the use of our federally funded school system. There is such a thing as secularity. Oh wait a minute, He has not guided you to read the first ammendment, has He?
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Here’s my letter to the Board, tailored (with the appropriate quote they’ve made) for each one.
Hope it’s not too late to get the Glorious Word out …
Greetings. I am writing to you from Switzerland, as a European Pastafarian.
May I applaud your open-mindedness in supporting the teaching of Creationism (crossed out) Intelligent Design in the schools of your area. It is always good to hear of someone bravely challenging the Theory of Evolution, despite the fact that Evolution is supported by a vast amount of evidence. We believers should never let a bit (or even a lot) of evidence get in the way of our faith.
As you state:
“The entire theory of evolution is not scientific fact. Intelligent design balances it out.”
Indeed it does. And, in turn, the Pastafarian beliefs balance out both of them.
The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is spreading widely in the academic communities in the USA, and throughout the world. This glorious Gospel needs to be heard more widely. Your students need the facts so they can decide the truth!
I realise that you may take this amiss, coming as it does from outside the States. But please remember that true faith knows no boundaries. Even as I write there are Christian missionaries from the States working in far-flung corners of the world. We Pastafarians are similarly reaching out to non-believers across international borders with the Good News of his Noodly Appendage.
It would be so wonderful if you would support not only the teaching of the Theory of Evolution, and the beliefs of Creationism (crossed out) Intelligent Design in your schools, but also the beliefs of us Pastafarians. Then your students would get a truly balanced view.
May His Noodly Appendage touch you, and guide you in this brave decision of yours.
With my best wishes,
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I’m going to be calling these folks in the morning/Monday morning to spread the noodly goodness of the Flying Spaghetti Monster! :-D
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Seriously? I go to a Catholic school and they teach evolution
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Plain and simple …..ID is NOT science. For an excellent review of this fact read the Dover decision transcripts. Even the “experts ” for ID admitted that the foundations of science would have to be changed to allow ID to “pose” as science, and that such changes would make other non-scientific enterprises ( astrology, tarot card reading, necromancy, etc. ), equally acceptable. There is no evidence whatever for ID other than personal accounts from ages long ago. As has been shown in numerous cases eye-witness testimony is among the least reliable “evidence ” I doubt any of these ID supporters would want to go to trial with their life on the line and want evidence as flimsy as that for ID used in the prosecution’s case. Indeed there is at least as much “evidence” for the flying spaghetti monster or other alien interventions in human life as ID. Much to the chagrin of IDers and oters of their ilk..Science is not a democracy….facts and data are facts and data..like it or not. Until the time IDers can come up with a testable hypothesis, collect and analyze data from double blind experiments, to allow critical assessment of their “theory ” then ID will remain as it is ….pseudoscience at best .
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Secondary schools (and religion) are only the beginning! If we are to open our minds
to all possibilities, despite the absence of ANY proof, why are medical students not exposed
to the idea that “humours” in the blood are to blame for mental deficiencies? Think how much
we could save by shuttering insane asylums! Just slap some leeches to the temples of the
mentally feeble and let ‘em go!
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Question to just any old body…..
Why can’t evolution be the TOOL of the creator(s)? For many years I’ve pondered why it has to be so black/white.
There are religious beliefs to back up the IDEA that evolution COULD BE the tool of the creator(s). For example, Christianity teaches that it is impossible to measure the length of Jehovah’s day. If this is so, then why is it not possible that Jehovah has a 8 billion year long day? If this HYPOTHESIS is possible, then it is possible that Jehovah used evolution as the tool of creation.
The Hindu belief of the Universe being an never ending cycle of birth, life, death, and rebirth can also be observed in the big bang theory.
As far as being descended from pirates, this is not only likely, but DOCUMENTED. In which case, it’s just as valid a belief system as any other.
I now consider myself an eclectic Pagan Pastafarian.
RAmen.
