Leslie Scrivener has written an excellent article, In praise of an alternate creation theory, in the Toronto Star.
From the department of one scientific theory is as good as another, comes the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
The theory goes like this: the Earth and all living things were created by a Supreme Being, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, and though there are no witnesses to creation, there are written accounts of it.
In time, men and women heard of the spaghetti monster and came to worship him. And as the word spread, a gospel was written and churches were established in his name.
And artists, inspired by his word, drew his image – a tangled mass of pasta, with two generous meatballs, and googly eyes protruding from stalks.
Since the Flying Spaghetti Monster was revealed in 2005, millions have seen his image or read about him and his teachings, on the Internet site www.venganza.org and also in a book published last year, The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
…
Read the article HERE.
Obviously a Pastafarian. RAmen to free publicity!^_^
Wonderful. Sure they spelled midgit incorrectly, but who cares. Hooray to the spreading of the word of our creator.
May His Noodleyness always bless the Toronto Star with His Noodley Appendage.
RAmen
“Mostly, FSM seems to have the greatest impact among anti-creationist activists, who need the chance to blow off steam, says Branch. “Keeping track of creationist activity and combating it is a tiring and often thankless chore and enjoying light hearted fun at the opposition’s expense is probably healthy.”
.
RAmen
More RAmen to free publicity! I bow down ^(^^)^ —-> v(^^)v X Groovey Sideways Eight!
wow! netsymbol animation!^_^
I must say, I love this country
RAmen
“wow! netsymbol animation!^_^”
Say wha?
Always great to sea we have allies in the war on kreationism.
Sometimes they seem few and far between.
RAmen!
Yes, now Pastafarianism has spread to the press!
@Leslie Scrivener
I feel that the FSM may be saving you a special spot, by the beer vocanoe with all the classiest strippers.
RAmen
RAmen to Wench Nikky!! Those Canadians have got more of a noodly clue than we Americans do. Maybe I’ll move there! (I definitely will in 2008 if another Republican takes charge of this wounded country!!)
WOW, your minions are spreading the gospel over the intertubes and ether now!
This article makes an excellent point about an ostensibly “scientific” organization getting their panties in a wad over a perceived religious offense. I think they really do believe no one can guess that their motivations are religious, not scientific, or else they wouldn’t put such a moronic statement on their own site. This reminds me of a conversation I had a couple of years ago with someone advocating IDiocy. They kept insisting that religion had nothing to do with it, but were strangely agitated by my suggestion that perhaps space aliens were responsible for life on Earth, and not a divine, omniscient, omnipotent yet curiously undetectable diety named God. Not surprisingly, they couldn’t tell me why aliens couldn’t be the culprits, and were really pissed that I brought it up. Of course, now we all know that the FSM is responsible!
RAmen
@ Wench Beth
.
Welcome aboard! And always remember, when the fundies attack you and your fellow Pastafarians with vacuous vitriol and vicious vulgarity, smite them with the Sacred Sword of Sarcasm.
RAmen
MJK
@MJK…
“…vacuous vitriol and vicious vulgarity, smite them with the Sacred Sword of Sarcasm”
.
Alliteration much?
@ Jingles
Just a wee bit.
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@ Nikki
Got your message. Gremlins in the system…bugga.
Been too busy lately to keep up with the McIntosh saga. But I know you lurve that stuff. Too much does my head in. Life calls, gots to go. Catch you later.
RAmen
MJK
I love it!!!!
I generally find the best way to expose these Clowns like Bush & Pat Robertson & these fundamentalist Moroons is to just let them open their stoopid yaps.
I never really paid any attention to this Religious Baloney growing up - everybody in our small Southwestern Ontario town seemed to be doing it. Even well-respected members of the community. The teachers, the lawyers, the fireman, the cops, the shopkeepers, just one big, happy Town buying into this crap.
I can see this happening back in Medieval Times or somewhere over in Taliban Land but in America & Canada is beyond belief. We’re talkin’ FUBAR!!
;)))
Atanyrate thanks for the brilliant article Leslie Scrivener & thanks Bobby Henderson fer yer Joyous Creation!
