NOVA’s most recent program is about the Intelligent Design debate over the last few years. They’ve put together an excellent companion website, and as of November 16th, you can watch the entire program online – I highly recommend it. NOVA always does a fantastic job on their programs and this is no exception.
My one criticism is that they neglected to mention the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster’s role in the Intelligent Design vs Science debate.
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An elaborate spoof on Intelligent Design, The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is neither too elaborate nor too spoofy to succeed in nailing the fallacies of ID. It's even wackier than Jonathan Swift's suggestion that the Irish eat their children as a way to keep them from being a burden, and it may offend just as many people, but Henderson, described elsewhere as a 25-year-old "out-of-work physics major," puts satire to the same serious use that Swift did. Oh, yes, it is very funny. -- Scientific American
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Checked that out when they posted the clips. Excellent! Thanks NOVA (:))
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Transcripts also available there :))
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Silver
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So far this seems like a great resource for whats happening all over the place. I also haven’t seen any reference to His Noodliness. Hopefully they will be touched and all their nonsense will be at an end.
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I don’t see how they really could have slipped the FSM into the Dover Trial format. However maybe in an epilogue covering the continuation of the ID movement?
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I soooooooo wanted FSM to pop up as an example of how biased the school board was.
…I mean, having only one Intelligent Design theory? C’mon!
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Yes and not even the most likely one!
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I stayed up till 1:30 AM just to watch this program…and I must say I am pleased, especially about the judge’s statement that ID is not science. If it’s not science, do not place it in a science class.
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Fluorine
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Oh what noodly appendages we weave when first we practice to believe.
Ramen
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I saw the entire thing. Makes me feel all warm inside when you see nutters like Bonsel and Buckingham be really, really sour when they’ve been caught out. Buckinghams response said it all: we got obliterated, so the judge is an arse. I also laughed with glee when I heard him say with exasperation ‘How can these people call themselves christians and then go on to teach evolution?!’. Oh the nano-mindedness of these christians. They should all become organ donors. That’s generally a good thing but they should be donors especially. If you don’t use your brain, then why not give it to someone else?
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@DutchPastaGuy,
But, friend, there has to be a brain there in the first place. Doesn’t there? Of course, I’ll grant that there is – at least probably – a lump of gray matter somewhere in the bone casing. But, in what state, or condition? Why would you want to give an atrophied chunk of dead tissue to anyone? Better it should stay where it is, I think. “Let the dead bury the dead”, says a passage from Scripture.
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Yar, me hearties! His Great Noodliness works in wondrous ways. I love NOVA. I hope they keep doing what they’re doing. This was such an amazing piece.
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I loved the part where they used the one guys own definition of science against him: if ID is science, so is astrology, ether theory, and a bunch of other discarded theories.
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@Old Grouch
“But, friend, there has to be a brain there in the first place. Doesn’t there? Of course, I’ll grant that there is – at least probably – a lump of gray matter somewhere in the bone casing. But, in what state, or condition?”
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Brand new, never been used!
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I loved the site!
Hven’t seen the show yet. I will tomorrow at work when there is nothing to do.
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The Evolutionists kicked ass!
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@DutchPastaGuy – I too laughed with glee at Buckingham… he bristles at the thought that he descended from primates…I don’t think he descended at all… :P
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Wow.that’s like forgetting to mention Spaghetti in a debate about pasta.
What a load of cultural midgets.
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PLATINUM! no one called it so i get it. how dare they not mention us
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I’ll make sure to watch it, sounds interesting. The FSM should have been mentioned, although I’m not surprised they didn’t.
RAmen
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We are awesomes! AWESOMES!
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I liked the CNN report, though.
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Did you guys get to see Fox News and their “Virgin Mary and baby Jesus in a Pancake” report? It was newsbreak!
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The Dover school board’s rapid evolution from creationists to “cdesign proponentsists.” to “design proponents” is classic! Yet they repeatedly deny that evolutionary transitional forms exist. :p)))
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http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/transcripts/3416_id_10.html
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“NICK MATZKE: So the correct term for this transitional form is “cdesign proponentsists.” And everyone now refers to this as the missing link between creationism and intelligent design. You’ve got the direct physical evidence there of a transitional fossil.”
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hehehehehehehe…..
RAmen
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RAmen indeed. Morning Nikkiee :) How did the exams go?
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When people say there is no evidence of evolution, show them a fossil. If they contintue saying there is no proof of evolution wing the fossil at them. Maybe it hitting them in the head will drive home the point…
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Hi DPG
OK :)
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@Niteshade
“Maybe it hitting them in the head will drive home the point…”
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Ok :) But how do you get them to bend over first?