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To the members of Pinellas County School Board. Europe is laughing at you. It is people such as yourselves that are responsible for the reputation Americans have of being stupid. Shame on you. It is no wonder so many US citizens have aquired this unenviable reputation if Americas educational establishments are run by the like of yourselves. Quite frankly, it is disturbing. Long live the FSM.
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I preach infallibly of a new religion. Pastafarianism. The Flying Spaghetti Monster, not Jesus, is the true God. I will convert the Catholic Church immediately to Pastafarianism. Those who do not believe are to be excommunicated. I dedicate the world, the saints, and the Holy Church to the Sacred Sauce of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Ramen.
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This is a case for da dara da da daaaa The Flying Spaghetti Monster. Let’s blow another school board away.
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Dear Pinellas County, Ms. Bostock, Ms. O’Shea, Ms. Gallicco and Ms. Cook,
Intelligent Design or any variation of it is not part of science.
Evolution is part of science. It can be tested. What can we conclude from the evidence is science.
Yet “Intelligent Design” states, here is the conclusion, and it’s complex, therefore it must have been done by a supreme god.
It is shocking that you would classify “beliefs” such as in gods and devils as part of science.
Learn what science is before you put your myths into the mix.
If you still believe that evolution needs to be challenged, with “belief” aka “a supreme god”, then provide the answer, just how many “supreme gods” created everything? For how do you know it’s only one god?
If you mix “Intelligent Design” into the class, then why is your “belief” being used? Because I hear that “SCIENTOLOGY” holds up better in a science class than the Christian-Judo god.
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Kids have it so easy these days! If they can get away with teaching ID in science classes because
“humans are so complex there must be some supernatural intervention here”, then what’s to stop
someone in say a math class stating that they TRULY believe the answer to an absurdly complex equation MUST be 7.4 and they would be truly offended if anyone said otherwise. Then refute any
“proof” the instructor proposed as the work of the devil.
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Suppose we were all robots without free will. I suppose we could be programmed to never “sin,” but nor could you take pride in your accomplishments any more than a Dodge Viper can claim superiority over it’s engineers. We all have choices in life, and unfortunately we don’t always make the right ones, but when we do, Man! does it feel good! You know what I’m talking about, when you take a risk and it pays off. Well, God made us to love him, but if we are to really have the opportunity to love him we must also have the opportunity to not love him. Follow me here. So you say that a loving creator would not allow so much evil in the world, but he does just because he loves us. He respects us enough to let us make our own decisions cause he knows we’re capable. His love for us is especially shown by God manifesting himself as Jesus and suffering through all men’s decisions not to love and dying for our sins. Yes, there is suffering and tons of crap in the world, but there is also great beauty and comfort. If you have experienced more of the former than the latter, then I am sorry, life can be hard. But please consider this advice that a Counselor/Psychologist friend once gave me. Stop worrying about what you can’t control (the crap that you experience day in and day out) and start worrying about what you change, the way you act towards others. Return love for hate, turn the other cheek, go two miles when only forced to go one! See if it doesn’t change your outlook on life! If you want to keep worshiping the FSM, feel free to, but I know Jesus died for my sins and that’s why I worship him. If you want to as well, feel free, but be warned, he will change your life!
So anyway, any of you that really think ID is so erroneous, I challenge you to read/see some literature or a video by an ID scientist. Then read something by a leading evolutionist. Challenge everything!
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could you please post my last comment as just being written by Steve and not Stephen Morse, please, thanks.
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I understand what you are saying Stephen/Steve but I already do all of those things without the need to worship Jesus. I also believe that any intelligent person realises that those traits are the best to exercise throughout life and should not need to worship anyone in order to do so. I’m sure you must have known that too before seeing a psychologist. What you have unwittingly have done here though is state that you must have been going through a hard time and therefore feeling a little weak. This is precisely what the Church and religion feed on. They snap up the vunerable who are struggling with life. If worshipping Jesus however makes you feel good then that is fine and I have no problem with that. You should not try, however, to push your beliefs onto anybody else.
