Author and blogger John Scalzi has posted an amusing report of his visit to the Creation Museum.
Some time ago he said that he’d visit the museum, which was built near his home, on the condition that his readers donated $250, with the added incentive that any extra money would be given to Americans United for the Separation of Church and State. His readers came through and donated over $5000.
So he went, took a bunch of pictures, and posted a very thorough report.
An excerpt:
Here’s how to understand the Creation Museum:
Imagine, if you will, a load of horseshit. And we’re not talking just your average load of horseshit; no, we’re talking colossal load of horsehit. An epic load of horseshit. The kind of load of horseshit that has accreted over decades and has developed its own sort of ecosystem, from the flyblown chunks at the perimeter, down into the heated and decomposing center, generating explosive levels of methane as bacteria feast merrily on vintage, liquified crap. This is a Herculean load of horseshit, friends, the likes of which has not been seen since the days of Augeas.
You can read his entire report here.
GOLD!
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Yeahhhh…That place sucks.
Indeed, the excerpt is pure gold. I saw some pictures earlier and I could not stop laughing!
Hahahahah…excellent description John Scalzi. Think I can face checking out your blog on that tone :))
RAmen
Oh I learn something new everyday…
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“Did you know, for example, that Adam is responsible not only for the fall of man, but also for the creation of venom? It didn’t exist in the Garden of Eden, because, well. Why would it? Weeds? Adam’s fault. Carnivorous animals (and, one assumes, the occasional carnivorous plant)? Adam again. Entropy? You guessed it: Adam. Think about that, won’t you; eat one piece of fruit and suddenly you’re responsible for the inevitable heat death of the universe.”
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And here I was always thinking that it was all Eve’s fault! Well I did say I was a heathen :p
Haha, very good!
He Adam just learned real quick how to blame someone else for his actions :))
Nice opening: horseshit, loads of it :))
Great article. And Scalzi’s right–chances are, the museum’s not going to change anybody’s mind, whatever their beliefs. So, let the creationists have their fun and their modern dinosaurs. As long as they keep in the museum and out of schools.
Great article. Would really like to see the museum, such a load of crap, pity, I’m in Europe
Hahahahahahahaha!!!!! Guess which great state the museum is located in? KENTUCKY!!! That’s just awesome. First the rattle-snake handler religion/cult, now this crap-tastic museum of “truth.” Wow, the state sure attracts them doesn’t it? (I’m curious about the museum. Might have to go to Kentucky just to see it. At the very least, I’m sure they have a killer gift shop that sells dinosaurs. I could get one for my nephew.)
rmw: If you want the BEST dino-stuff, go to Drumheller, Alberta, Canada, home of the Royal Tyrell Museum. It doesn’t makes you swallow loads of creationist BS (or would that be HS) to get your toy T-rex. Hey, I just noticed… Drum-HELL-er. Hmmm. Ah, who cares, it has dinosaurs.
@Dungeon Keeper–if I ever find my way back to Canada, I will try to go there. As it stands, I can drive an hour to Denver and see a pretty cool display, without having to deal with creationist crap. I just find it absolutely hilarious that Kentucky seems to be a hot-spot for…um…”different” religious beliefs. I do give the museum credit though–you’re chances of dying there seem to be pretty remote (unless of course, you’re not a creationist and you die of derisive laughter).
I loved the essay. My only complaint was this.
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“It’s a little idiotic to establish as a ‘fact’ that both science and creationism acknowledge, say, that apes exist, but to paper over the difference in the set of ‘facts’ that explain how the apes got here, or to imply that a creationist assertion (apes created on the fifth day) is logically or systematically equivalent to decades of rigorous scientific process in the exploration of evolution.”
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Fifth day? Fifth? Not even the fundies believe that one! To fundies, apes were created on the sixth day, owing to the fact that they are neither birds or fish. (Unless the horsesh*t museum changed that one too! Do fundies think that apes have feathers, scales and/or gills now? Oh no! The poor quality of science education in the United States is worse than I feared!)
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Apes, much like fundies, fall under the “behemoth” category because they dwell on land and aren’t as smart as actual people. (Okay, I kid. The bible never calls fundies subhuman, that’ just me, and I’m joking.) For someone who spent a day in a museum devoted to creationism, I would have expected him to know what day apes were supposedly created on.
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Here’s a guide so that I don’t have to see anyone make that error again:
1.) Light and Darkness
2.) Sea and Sky (Both of them were made of water at this time. It may have been only with the sky 2.0 patch that ozone, nitrogen, and oxygen were released from closed beta.)
3.) Land
4.) The Sun, Moon, and stars.
5.) Fish and Birds. (Plants, conveniently, were not created in any of the seven days of creation. They are only mentioned in Genesis chapter 2 as being entities that god created but without a specific date given. I put it under day 5 because I wanted to put them with other living things, after the formation of the sun and land that they would feed off of.
6.) Behemoths and Humans. (Behemoths usually means large animals or monsters. However, the bible never gives a date for the creation of small animals either. In this case, I guess that large means “at least as big as an atom” and that caterpillars fall under the category of being large monsters… or fish… or birds… or plants.
7.) The Sabbath
-Avatar of Reason
Awesome! I so want to go there now, just to laugh at the stupidity of these people. Sadly I can’t read the article now, since I am trapped in the centre of boredom and torture some call school, but it looks good from this post, so I’ll check it out when I get home.
And NOES!!! I missed out on the medals AGAIN!!!!
And I just tried to look at the other messages and I can’t look at ANY OTHER ARTICLES! Damn filters…
The blogger noted a placard with this inscriptoin:
“Djedkare Isesi, second to last pharaoh of the fifth dynasty, …”
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Clearly, the kid in the photo is a fan of the Bangles’ song, “Ride like an Egyptian”.
@ Avatar
You mean mosquitos and other buzzy things don’t exist?