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For a real bunch of . . . well, I guess I should be nice about it . . . so, I’ll just use that word, “fundies”, that seems to be the “one size fits all” hereabouts . . . anyway, browsing around the Internet the other day, I ran across OBJECTIVE Ministries.org. – Where I was informed that all dinosaurs were vegetarians; and that those like tyranosaurus rex used those terrible teeth to crack coconuts. (And I thought LandoverBaptist was whacko!) Anyway, I just throw that in, since Niteshade mentioned fossils. These guys – at OBJECTIVE, etc., – have an answer for everything, fossils included. Or, to ask another question: Even if you managed to drive the point home, how would you penetrate the solid bone between the ears?
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@Old Grouch
“I ran across OBJECTIVE Ministries.org”
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Lucky you (:))
There’s a good article about a dino hunting expedition at Objective Ministries.
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http://objectiveministries.org/creation/dinoexpedition.html
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Oh and did you sign their prayer book while you were over there?
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@Nikkiee
“There’s a good article about a dino hunting expedition at Objective Ministries.”
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Oh my FSM! And claiming to have found them too, to refute the claims by those evil evolutionists that there is no such thing a creation science. I’m sure we’re all convinced no, right people. Right?! Uhmmmm, people? HELLOOOH?
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When scientists fill a “gap” is between fossils A and B, with transitional form C, creationists/IDers then claim there are now two gaps, between A and C, and C and D! So, as science progresses, evolution will produce more and more “gaps.”
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Great film. Nova always makes very good shows. I love to watch them. But I am still waiting for a FSM episode of Nova though.
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“John loves Mary” sounds like it might be a subtle clue to john the babtist and Mary (the gal who gave birth to jesus). Sort of like in The DaVinci code.
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I agree that nova is very good at whatever it does
Yet i was watching that very documentary and wondered where the FSM was
I do not understand intelligent designists the pastafarian creation makes much more sense
FSM bless you all
R’amen
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Wow, I had Tivo’d it and I just finished watching it (at 2:18am, gulp!)
But I can’t go to bed, I’m all pumped up. I feel like I just watched a Superbowl where my team completely annihilated the opponent. And then the joy to watch their sour faces.
This NOVA episode is going to stay on my Tivo for a long time.
My favorite part is the argument against the “irreducible complexity”. At first I had no idea how they would answer to that. And quite frankly I always thought that was the ONE good argument on the ID side. I’m glad I watched this NOVA, now I have the tools to repeal the “irreducible complexity” argument the next time a crazy creationist throw it at me.
Bravo NOVA. The finest of television that is.
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Perhaps FSM wasn’t mentioned because we are too small to be considered a “real” religion, yet not culty enough (like hiding in caves–see previous thread) to warrant their attention. So, we either need to get more members or we need to lock ourselves up somewhere and threaten explosives. I’d rather go the more members route–it seems less likely anybody would go prison or die over that. But hey whatever works…
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@Wench Nikkiee
I had a look at the dino link.
http://objectiveministries.org/creation/dinosaurs.html
Fucking hilarious!
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“Dinosaurs are large, reptilian land animals that lived in great abundance over 4000 years ago (”There were giants in the earth in those days” [Gen 6:4]), and were mostly wiped out during the Flood. Contrary to the depictions of them from Hollywood, dinosaurs were herbivorous (”he eateth grass as an ox.” [Job 40:15]) and lived concurrently and in peace with man.”
Funny that’s not what palaeontologist think! What could the explination be!
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“They did not live 65 million years ago, as evolutionists claim, since nothing but God existed then.”
Oh I see. So the scientists are wrong, and all the evidence you need is “becase the bible says so” what a brilient argument.
Completely flawless in is simplicity!
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This is a good one “Pre-Noachian man tried to tame the dinosaur, wishing to use its might for evilness and arrogantly thinking himself as mighty as the Lord.” So that’s why god took them away from us! So simple.
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“Dinosaurs have been a favorite propaganda tool for evolutionists since the 19th century, and continue to be used to promote the pseudoscientific religion of Evolutionism in the Secular media.”
See and all this time I thought that the idea of dinosaurs living 65 million years ago was pre Darwin. Those crafty evolutionists are travelling back in time to mess with history!
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“The appeal of dinosaurs to kids is of particular interest to Evolutionists since it allows them to gain easy and willing access the minds of our children”
We are so bad! Check out the pic of the dude petting a T-rex, classic!
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The documentary was cool. I liked how all the under handed tactics and lying were being done by the Christians. What a bunch of cunts!
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Arrrgh!
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*moving in desperation across the office*
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*stops suddenly*
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Ohhhh so they are hidden somewhere….now I get it…Jurassic Park is fucking true! I knew it!!!!!!!!!