As for Intelligent Design, I’m sorry but it is nothing but Creationism by another name. I challenge you to watch a video on the Creationist Museum and afterwards still think it is science or indeed sense. I find it hilarious. P.S Keep a look out for the vegetarian T-Rex standing behind Adam. He’s my favourite. Glad you are feeling better though. Take care.
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This page is set out in such a way that members of the school board will be able to understand the difference between the ‘Theory’ of Evolution and Intelligent Design.
http://www.kobrascorner.info/opine/evolution-is-a-fact.php
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@ Stephen Morse:
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You are right in your assertion that we each need to challenge our realities and learn for ourselves what truth is. The problem is that the debate of creationism vs. evolution has been fought so many times, the evidence is so overwhelming, nay, damningly in favor of evolution, that the study of human origin becomes one of an economy of speculation. If something has a .000000000000001 percent probability of being accurate, then why would I spend my entire life so vehemently trying to prove it is truth (answer: wishful thinking)? Creationists fail to study the record and in turn seek out new explanations (usually recycled – ID is just the latest iteration of this fallacious thinking) for why god created us in his image. It is time for you to move on. It is time for this debate to move on. The only thing creationists have come up with in the last 200 years is an appeal to emotion (God loves us, you will be rewarded, you are going to hell if you don’t believe this, etc.) to counter very rational, logical and evidentiary arguments in favor of evolution. The Theory of Evolution is validated time and again by various fields of study: anthropological, psychological, biological, geological. The mere fact that there are still large gaps – portions of the record that we have yet to discover – in no way gives you the right to arbitrarily insert your ill-fitting god. I assure you that if you continue to do so, this will only prolong your ignorance and guarantee the day where you will yet again have to pick up and move your god into a different, dark corner of human ignorance as we are enlightened by scientific knowledge. I appeal to you to have the mental discipline to recognize your own intransigence and take some of your own advice that you so imploringly dish out.
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RAmen
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Stephen, Stephen, Stephen. I hardly know where to start. For the sake of argument, I am going to grant that some entity named ‘God’ exists, even though we all know that to be false. The FSM is the only one and true living creator. But, I digress……
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Your notion that God made us to love him is so confused! Let me try to help you think this through. You said “God made us to love him, but if we are to really have the opportunity to love him we must also have the opportunity to not love him.” If God gave us the opportunity to either love him or not, then we were not made to love him. We were created (made) to decide for ourselves. Since God gave us free well to decide for ourselves, then whichever way we decide is in accordance with the will of God because we would be performing according to his purpose. If we make a choice that God does not like, that is his fault, not ours. No harm, no foul. No “sin” here.
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You said, “Follow me here. So you say that a loving creator would not allow so much evil in the world, but he does just because he loves us. He respects us enough to let us make our own decisions cause he knows we’re capable.” I know just how you feel. I can feel the love now, as thousands of children starve in Africa. When that earth quake struck China, I could just feel the love when all those people died. I am sure they all felt the love, too.
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Now you follow me here. If any parent treated his or her children the way your God treats his, any clear thinking human being would condemn that behavior. Children have free will, too, but no loving parent would allow his or her child to run out into traffic. Clearly, your God does not care about his children.
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I strongly recommend that you read “The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.” You will find a much tastier religion than the one you now have. And, in case you do not find that it suits you, we have a 30 day no obligation guarantee. You can quit the Church of the FSM and go back to your old time religion. They will take you back.
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RAmen
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Wow, I remember back in June of 07 when I used to follow this websites articles daily. Now, one year later, I’m looking at what has been posted since then and I am just now learning that my home town (county) was being criticized! Thank You! I moved from that awful place last August and now I’m really happy I did. And now just hearing this makes me even more glad I moved from there. Amazing!So screw you Pinellas County!
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