Cheers!! Billy ;))
YAY!
.
I’m hoping this will inspire new members, spread the anti-creationist word and produce new hate mail. If we keep this up, we’ll be an officially recognised religion soon!
If you guys at FSM really believe this crap, you’re as crazy as the Christians.
And if you don’t, you’re just being insincere and mocking religion without being brave enough to admit it.
This whole site is ridiculous.
@Mike
Please read the open letter. There is a link on the home page here at venganza. And we have already stated that we are opposing religion, so please do a little more research before you post again.
@BillyWarhol
“these fundamentalist moroons…”
Wait, THAT’S IT! MAROON THE FUNDAMENTALISTS!
Finally, someone solved what we should do with them, and in a very piratical way too!
Have a volcano…
RAmen
Gnocci Man:
I have read that. What about it? “I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster.”
I guess you guys ARE as crazy as the Christians, is that what you’re trying to say?
Gnocci Man:
Again, if you are OPPOSING religion, why are you doing it by creating a new religion? And if you don’t believe it, why do you pretend that you do?
Be honest and use honest arguments. And most of all, don’t pretend to be hurt when Christians accuse you of mocking them. That is exactly what you do, so why go through this whole charade of saying you’re not?
Mike:
When you are in a war, do you use your fists when others use guns? Christians believe what they write. While it is possible that some Pastafarians believe in FSM, the best way to satirize a tradition is to use the words of the tradition and make those words your own. I look at all religions as being inherently dishonest. If FSM wants to emulate and satirize religions, then it must be just as false and dishonest as it simulates the realities of religions.
If you look at FSM as a religion and do not possess the analytical abilities to see the satire, then you should just stop asking questions. If a satirist states that he doesn’t believe what he says, then the satire is ruined. The impact of the movement comes from the idea that FSM is just as plausible as any other religion.
Ultimately, FSM is a bit of fun. I think you are taking FSM way too seriously. At the same time, the premise of FSM reflects a deeper dissatisfaction with the belief structures that other people hold. If FSM makes you think about the inconsistencies in mainstream religion, then the job has been done. But, if you are caught up in the flaws of FSM versus the flaws in other religions, then you are totally missing the point, IMO.
@Mike
We are a satire religion. Our arguments include: ID uses almost any lack of scientific proof to try and support itself, when it is in fact religious gobbledigook without a whit of actual supporting evidence. Science=science (good), religion=religion (bad), religion+science=more religion (more bad).
I personally try to refrain from too much rudeness as I believe that it puts us on the same level as them, but considering that we are replying to things that they sent to us, self-defense is a valid argument. Most of us are not hurt by the hate-mails, we just pretend to be because it is so funny.
And how funny would this be if we constantly say that we don’t believe in it?
“@ID: Your arguments are just religious dogma! The FSM, who I don’t actually believe in but use because he reflects my values, spurns you with a lack of volcanic beer! Fie and Forsooth, fair demagogue, yet nie recall thine eternal entropy!”
I think you understand.
RAmen
oh and by the way, I personally don’t try to oppose religion, but I do have a problem with it being pushed into schools, politics, my life and public money being spent on it. If their lies can get away with it I want mine to.
It depends on the purpose. If the purpose is to have fun and make fun of Christians, this site is great. If the purpose is to actually try and bring about change, this site is worthless. You don’t change anyone’s mind by ridiculing and mocking them. All you do is being self-congratulatory.
As I understand this site, the purpose is mostly the former (fine), but with many items here (such as the letter to the Kansas Board of Education) it seems to be the latter, which makes no sense at all. There were only 2 possible outcomes of that letter: either 1) they got the joke and got pissed off and tossed the letter in the mailbox, or 2) they didn’t get the joke and decided to incorporate yet another made-up belief into their “science” teachings. Either way, science and common sense loses.