Very nice, will have to see it one day. You know, in the same way you would poke a dead animal with a stick as a kid? Morbid curiosity.
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So when are we going to counter with FSM world?
None of that “museum” crap! Just a bid fuck of theme park! We can have a giant “octopus” ride in the middle called the Noodalator or something equally OTT.
The “Beer Volcano” log ride? I’m a little stumped for other ideas as I’ve only just come up with the concept. What would you guys like to see in the way of rides?
Oh I got anther one! The Meat Ball! You get those inflatable balls you can roll around inside, then drop it into a tube system with a high air flow! You shoot through the pipe at high speeds bouncing around. Would be a cross between a rollercoaster and free fall.
@Reasonable Avatar
Hi Avatar :)
“Plants, conveniently, were not created in any of the seven days of creation. They are only mentioned in Genesis chapter 2 as being entities that god created but without a specific date given. I put it under day 5 because I wanted to put them with other living things, after the formation of the sun and land that they would feed off of.”
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Well I’m pretty much completely ignorant to the Genesis creation timeline, but I was just reading at the Skeptic’s Annotated Bible yesterday (… or day before :p) a bit about those plants…
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http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/contra/plants.html.
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and…
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http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/science/long.html
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…now I’m even more confused! Think I’ll stick to that evilutionary timeline :p)
There’d obviously have to be a pirate ship ride. And how about a huge swimming pool with lots of noodly water slides?
Mind you I’ve studied Botany (along side molec bio) for a few years, which covered plant evolution from the beginning and I do believe learning the Genesis version would have been so much quicker and easier! I probably could have had a high paying job at AiG by now :p Eeeeuw!!
@ Jennyanydots- Genius! We could have a ship in a separate pool with a big fuck off wave machine and call it a storm simulator! That would rule. Better than those galleons that rock back and forth (obviously we would have one of those too). Give the feeling of a real stormy night on the & sea’s, water guns giving realistic spray too.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
@Noodly0ne- You’re young, what rides would you like to see?
@ Wench Nickiee - but how highly paid would it have to be to make working for them worthwhile?
Did I read load of horseshit somewhere?
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Stupid american fundies!
That’s some shit!!
CC
@Jennyanydots Nov 21st, 2007 at 3:43 pm
“but how highly paid would it have to be to make working for them worthwhile?”
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Hahahaha….me?…..not this little black duck :p) I was just feeling a little sarcastic. Been reading too much IDiot tripe past few days :(
@Wench Nikkiee:
Woops! Genesis 1 DOES contain a reference to when plants were made. Thanks for pointing that out. I knew about the time discrepancy, but I must have forgotten when I wrote my prior post. (There are way too many discrepancies in the bible to keep track of them all.)
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As for the website that you linked to, some of their contradictions make good points. Others seem to be bad arguments based on deliberately misinterpreted verses. I once had a very interesting conversation with a pastor (which didn’t end well on account of my not being a Christian) in which we spent a considerable amount of time discussing the bible and science and the considerable conflicts between the two, and of course biblical contradictions. He said something that I thought was pretty cool in response to those who try to find biblical flaws. It doesn’t hold its own against the real ones, but it holds its own against some of the ones that I spotted on that website. He said “Using nothing but the words of the bible, I can prove that you should hang yourself. ‘Then he went and hanged himself’ ‘Go and do likewise.’” (Matthew 27:5) (Luke 10:37).
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The pastor’s comment was intended to teach about the importance of context. The first quote was about the fate of Judas. The second was from the tale of the Good Samaritan.
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In short, thanks for correcting me, but I wouldn’t rely too heavily on that website.
@Jennyanydots:
If God never created them, how can they exist? Unless they were created in the second and completely different creation story offered in Genesis 2. Were mosquitos intended to keep us company? Weird!
hahahahaha….=)
They were probably a punishment for eating apples, seems like everything that isn’t perfect and lovely is.
You mean that whining noise and sucking blood is cos they just want to be friendly?
Have to get your attention somehow.
Couldn’t they just say hi and buy me a drink?
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Oh, and Nickiee - I already assumed the sarcasm, probably because most people would need an awful lot of money from them to work for them. Like maybe their entire evangelising budget so they couldn’t afford to tell people any of their ideas.
Reasonable Avatar Nov 21st, 2007 at 4:11 pm
“Thanks for pointing that out.”
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Hahaha…wow…first time ever for me….I don’t really do much religion!
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“As for the website that you linked to, some of their contradictions make good points. Others seem to be bad arguments based on deliberately misinterpreted verses.”
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I agree. Was my first visit where I actually read a bit of stuff there and …erm…wasn’t that impressed with the strength of most of those examples there either. Did see a few other similar type pages on that trip (can’t remember where ) that were a bit more interesting. Can’t even remember why I was at those sites in the first place…off on some tangent no doubt.
I did like the four legged insect examples I came across though. :)
Jennyanydots .
“Oh, and Nickiee - I already assumed the sarcasm”
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Thanks (:))
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“most people would need an awful lot of money from them to work for them.”
Well that and the fact the Disco Institution certainly made Behe and Dembsky famous. More names to follow too I think! :(
And here I was thinking that you were talking about a club with disco Music, Wench Nikkiee…
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I have to learn more gringo culture.
My fundamentalist brother-in-law lives near this thing. For our Family Reunion this summer he proudly announced that he had arranged a special tour of the Creation Museum for the whole family! We tried to be as tactful as we could (they are relatives) by quickly deciding that we had PROMISED to take our kids to the Aquarium that same morning. My girls came back from the aquarium with some beautiful plush toy snakes they had fallen in love with at the gift shop. They were promptly informed by one of my brother-in-law’s numerous kids that “snakes are the devil’s creatures”. I worry for those kids. Perhaps I will send them pirate hats for Holiday.
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RAmen
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Open your mind, but not so far your brain falls out
Problem is, when you say discovery, it sounds like they actually look for something, not just reading the bible.