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Ok, so the flood was not to wipe out evil from earth, rather to destroy the dinosaurs because they were mean…
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I am confused *confused*
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Anyone ever think that the story of the flood might have been from a valley that got flooded?
If the only people around to write the story were from that valley, it’d appear to them that the entire world had flooded. It’d also be easier to build a big boat for two of every animal in a valley and your immediate family than two of every species in the world?
Probably just breeding stock for the farm while I’m at it.
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@Pluto–I love the “Objective” people’s idea that evolutionists are using dinosaurs to brainwash little kids. I’d say they got a head-start on us. Just look at “The Flintstones.” (BTW, I too love the guy petting the T-Rex. Just like a sweet little puppy dog. And notice the lack of sharp teeth. Another evolutionish plot, no doubt.)
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@storm petrel–good point. If your “world” consists of one valley, and you never leave it, then it would be easy to believe “the world” was flooded. It reminds me of the line from “Dogma” where Alan Rickman is talking to Bethany about saving the world: “Noah was drunk and look what he accomplished. I’m just asking you to go to New Jersey.” (paraphrased) Hmm…if Noah was a drunk, I wonder if he might’ve become a Pastafarian. ;-)
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@storm petrel- Archaeologists think it was the formation of the black sea. There is evidence that there use to be woods in the bottom it suggesting it was once a valley below sea level and that over thousands of years the sea eroded its way to the valley, thus the black sea became as it is to day. Of course this must be wrong as the earth isn’t that old, only 6000 year at most, I bet the hidden valley of the dinosaurs is at the bottom some ware!
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In a divine air pocket no doubt.
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@storm petrel–well, the air pocket would explain why we don’t see them. I’m in Romania, which borders the Black Sea, and with the exception of a few hard-core, old-line communists, no dinosaurs. Maybe that’s what’s wrong with the Loch Ness monster–no air bubble. Either that, or it just likes fucking with people.
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DUH! I may learn how to operate one of these machines some day, after all. Where do things go when one hits one of those extra keys that clutter up the computer keyboard, and the screen winds up blank white?
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Well, that aside. Over on another line, I found this guy, or gal, “Rylore”. He, or she, makes “OBJECTIVE Ministries” look about half-way literate and intelligent. (Well, maybe not “half-way”, but some fraction by comparison, anyway.)
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@rmw – I do enjoy your reference to “old-line communists”. Out here in the Rocky Mountain West, we have a whole lot of “old-line funnymentalcases” – or “fundies” if you prefer – who give good parallel evidence of the “evolution” of the “dogmatist” among humans. Might this be a potential study? Something along the lines of, “The Equal Congruity and Efficacy of Using Das Kapital and the Bible in Creating Living Fossils Today”, perhaps? A Doctoral Dissertation for . . .AAARRRRAAG! I’ll leave that to you young students. I’ve read, and graded, enough, and too much already!
The “flood” myth is something of a universal in the Collective Unconscious. It is even found among the Austrailian Aboriginies. And our own Native Americans who have the story of the emergence into “new” world(s), through the sipapu, after a form of underwater “limbo”, also illustrate the wide-spread remembrance of a form of natural disaster that seriously affected human kind.
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With today’s knowledge of continental drift, tectonic plates, etc., etc., one might even suggest that human kind has been around a good deal longer than many might think. Which might make Alley Oop a bit more of a possibility than some would concede. (Though I doubt he, or anyone else in Moo, would be making a pet of Tyranosaurus Rex, even a baby one.)
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One might even want to make Shakespeare a kind of Honorary Pastafarian. After all, he did write: “There are more things twixt heaven and earth than all philosophy has ever dreamed of, O Horatio!”
Learning can be fun after all!
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@Old Grouch–would the Rocky Mountain West be Colorado perhaps? And maybe Colorado Springs to be more specific? If so, I know all about the “fundementalcases”–I was born and raised in Colorado Springs, so I’m quite familiar with James Dobson and his ilk. I must admit, I thoroughly enjoyed the scandal with Ted Haggard and the gigilo in Denver.
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And you know, I do see this grasping at totalitarianism with both fundies and “former” communists. This desire to bend others to their will, and control them.
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Whatever happened to the law suit regarding the snake bite?
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@PacificPam–it’s still probably in court. I’d be interested in seeing how it ends–does the hospital settle (since that’s the easiest thing to do), fight it, does the family drop the case…?
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great show, enjoyed it very much. Isn’t about time someone sent us a hatemail soon?Are we being forgotten? the whole fundie thing would be much less fun if they started to accept us, which in fact would render them non-fundies, or am I mistaken?
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