Good satire makes a person who holds the satirized belief question himself, and makes a point that is not mockery and ridicule, but that is a step towards what the writer would actually want to happen. The classic “A Modest Proposal” by Jonathan Swift is of course the greatest example of this, and I don’t expect that level from anyone else. But the Church of FSM isn’t satire, as I think the creators of it believe it is, but simply poorly executed attempt at humor, at the expense of the people it’s supposedly trying to convince to change.
Anyway, have fun, but don’t delude yourself into thinking that you’ll change anyone else’s mind, except those who already agreed with you guys in the first place.
@ Mike
You should read some more of the threads, if fairness, most of this site is just a laugh, which we all do need from time to time, but many of the regular posters also leave links to slightly more serious debates, those are the ones to try and change someone’s mind at.
Trying to cjange the minds of the mental fundies who come here is generally pointless, they usually just send a hatemail reminding us of our upcoming trip to Norway, etc., etc., and don’t stick around to read the replies. The odd time one does stick around, assuming they’re reasonable and not just ignorant assholes, there’s always at least one person who tries to introduce them to atheism.
It’s supposed to do both, to be fun and to produce change.
.
“makes a point that is not mockery and ridicule” Obviously you don’t have the same definition of satire that I do. This whole thing is aimed at the people aren’t really fanatical either way. I hope that by amusing the masses with this silly religion we can draw attention to the real problem at hand. We never had any hope of persuading the IDiots.
@Mike
actually, we have indirectly changed many peoples minds. one look at the hate-mail section is often enough to warn people about what can happen if you become a close-minded fundamentalist. We may oppose religion, but we largely don’t care about it as long as it isn’t being forced on others. We might have suggested eating children if that position wasn’t filled with pasta, but I doubt it. Different situations require different sarcasms. Our point is that our theory is just as valid as any other religious attempt at science, and we have been gaining the wholehearted support of students around the globe. ID only has the support of those who already agreed with it, yet they are attempting to force it on everyone.
Mike, look at where they wan’t to teach it… isn’t that worth taking action on? We have a right to know the truth, and the truth has facts to support it…
To Mike… please chill out and have a laugh with this, or else the bouncers might turn you away at the stripper factory. And you really wouldn’t want that.
To everyone else… I LOVE YOU GUYS!!! YOU ARE TRULY BLESSED BY FSM!!!
Mike, do you really think that a website about spaghetti can change the minds of millions of religious zealots? That is a pretty tall order. We can, however, have fun and hone our skills against these IDiots.
.
By the way, we have a member who calls himself The Laughing Man that has a lot of the same ideas that you do. And, he is lonely. You two should meet.
Oh, also, Mike, don’t forget to tell all of your evangelical friends that you came here and kicked ass.
@Wench Beth
Awwwwww… thanks.
You are blessed too; may your pasta be tasty for eternity, and your sauce be warm, but not too hot, and always have the correct spices within!
RAmen
@Wench Beth
sic ‘im!
http://img395.imageshack.us/img395/3536/01080cp5.jpg
@Re-Oared Marc
There is no need to use hate-mail tactics, we pastafarians are above that. He says “as crazy as the Christians,” so it seems unlikely that he is an evangelist. Use the time to hone your debating skills, as you stated in the first post. He may not be an IDiot, but we should use any opportunity we get. We won’t win against the fundamentalists by swearing at them.
Hmm… If some people are IDiots, does that make us FSMart?
I remember years ago, those dark pagan years, seeing some film footage of women harvesting spaghetti from spaghetti trees in Italy. Some people thought it was some kind of hoax but upon reflection I now see it in a new light, it was the Garden of Eatin’.
OK guys, I’ll have to just try and not take the site so seriously. I’m most certainly no evangelical. :)
I think it’s actually my firm belief that there is no god that makes it hard for me to use the FSM as a joke, since it’s stated mission is the belief in something that (to me) is as ridiculous as the belief in God. Yeah, I’m a HOOT at parties. :D
Tom Mac Millan,
Garden of Eatin’.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
I have seen that piece many times the BBC roll it out occasionally along with a small elephant shitting on a studio floor.
Television is funny-old-medium.
Anyway, you’re right that footage is our ‘Da Vinci Code’ - secret evidence hushed up by the establishment….