@ Ubi Dubium, don’t forget toy swords or eye patches to go with the hats.
@ Ubi Dubium - How about getting really subversive and sending any boy aged between say 6-10 a nice dinosaur book, and give the fsm gospel to the eldest couple of kids, with maybe a cuddly fsm to the youngest.
@PacificPam (Butterfly)
“And here I was thinking that you were talking about a club with disco Music, Wench Nikkiee…”
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Well it could have I suppose…
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storm petrel
I agree with you…kinda makes ya feel unclean having to write that when referring to those IDiots!
Now I get it, storm petrel.
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I am totally slow today…
Before this museum opened, we had been sending them toy dinosaurs. But now, I think they are just putting saddles on them. If I sent the kids copies of the Gospel, the parents would just take them away, and probably have a book burning. So I have to be subtle about it. I need to find gifts that encourage the kids to think for themselves, but that the parents won’t think is suspicious. Not easy.
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Open your mind, but not so far your brain falls out.
If any of them are old enough to be into science fiction introduce them to Asimov, see how long it takes for them to find his essay ‘the armies of the night’.
I’ve seen the same essay titled ‘The ”threat” of creationism’, which is why you have to let them find it themselves, if the parents saw that title you’d probably have book burning and the kids banned from reading his stuff forever.
hmm, perhaps we can come up with a list of suitable gifts for different ages to encourage kids to develop their own ideas. Actually, I hope it isn’t going to happen to the level of extremism you find in fundamentalism but my cousin’s 5 year old is probably edging into the category of being taught there’s only one answer, so if we come up with anything suitable for him I’ll probably take you up on suggestions from here.
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Just to start off with a couple - I still reckon dinosaurs are a good way into it for a lot of them, but if that isn’t acceptable I know over here you can get stuff aimed at under 10s that looks at archaeology and egyptology. The egyptian stuff can be helpful because the parents might assume it’s good because they can tie it to biblical references but if the kids get interested they start looking at evidence of a number of other different histories. Or, if they’re into animals, adopt a chimpanzee on their behalf and let the information supplied by the organisation tell them about how chimps are our closest relatives and must be protected. The original gift can’t be seen as suspicious, and once that’s accepted, it would be rather difficult for the parents to then say that they aren’t allowed to read the updates sent out.
Thanks SP - I hadn’t heard of that one before. For anyone else who’s interested, I just found the article reprinted here - http://www.stephenjaygould.org/ctrl/azimov_creationism.html
@ Ubi Dubium- Bye them personalised children’s bible filled with lot of little subversive comments.
“And on the 7th day god created atheist!”
“Do unto other… all the nasty shit you claim to find morally adherent”
“And Jesus said to the masses ‘you know that son of god stuff is meant to be symbolic? Now who wants Cod in bread crumb? I’m staving”
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Or better yet take them to FSM world, soon to be the world premier pasta based attraction! (I just have to build it first)
Any fundie kids who like reptiles could be introduced to Tuataras, a living fossil, has a third eye and everything, the rest of the Order became extinct about 60m years ago, before the Earth was created ;>. http://nzphoto.tripod.com/animal/tuatara.htm
I will help you build it!
Should I bring safety googles?
Sorry - goggles
@PacificPam (Butterfly)- sure why not. Anyone else want to help?
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@Ubi Dubium- You could take those poor kids to a normal museum? Kid love that stuff. Point out to them the times and ages of things and be sure to grab a guide when ever your brother in law is about to open his mouth.
Alternatively get your brother in law into snake handling and if you are lucky he will get bitten and die, then every ones a winner!
*drowsy* :O
Hahahahaahaha…snake handling…
Butterfly collecting ;-)
Should I be jealous?
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*falling into a stupor*
No Pam my love. Only one butterfly I want to get my hands on.
I’ve been to this “museum” myself… Kind of a long story, but at some part in my life (a few weeks ago) I was temporarily inmate of a christian private school in kentucky…
I agree 100% that creation crap was the biggest pile of horseshit I’ve ever seen.
@rmw - It’s been years since I last visited our museum; and over time, that has certainly grown, and changed. But, I believe the wonderful collection of fossils - including some dinosaurs, and other items from both the Morrison strata and the area around Dinosaur National Monument remain a feature. (Dinosaur National was a real blast itself; though the raft ride on the river was more fun.)
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Anyway, I have a friend who works at the museum here. He tells me that we have something of a local phenomonon, in the way of one of the “Creation Science” funnymentalcases, Seems as if this one checks the museum schedule for school field trips; and then comes in at the point where one of the docents is presenting material on some of the early dioramas. At this juncture, the funnymentalcase starts his own “lecture”, contradicting the docent repeatedly,and insisting on how “wrong” the presentation being given to the youngsters is; and, of course, going on to spout the gaseous flatulence of the “Genesis theory”.
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This horse’s rear-end orfice got himself into the newspapers, when the museum tried to put him out the door as something of a “nuisance”. And of course, up rises the good old “freedom of speech” bit - which, strictly speaking, the guy has as his right. (Free speech for funnymentalcases, that is! But you had better bet that when they take over, that’ll be “corrected”!)
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Sees as if he’s also appeared at the Morrison strata site, out on I-70, during the time they have conducted tours there, as well. But, whoever handles that area seems to have managed to keep things from getting out of hand. And, outdoors as it is, there is less ability to disturb everyone in the place. But, the guy is persistent, if nothing else.
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Ah! Only in Cowlorado!
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My friend tells me they still have the guy in their hair at the museum from time to time, though some form of “compromise” was worked out; at least to keep him away from harassing the children directly. I don’t know whether he shows up from the “church” of that whacko out West, in Arvada, with the “Hell House” Halloween shtick, or actually drives up all the way from down in Colorado Springs; but, I have heard that there is talk of building another monument to horse-manure somewhere down in that area - “inspired”, I hear, by the “success” of the Kentucky venture. (Though right now, the Haggard fiasco seems to have moved future manure piles to something of a back burner in the area.)