Mike,
This site is one of the few places that you can kick off your shoes of reason and work on a level playing field with those Intelligent Design nut jobs.
You too can make outrageus and poorly substantiated claims so long as they aren’t any more ridiculous than something on some other religious web-site which really very fucking hard I can tell you. Boy. Look at some of the sites like AiG! Cooeee total and utter nut job fruitloops with a lemony twist on top!
The only rule is believe in the power of the noodly appendage!
RAmen
To Sizik… that is brilliant! We are FSMart! However, does it sound too much like WalMart? I don’t know. Maybe an FSMart sells spaghetti, beer, and Bobby’s merchandise… that’s all right, then.
I saw the tin of noodles and i saw the light and i opened it i put it on the the side everyone left it alone the next morning i looked at it and suddenly i got babtised by the holy noodles and balls the tin cut me and i saw the noodleyness on the floor and bowed to it so i turned into pasterferian it was the proudest moment of my life.I will in endeavour to convey his noodley appendages into my students lives.i am a new pasterferian i am not too sure about his ancient religen since 2005 I respect you nodleyness.
It’s time we heard from that much maligned segment of various wards, the conspiracy theorists. Have you ever noticed how much a fig leaf looks like a bay leaf?
Hello Tom Mac Millan,
The spagetti harvest BBC clip is viewable in RealPlayer at the April fools website:
www.museumofhoaxes.com/aprilfool.php
This is a piece of film every Pastafarian should have seen at least a dozen times in his/her life. Go check it out. Would the reporter have been an early convert to our Great Faith?
Ramen
We also had a similar one in Australia one year, many years ago. A grape grower draped spaghetti threaded with black cotton all over his grape vines. A local news crew, who filmed it, was shown this display of the damage to crops by the destructive spaghetti worm. This news travelled around the country on April Fools Day. Many believed spaghetti actually grew on vines.
I’ve also heard an unsubstantiated rumour , that this poor spaghetti farmer was even offered donations to help him recover from crop losses.
But nothing beats the April Fools day gag, perpetuated a couple of thousand years ago, where people appear to have been convinced of a crucified dead man coming back to life 3 days after he died. That’s got to be held as the classic.
Wench Nikky Jan 8th, 2007 at 6:26 pm
We also had a similar one in Australia one year, many years ago. A grape grower draped spaghetti threaded with black cotton all over his grape vines. A local news crew, who filmed it, was shown this display of the damage to crops by the destructive spaghetti worm. This news travelled around the country on April Fools Day. Many believed spaghetti actually grew on vines.
I’ve also heard an unsubstantiated rumour , that this poor spaghetti farmer was even offered donations to help him recover from crop losses.
.
This same thing happened to my family one year! 1987, we lost your entire harvest.
To the Spaghetti worm!
Glad I know now, that the FSM got loaded off our wine.
Ramen
“But nothing beats the April Fools day gag, perpetuated a couple of thousand years ago, where people appear to have been convinced of a crucified dead man coming back to life 3 days after he died. That’s got to be held as the classic.” That is, without a doubt, the best smashing of CHristianity i have EVER heard.
CLAP! —–> (>”
Whoa. My post went KABOOM!
@Teh Pirate Fish- hehehe
What a great site . I have argued against the half-truths , mis-truths and outright lies of the Fundies for 25 years . Thank you Prophet Bobby . We have all been blessed by His Noodly Appendage . RAmen
Welcome, Terrible tim.
May you be forever touched.
Ramen
Mike,
It’s a Pastafarian thang. You wouldn’t understand…….Seriously, if you are an athiest then you are likely an intelligent, rational person. Yes, worship of spaghetti is absurd, which is the whole point. Like a good joke, if you have to explain it….
Sauce be with you
RAmen
Tom: good one the garden of eating. I remember seeing that clip once though i failed to see it’s signifigance till now. Thank you.
DutchPastaGuy Thanks for the link, I can now refresh my memory of it.
Oh nice one about the spaghetti tree - I hadn’t twigged on that one either!