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Ain’t funnymentalism just graaaand!?!
@Old Grouch–I wouldn’t be at all surprised if the Dobsonites decided to build their own museum. From their point of view, why shouldn’t they? I mean, Focus on the Family (Dobson’s evangelical creation–google it if remotely interested) has it’s own freeway off-ramp. A museum would be the next logical step.
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Is the museum of Science and History a state institution, or is a privately funded one? If there’s any state funding, then uber-religious jerk does have a legal right to preach the “good word.” But, I know the museum takes in money from ticket sales and private donations. If that’s where all the money comes from, then I don’t think the First Amendment applies (it’s a private organization telling this guy to get lost, not a government one).
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@Ubi Dubium–A natural history museum is a great idea for keeping your nieces and nephews open to different points of view. The creationist museum does have brilliant marketing: if you have dinosaurs, then the kids will love it. If you go to a museum that goes with the theory of evolution (which, at this point in time, is the one that makes the most amount of sense), you can just “innocently” say “Hey, let’s go see the dinosaurs.” If a kid asks, “How long ago were there dinosaurs?” you can reply, “A really long time ago. Let’s see what the signs say.” Exposing them to different theories on the sly (and hopefully without causing family acrimony).
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@Pluto–dude, I love the idea of a theme park. Although, considering we’re spread out over the world, we might want to consider the Disney model, and build several parks over several years in several countries. Though maybe not a mascot walking around…they’re just kind of creepy.
But what could possibly be creepy about someone in a giant fsm costume walking around, touching people with noodles…
Ha, ha! Those christians are just crazy. There is not even any pasta mentioned in the bible ANYWHERE. No really. Not one mention!!!
What do they think god is like made of rice or something?!
Crazy!!
Haha, from the sound of it the Creation Museum might be a fun place to visit, for a few laughs.
RAmen
Did anyone notice the piracy reference?
No? Well have a look at the photo tour and in particular this one
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2069/1969980818_46bc049e9c.jpg?v=0
Yes! Set sail on the seven Cs! All aboard the Golden Beaver!
Note the use of the apostrophe in the photograph! I don’t know if it’s just me or do fundies really have a thing about the misuse of this punctuation mark?
CC
Just remember to breathe Pixel, you wouldn’t want to pass out around people who really believe in creationism, they might think you’re posessed and try to exorcise you.
That would be fun, exorcism!
@ Jennyanydots- “But what could possibly be creepy about someone in a giant fsm costume walking around, touching people with noodles…”
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Welllll, pretty much what you just said. Yes that might be a little creepy.
I was thinking of buying the old Mole Men costumes from “Saul of the Mole Men”, they are scary but cool too!
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I’m considering buying a failing fun fair/theme park and doing it up. If we all chipped in we could make it happen.
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@ rmw- I googled your man Dobson and got this
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/02/AR2007030201442.html
Evangelical Angers Peers With Call for Action on Global Warming
“Focus on the Family founder James C. Dobson and other conservative Christian leaders are calling for the National Association of Evangelicals to silence or fire an official who has urged evangelicals to take global warming seriously…
Cizik has been a leader in efforts to broaden evangelicals’ political agenda beyond abortion and same-sex marriage. He says Christians have a biblical imperative to protect the environment, which he calls “creation care.””
If we are lucky they will wage holy war. Then they and all their little followers could kill each other off!
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“The NAE’s board is scheduled to meet next week in Minnesota. Its former president, the Rev. Ted Haggard, resigned in November after a scandal involving sex and drugs.
His successor, the Rev. Leith Anderson, defended Cizik as “a great asset.” He also said that the Dobson letter was released to the news media before it was received by the board. “I guess that says it all,” he said.”
Do you think Anderson is pissed off with Dobson for crying to the press like a little baby?
Thanks CC. Just one question - are they using the word “consummation” in a different way to the rest of us, or are they finally coming round to the stripper heaven idea
@ Pluto - would have sounded even worse if I’d written what I was originally intending, i.e. noodly appendages rather than noodles
I want rollercoasters!
Non-fat milk doesn’t taste right…
@Pluto–yeah, I love how they pick and chose their moral issues. Although frankly, if these morons stay out of the global warming debate, that’s probably a good thing. No doubt they would criticize the fact that the lack of pirates is the main cause, since their version of pirates doesn’t exactly “jive” with their beliefs.
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Anyway, happy Thanksgiving to those who celebrate it. :-) I’m off and won’t be back til Friday.
@rmw - When I was a boy - some 7 decades ago - the Museum was Denver’s pride and joy, basically tax supported. Over the years, it developed a number of fund raising approaches - including the old Brico Synphony in the auditorium added on at the East, and the planetarium - currently the sort of “super-screen” movie area as well - which did charge admission, and were “renters”. (Of course, back then, even the Zoo was free down in the Park.) Nowadays, I’m not really certain how much of the Museum is still a City operation and how much is privately funded - admission charges not, in and of themselves, establishing “private ownership”, since almost every civic entity in Colorado has had to do something to keep itself afloat with Burceism’s anti-tax TABOR Amendment in place.
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It may very well be Dobson and his claque that will provide the funding - as well as much of the force behind - a horse-manure temple down there. The man seems to be becoming even more unhinged than ever before. Certainly, that bunch is having a wonderful time gathering signatures for another State Constitutional Amendment Initiative, this one to declare the moment conception, joining of sperm and ovum - even in a Petri dish - a “person”, with full “legal rights” as such in Colorado. (Along with an upswing in flatulent emissions about “killing the unborn child” when refering to abortion.) This Amendment would make a spontaneous miscarriage subject to criminal investigation, and possible criminal action against the woman carrying this “unborn child” - since, after all, it is the funnymentalcase position that women must “bear children in pain and suffering”, since that is “written in God’s Law”; and even a spontaneous miscarriage is, to them, a form of “abortion”.
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Only in Cowlorado!
@Jennyanydots Nov 21st, 2007 at 7:13 pm
are they using the word “consummation” in a different way to the rest of us?
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Consummated if I know!
CC
Consummation? Isn’t it sex?
First timed it, m’dear!
CC
Sex on the brain babe?
Yo Codpiece! Hands off my Cool-Aid!
What? Sex on the brain? Honey…
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Hahahahaha I always laugh a lot when you say that “hands off my Cool-Aid”.
*confused*
She started it! with offers of consumation and lurid solicitations.
Check for yourself!
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PacificPam (Butterfly) Nov 21st, 2007 at 7:46 pm
Consummation? Isn’t it sex?
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and hey that’s Captain Codpiece to you or there’ll be another keelhaulin’!
ArrrrrrrrAmen!
CC
Usually, yes Pam. Which is why I thought they may have a different dictionary to the rest of us, which wouldn’t be wholly surprising.
Actually, Codpiece, I reckon you started it, by flagging up their 7 Cs.
the fundies started it! It’s in their god damned museum!
There’ll be no mutiny on my watch, lad!
CC
@Captain Codpiece - No you lose your rank if you hit on my woman.
That’s right! I’m a bad mama-jama who loves his lady.
Now remember that or you’ll get no help stealing the Victory for your fleet!
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Any “Consummation” will be done by me! 5 time a night!
Hey you CC! I was asking what it was cuz you guys were talking about a different meaning and I thought I was translating it wrong!
Yes! I agree with you, darling…specially with the 5 a night thingy…heheheh
Yeah don’t call my woman a slut! only I get to do that.
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*plop*
Sorry Pam - your original translation was absolutely fine, and I apologise for causing the confusion. It just seemed an odd thing for the fundies to promote…
Hey you? Pam, Pluto, Jenny, I now feel ganged up on and that just ain’t right! I never even noticed the consummation part of the 7 Cs board until Jenny pointed it out. I thought my reply to her question about it’s meaning was quite (admittedly not very) witty. When Pam asked for further clarification she also profered an interpretation of her own, which I praised for it’s astueness. Now enters Pluto with some hip-hop jive about Cool-Aid, tone verging on the abusive. I thought that re-interpreting Pam’s post might make light of the situation, but no! On top of that Jenny jumps in by saying that I started it. Well I don’t know if this is perhaps me over-reacting but I wonder if role playing pirates as a religion as suddenly become over rated. answers on a post card please!
Last call of duty for a retiring sea faring man.
CC
Lots of us were actually brought up by religious wackos. While my parents themselves weren’t religious nutjobs, my grandparents tried their best to force me into being a good xian. I took a huge dump in the middle of being christened, and got promptly kicked out of every Sunday school I ever attended, usually for asking one simply question: Why?
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If the kids are smart, very little to no guidance is needed to lead them to sane logical thought. They will eventually find it on their own. My best friend, who led me to the great FSM, Sauce Be Upon Him, was raised strictest dumbest Catholic, yet she is one of the smartest most reasonable people I know, other that the rabid atheism, although I think she may soften in her dotage =) Not that I blame her! I’ve been to the Catholics in my grandaprents’ attempt to find Any church capable of “dealing” with me.
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A pagan soul is just a pagan soul, and there’s nothing a fundie can do to ruin it! So no real worries, all I’d suggest is whispering names like Asimov, Bradbury, and Heinlein at the appropriate ages. Don’t forget Piers Anthony and Tolkien too, gotta give them the purely fun stuff too. Kids are Very good at finding out Things Their Parents Don’t Want Them to Know, and it’s getting easier than ever with computers getting more complicated every 5 minutes and kids being born with them in their hot little hands… My oldest could close out a program before he could crawl. That scares the hell out of me.
Oi, CC - of course I was going to say you started it. Otherwise someone would have pointed out it was clearly my fault!
@Pluto
Can I suggest you get a testosterone level check. you’re getting a bit XYY in case you hadn’t noticed!
CC
(Parting shot across the bow.)
Oh, and by the way - had no intention of making anyone feel bad, but wasd worrying I might have caused problems for Pam. You just got caught in me trying to make things easier for her, and please don’t go because of me.
Thanks for that Jenny.
Jenny, actually I feel like we’re all trespassing on the 2P’s private e mail when ever I post these days.
@Captain Codpiece-
“Well I don’t know if this is perhaps me over-reacting but I wonder if role playing pirates as a religion as suddenly become over rated. answers on a post card please!”
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HAHAHAHAHA Sorry dude my lady love’s it when I act the bad arse.
Your ok with me mate, I thought the Hip-Hop Jive bit would have been a give away.
I’m as white as they come, mate! I don’t take it seriously dude, chill.
I’m not some jealous idiot, but apparently I’m good at winding you up.
I thought a pirate would give better than that! Hahahaha
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@Pam- Still love your bad boy?
Oh, come on CC…they are just joking around…you know we are not serious people…You have always had good sense of humour.
Bye, then.
Much as I dislike using them, I should probably add emoticons if I’m deliberately teasing someone. Sorry again, CC, for making you feel in any way annoyed or upset. And, meaning no offence to the Ps, I agree it can feel like an intrusion to jump in with points while they’re talking sometimes but this thread has had enough other people involved and points to respond to that it’s been possible to get involved in the rest of the discussion without trespassing on young love.
@Captain Codpiece - see? we are nice people…I know my man is…and for what I have read, Jennyanydots is nice too…I can be a biatch somtimes, but most of the time I’m nice. I was asking about it cuz I thought I had the wrong translation…and by the way…I didn’t even understan your reply post…hahahaha I was like “What does he means?”