*APPLAUDS WENCH NIKKY* for the April Fool Easter statement - superb!
terrible tim Jan 8th, 2007 at 9:12 pm
“What a great site . I have argued against the half-truths , mis-truths and outright lies of the Fundies for 25 years . Thank you Prophet Bobby . We have all been blessed by His Noodly Appendage . RAmen”
.
Hi terrible tim and welcome. I’m am glad you have found a place for some salvation, as most here have, from the never ending proclaimations of xtians reguarding the existence and authority of their imaginary friend (s).
I personaly find visiting the CoFSM between battles incredibly re-newing.
You sound like a true Pirate who has been long blessed by the FSM. You are in good company here.
RAmen
@Booty
Thanks Booty :)
@Wench Nikky Jan 8th, 2007 at 6:30 pm
Even in the most widely circulated account of the spoof resurrection the ’stand-in’ was such a poor likeness to the dead guy that hardly anyone recognised who he was supposed to be AND people are still being taken in!
I can’t believe people are suckered by those celebrity look-alike ‘candid camera’ gags and the look-alike, well, doesn’t.
@ mike
You do realize that your faith that there is no God is akin to the faith that there is a God. I tend to act as if there is no God, but I readily admit that I do not know. God cannot be proven or disproven because it is based on faith. And, I am fairly comfortable with the gray versus the black and white of there is or isn’t a God.
I can’t stop you from believing what you believe. all I can do it bring alternative viewpoints to your attention. If I use sarcasm, then realize that I make fun of myself using sarcasm. My sense of humor runs to the dry and sarcastic work play. and, I find that people who are fairly intelligent often use the same tactics.
I want to thank everyone for a truly entertaining site. I learned about FSM from the Toronto Star article and haven’t stopped laughing since. This is just what is needed in this time of religious hypocricy. I am now truly a believer. Thanks.
Welcome new noodle,
Please do stick around!
And my you be forever touched.
Ramen
Peter,
Please point out that you mean touched by his noodly appendage.
If, of course, that is what you meant….
yeah
i like cars
i live in antarctica and my favorite food is pizza.i stopped eating spaghetti as soon as i heard of fsm. I wanted to stop that blasphemous practice. yeah hahaha
i would like to converse with my fellow pastafarians.i will be on this time thursday
I was okay with touched….
new noodle Jan 9th, 2007 at 12:39 pm
I was okay with touched….
‘
hahaha, Most are.
Ramen
complete idiot Jan 9th, 2007 at 12:31 pm
i would like to converse with my fellow pastafarians.i will be on this time thursday
.
Will we talk about cars?
Hey, Complete Idiot has insight at least, hence the name - this is a good start!
Way WAY back up the thread….so glad Wench Beth has found herself and thrown her lot in with us motley crew :)
Booty Jan 9th, 2007 at 1:02 pm
Hey, Complete Idiot has insight at least, hence the name - this is a good start!
.
hahaha, Agreed!
Booty Jan 9th, 2007 at 1:17 pm
Way WAY back up the thread….so glad Wench Beth has found herself and thrown her lot in with us motley crew :)
.
Yeah I hope she sticks around, in another thread, we debated her name a bit.
I like Wench Beth, sounds kind of stately.
Ramen
@new noodle Jan 9th, 2007 at 12:39 pm
Far be it from me to intrude.
I just throught if you were a new recruit it might take you a bit of time to understnad Peter the way the regular pastafarians do.
But hey, consenting adults and all that…touch what you like.
I’d really rather you did pay attention “really rather you didn’t”s 4 & 8 and RAmen.
@Captain Nooulous Jan 9th, 2007 at 12:39 pm
Thank-you for the advice, as a new recruit I may need some help but think I may have pegged Peter from his previous postings. Sounds like a lot of fun to me. Not saying that you aren’t of course….
Sittin’ here thinkin’ about the Garden of Eatin’. Free will can be fun at times but I thought a little structure might provide me with some guidance. I haven’t read the Gospel of the FSM but I was wondering if there was some sort of list , a variable list, nothing written in stone, that a Pastafarian might use. Something like The Ten Condiments. (I’m thinkin’ tomato sauce has to be the first.)