@Captain Codpiece- “@Pluto
Can I suggest you get a testosterone level check. you’re getting a bit XYY in case you hadn’t noticed!”
No I was pissed off by some cunt earlier but that has nothing to do with this. Chill out man, I don’t want to give a salty sea dog a hart attack.
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But seriously! Hands off my Cool-aid!
Oh, well…sorry
Did we make him leave? I feel shitty now.
Don’t worry Pam - I think it’s kind of sweet really.
Captin? Are you there? I’m sorry, I will help you steel the Victory.
Oh dear, I forget how intimidating I can be.
‘This is a Herculean load of horseshit’ couldn’t sum it up better myself and a great article.
Same here. If any of the old hands have regular contact with him, plaese do pass on how sorry I am for my part in any offence he’s felt. It was not intended, and I really do not want to be the cause of anyone who has been a long-standing part of this community feeling that they have to leave.
@Jennyanydots - Dammit, I feel bad now…I didn’t mean to make him leave…I was trying to clear my doubts as I have done previously…
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What is sweet? =)
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@Pluto - Luv for ya…tons of it.
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Pam - I meant you and Pluto were sweet, in case your apology related to my comment about occasionally feeling like we’re intruding on you and Pluto, as I didn’t want to upset anyone, never mind 2, or even 3 people in the space of 5 minutes.
I know Pam, but I hurt CC and now my mighty heart is broken.
Thanks Jennyanydots, I wasn’t upset before, but I am now. FSMers shouldn’t hurt each other; we should leave that to the Christ patrol.
I like the article. Some kids will never buy this though, even if there parents are crazy. My dad was, and he got pissed at me because I got kicked out of bible school because when the teacher told the class how Jesus walked on water, I berated her and told her ‘It isn’t nice to lie to little kids.’ I don’t blame myself for it but my mom and dad got divorced a while after that, but because he was violent and crazy. My mom married my step-dad, who was intellegent and not crazy so it all worked out.
Pam - I agree on the feeling bad thing. I really, really hope he comes back and sees that we didn’t mean to hurt him.
Hahahahahahaha, Jennyanydots, I don’t care…I always like to have a nice talk…I have never minded anyone “intruding” in my conversations with Pluto…what we post here is nothing…we work on a daily e-mail basis…sometimes he doesn’t even pay attention to me…
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I don’t think is intruding or anything…If I don’t want anyone getting involved in my conversations I wouldn’t post them on an internet site…
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@Pluto - I will go get some crazy glue to glue it together…or sticky goo?
@Niteshade_ Good for you! standing up for yourself paid off.
@Jennyanydots - I hope he does…=(
@Niteshade - My dad is a mormon…Or, should I say, a Moron?
It’s hard. I have to fit a relationship in to my work time between 1 and 5 o’clock. We get to talk on the phone when I get home but she is still at work because it is only lunch time for her. We do our best and I don’t think we ham it up to much here, but these few moment are all we have and I lover her so much. It’s just not fair!
Don’t you hate time zones?
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Hey I just realised that New year for you comes 5hours before! ahahahahahah…cool
Baby…don’t be sad…Kisses =)
that place is retarded
We have to come up with a new word to explain how retarded they are
@PacificPam-I find “fucktarded” is always a winner, and if that don’t work, there’s always “Dipshittarded”.
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@Pluto (as well)- I’ll help you build FSM World!! Where is it going to be built, and can I get a job there?
I’m thinking Alaska, and Captain of Awesomeness respectively.
Going so far back to between the times I could access this page…
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YAY for FSM world! Huzzah and yaaaargh! How I should love to walk through that beauteous place, secure in the knowledge that attending this park would make me intellectually and spiritually…OOH, WATER SLIDE!!!!
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I’ll help you build the franchise. I’ll work on FSM World UK.
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RAmen.
Mmm, fsm world. Here’s my take: Spaghetti vendors, noodley-inspired water slides, one of those things that spins shaped like Him with a person in each Noodley Appendage going up and down… oh, yeah, and an enormous rock climbing wall that’s actually a huge stone tablet with the eight I’d-really-rather-you-didn’ts inscribed in it! And a pirate ship water ride… wow, this’ll be expensive. Especially because we’ll have to hire some pastafarian policemen to keep out the fundies. Beat them with wet noodles! Aaarg!
(Beat the fundies, not the cops.)
I volunteer to keep the fundies at bay. All I ask is that you give me an hour on the rides each day, a note for school saying I’m dead and can’t ever go back and a one-way ticket to America.
To Ayumi-chan’s teacher,
I’m afraid Ayumi-chan will be unable to attend school any longer as he/she (?) is now deceased.
Yours Sincerely
Wench Nikkiee
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My contribution :)
Hmmm….ya think I should have used “has expired” rather than “is now deceased”?
hahahahahah can you make one for my bosses?
Any thoughts where we should have FSM world? Perhaps in some fundie-begotten corner of the world with which the FSM could reach out with his noodly appendages of love!
I am biased but I would say Belfast, Northern Ireland as we have a blight of fundies here who really need to feel the love! Starting(with degree mill awarded) -cough-”Dr” Paisley…
I am biased tooo…
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On the tropics like that it won’t close because of snow or anything
@ Cap’n Ollie: “Dipshittarded”…. bwaaaaaaaaaahahahahahaha!!
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@PacificPam …. I was thinking Craptarded (given it was a bunch of horseshit) would be good, but dipshittarded is waaaay better.
www.apostasy-exposed.blogspot.com
@Dylan_Dog Nov 22nd, 2007 at 2:19 am: “Any thoughts where we should have FSM world? Perhaps in some fundie-begotten corner of the world with which the FSM could reach out with his noodly appendages of love!I am biased but I would say Belfast, Northern Ireland as we have a blight of fundies here who really need to feel the love! Starting(with degree mill awarded) -cough-”Dr” Paisley…”
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Why not in Flanders, Northern (soon ex-)Belgium? Nobody really cares about religion over here, save for some overheated islamism of course. That way it wouldn’t suffer too much vandalism, and it could counterbalance the Atomium with its 9 balls … errrrrm … spheres. Oh, and since Belgium is the worldwide authority on beer (qualitywise, not quantitywise)… Yes, Belgium’s first vulcano will be a beer vulcano!
RAmen!
@Wench Nikkiee
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“I’m afraid Ayumi-chan will be unable to attend school any longer as she has now expired”?
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Makes me sound like an old packet of pasta sauce well past its sell-by date…XD
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@Jean Bart
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We should deffo have one in Flanders. My school run a history trip there every year! They could make it part of the experience :)
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Better than having it in Northern Ireland, anyway. Northern Ireland scares me, with all the bombed out buildings and stuff…-shiver-
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Incedentally, is it just me or are a lot of countries breaking up? What with Belgium soon-to-be gone and Scotland leaving the UK, it’s a confuzzling time for a geography student.
Ha! I spent two years learning all about the berlin wall, differences on east and west and then 2 months before the exam the bl**dy thing falls!
Grrrrr, all that wasted time learning utterly useless stuff :(
Just consider it learning history as it happened.
Oh My FSM!!!!!!!
I’m so sorry I set everyone off yesterday. I had no idea!
I had to rush off to a rehearsal (I was late actually) and I didn’t mean to disappear like that. I thought you would just get on with business as usual. If it makes you feel any better, as a bone fide captain it’s within my capabilities to carry out wedding ceremonies. If you two Ps decide to tie the transatlantic knot I’d be proud to do the honors! Apart from that… Hey men! there’s many a fundie galleon out there waitin’ for a scupperin’ an’ we’re just the sorry bunch o’ scallywags for the job! So.. Whadya say, me hearties? Set sail for the Seven Cs an’ damn their eyyyyyyyes, god bli’me! ‘N’ as much consummation as yer loins’ll stand, Pluto, me laaaaaad!
ArrrrrrrrrrrrrrrAmen
(From ‘The Return of Captain Codpiece’)
P.S. The joke book is coming along nicely!
What? You mean you were pissing with us too? I felt really bad man!
There how do you like them apples?
Would that be the fruit of knowledge you toying with there, lad?
Did you take the whole photo tour?
That sohuld make you feel even worse!
What? Much as I’m relieved to hear we didn’t upset you, I spent yesterday evening still worrying about it when I got home from work last night!
I was not pissing with you. I thought you were the tough guy!
Anyway, regarding my theme park idea. I think that, as suggested by some one else (sorry forgot who) I think a franchise would be good. Like Six Flags (Six Noodles?). We need a first one and I nominate my home town of Portsmouth (on the site of Clarence Pier. There Isn’t a fundie epidemic here, in fact it’s quite a liberal place, but she is a bit of a shit hole on account of the government putting most of the redevelopment funds in to London!
I could give back to the community that has given me… well very little apart from some good nights out.
However as I will attempt to have this developed as a Cooperative (I like the Co-Op they do good deals on beer!) I will be trying to scam the rest of you into paying, so will go with the minority choice for a location.
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On another note: Yester day I was reminded why I should be proud to be British! As I withdrew some cash I looked at my £10 note to see Charles Darwin looking back at me!
Despite of Tony Blair’s’ city academes, which have allowed Evangelists to set up camp in schools and the damage Labour have done to education in my country, we are still a nation with intellect and wit.
FSM bless England!
@Jenny
I’m sorry I dashed off like that! It was only now that I saw the continuation! My own continuation consisted of a seven hour rehearsal of Portugese Fado and Greek trasditional songs, finnishing at 1:00 in the morning! It’s been like that for a week now and the show opens tomorrow night!
I was really a bit upset with Pluto’s over-protective, almost territoral machinations. But hey I apologize to you if you lost sleep over this!
CC
@ Captain Codpiece returns – I am the tough guy!
But I have a certain level of respect to the regulars I would hate to hurt your feelings. Being tough doesn’t mean being an arse hole.
Now lets storm the dock yard!
Plymouth ho!
Don’t take my lack of sleep too personally, CC - I actually still feel bad about getting into a fairly vigourous online debate with a 13 year old home schooled fundie who informed us his science books had ID as fact and then challenged a group comprising an archaeologist, a biologist, a physicist and two non-specialist but highly intelligent people who knew the biblical stuff to throw into the debate too, to “prove evolution”. The poor kid stood no chance, and it did turn into a bit of a massacre. This was 6 or 7 years ago!
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On a slightly different note - hope the rehearsal went well, and good luck tomorrow.
I wonder if he’s still a fundie or if that got him thinking about the stuff he had been blindly following.
What the fuck do you mean you were pissing with us????????
I was feeling sooooooo fucking bad yesterday because….fuck!
All I can say is it’s good to have a tough guy on your side, an arse hole on your side would make it dificult to go to the toilet! And anyone who can rhetorically debunk a 13 year old is OK in my book!
CC
Anyhow, Captain, I am glad you are not mad at us…but let me tell you…good acting skills…
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Good luck on the play!
PacificPam (Butterfly) Nov 22nd, 2007 at 4:20 pm
What the fuck do you mean you were pissing with us????????
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read my post of 32 minutes ago!
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Captain Codpiece returns Nov 22nd, 2007 at 3:48 pm
I was not pissing with you.
I just got here…
Sadly it didn’t have enough of the desired effect. Any time we mentionned one of the bits of evidence his “science” book hadn’t already explained away, his response was ‘I’m just a kid, I don’t know about that, it isn’t fair, you’ve all studied this’. For some reason he never made the connection that that was sort of the point, and made it look like we were all deliberately picking on the religious kid. Last time I heard, he’d gone no to bible college
oops - gone on, not no.
Let’s leave it at that! This thread is so totally excellent to get too cluttered with personal shit as well as the horse shit museum of complete and utter ignorance! If you haven’t already taken the photo tour on the blog then I highly recomnd it. It took me 15 minutes of belly laughing to get through it!
CC
Pity, some kids might have been encouraged to try and learn something about the arguements you were using against him, I know I would, even though I was very religious when I was younger, never the frothing at the mouth, ‘if it’s not in the bible it’s a lie’ kind though, maybe that’s the difference.
I’m taking it at the moment, CC. Doing it the slow way though as that way I get to enjoy the captions and the comments posted by other people who also see how silly it is.
@Jenny
I can understand how kids can’t change their view point even in the face of overwhelming evidence. And the reason is explained in The God Deception. Evolution has made kids take at face value things that grown ups tell them. They do not question authority until later. 13 is just on the brink of this change so he might have felt the same feeling a schizophrenic feels when you show him the inside of the match box which he had claimed contained maybe a thought transmiter. It’s ironic that this line or reasoning as partial proof of evolution should make someone so convinced that there is no such thing!
I took the tour and was completely shocked from what I saw…talking abuout how the dinosaurs dissappeared on the flood but they were also taken in the ark because they were small as sheeps…
That museum should be burnt! I feel insulted by the way they try to explain everything with their stupid bible!
Unfortunately true, and because he was home schooled, getting no contradicting information from other grown-ups such as teachers, and I seem to recall most of the socialising he did was within the church group his parents were members of, he wasn’t being prompted to question that authority by learning in his day-to-day expeience that there were other views.
So, Jennyanydots, did he cry?
not unless he did it afterwards when he thought about all the stuff we’d said and decided that maybe we had a point after all. But given he decided to go to a fundamentalists training college at 18 I somehow doubt it was that life-changing
…Dammit…should have made him cry…
Well…maybe on some other time…
But I didn’t want to make him cry. That would have been even more of a failure than not managing to make him think was.
Can’t we storm an existing theme park, take the staff prisoner and hoist up a jolly FSM flag? That would be very pirate like! If we picked the Creation Museum then two birds with one stone! Then we can fuck with all the existing exhibits, to pariey them selves. If they don’t all ready.
There’s still time, unfortunately he’s unlikely to meet anyone who’ll give him an alternate view of the world while learning to be a bible thumper, but at least he isn’t too old to learn to ask questions yet, although it’d probably take something pretty major to do that.
Well, Jennyanydots, I think it would have been a succes because maybe he would have cried out of anger at his parents for teaching him all the lies and then he would have gone to some kickass college and study astrophysics!
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Ha!
@Pluto - There is nothing interesting in Kentucky…don’t put the theme park there. Better in Australia…close to the kangaroos and the walabis…they are so cute.
He was a nice enough kid, apart from the blind obedience to his parents’ faith part, and I suspect it would probably need to be something major in a bad kind of way, which I wouldn’t want him to have to go through. Unless he ends up marrying some scientist who manages to convince him otherwise.
But would his parents allow him to marry a heathen without blind faith?
Highly unlikely. Also, as above - his social life is completely centred on religion, so where’s he going to meet said heathen
Mind you, it has certain possibilities for a conversion campaign. Teams of science students going door to door on a bible college campus…
Jenny. It’s much more likely to have the right effect if he were to fall in love with some Hari Krishna girl who busts his balls about reincanation or Karma! This internal conflict what really gets the ball (or in this case balls) rolling. It’s probably better for this major thing to start a reaction to something rahter than for him just to be convinced by some scientist. I would imagine that’s why he didn’t catch on the first time. He needs a mind opener, not just a mind changer. Oops getting a bit ‘on the couch with Sigmund’ there…
CC
Or perhaps a Pastafarian wench?
CC - that’s pretty similar to what I had in mind, but I was hoping to bypass a step and just have him wanting to learn about the science stuff to understand what makes this hypothetical scientist-wife tick.
I saw one of these programs about a god box town. They had this farther talking about his daughter and her fiancé. He decided that after they had been engaged for 3 years they could hold hands! But he said he was aware of were this kind of behaviour can lead. LOL. How do you think the poor boy will cope with his marriage night? Or maybe the dad will tell him he has to wait another 3 years after marriage before he can fuck his own wife! I wonder if they will use one of those sheets with a hole in it.
. The thing that got me the most was that a guy in the town hand made paddles to spank the kids with! Each one had “every time with love” written on it! There was a recommendation list of how many whacks the kid should get for what. Disobeying your parents and questioning gods will were both on the list!
So that poor kid you were trying to educate was probably beaten to shit by his parents when he asked questions after talking to you! Probably got extra for failing to convert you.
I got t’ get me one o’ them paddles!
Aarrrrrr!
Why do you need a special paddle? You’ve got a whole ship full of suitable objects. Just take up some of the wooden planks.
“Remember that god loves you honey and wants you to love him too. He gave you free will so you can choose not to, however he will send you to a pit of eternal hell fire is you don’t. And if that’s not enough we will paddle your ass black and blue too!
But remember god loves you and so do we! Now bend over… Oh the lever straps me and mommy are wearing? They are ceremonial. And when my man thing goes all hard it’s to point the way to god and has nothing to do with any sort of perverse sexual pleasure I might get from hitting a defenceless child with a big piece of wood!”
Oh - retrospective edit of my last point - and maybe cut them down to a slightly less scary size, before you do someone an injury.
By the way, I’m still looking at those photos instead of doing some work, which could be a problem, but just had to add a link to this one, for the sign alone. http://www.flickr.com/photos/scalzi/1970012300/in/set-72157603091357751/ - just ignore me if you already saw it.
lala!
you there?
Just finished them all. Can recommend the slow tour with all the comments, if you’ve got the time, but my brain hurts. Think I need a cup of tea. Well, only because I can’t drink something stronger when at work.