Peter is frankly hilarious.
Particularly it appears on Sunday evenings when he’s been taking ‘communion’ for most of the afternoon.
Ha Ha.
Remember to vote for him in the forth coming elections (if you’re in the US) and as mentioned before if he invites you to the oval office just be aware of what that might REALLY mean.
But hell, go along anyway!
Why of course Tom, we have these…
.
The Eight “I’d Really Rather You Didn’ts”
1. I’d Really Rather You Didn’t Act Like a Sanctimonious Holier-Than-Thou Ass When Describing My Noodly Goodness. If Some People Don’t Believe In Me, That’s Okay. Really, I’m Not That Vain. Besides, This Isn’t About Them So Don’t Change The Subject.
2. I’d Really Rather You Didn’t Use My Existence As A Means To Oppress, Subjugate, Punish, Eviscerate, And/Or, You Know, Be Mean To Others. I Don’t Require Sacrifices, And Purity Is For Drinking Water, Not People.
3. I’d Really Rather You Didn’t Judge People For The Way They Look, Or How They Dress, Or The Way They Talk, Or, Well, Just Play Nice, Okay? Oh, And Get This In Your Thick Heads: Woman = Person. Man = Person. Samey - Samey. One Is Not Better Than The Other, Unless We’re Talking About Fashion And I’m Sorry, But I Gave That To Women And Some Guys Who Know The Difference Between Teal and Fuchsia.
4. I’d Really Rather You Didn’t Indulge In Conduct That Offends Yourself, Or Your Willing, Consenting Partner Of Legal Age AND Mental Maturity. As For Anyone Who Might Object, I Think The Expression Is Go F*** Yourself, Unless They Find That Offensive In Which Case They Can Turn Off the TV For Once And Go For A Walk For A Change.
5. I’d Really Rather You Didn’t Challenge The Bigoted, Misogynist, Hateful Ideas Of Others On An Empty Stomach. Eat, Then Go After The B*******.
6. I’d Really Rather You Didn’t Build Multimillion-Dollar Churches/Temples/Mosques/Shrines To My Noodly Goodness When The Money Could Be Better Spent (Take Your Pick):
1. Ending Poverty
2. Curing Diseases
3. Living In Peace, Loving With Passion, And Lowering The Cost Of Cable
I Might be a Complex-Carbohydrate Omniscient Being, But I Enjoy The Simple Things In Life. I Ought To Know. I AM the Creator.
7. I’d Really Rather You Didn’t Go Around Telling People I Talk To You. You’re Not That Interesting. Get Over Yourself. And I Told You To Love Your Fellow Man, Can’t You Take A Hint?
8. I’d Really Rather You Didn’t Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You If You Are Into, Um, Stuff That Uses A Lot of Leather/Lubricant/Las Vegas. If the Other Person Is Into It, However (Pursuant To #4), Then Have At It, Take Pictures, And For The Love Of Mike, Wear a CONDOM! Honestly, It’s A Piece of Rubber. If I Didn’t Want It To Feel Good When You Did It I Would Have Added Spikes, Or Something.
@ Peter.
Yes, I remember the debating over Elizabeth Swann/Wench Beth’s name - both good choices, but I am most glad that she is comfortable with herself and glad to be here :)
I hope you take number eight to heart when you get together with young new noodle - if you take pictures can we see? ;)
@ Captain wossecalledagain
You are ALL frankly hilarious! I am sure I have scorch marks on my legs from having my laptop on them for so long! (goodness me laptops get hot!)
so. many. posts.
Hi Captian, thanks for the support!
I want you and everybody to know…
That as soon as I’m elected, my first rule of order will be to invite the entire CoFSM.
To the white house, for a complete makeover of the Oral Office.
I want it done up FSM style!
Ramen
Oh cool!
Can I get a lift in Airforce One?
Please?
I am quite handy with a paintbrush - we’ve got some spare white emulsion in the garage - shall I bring it along?
@ Booty
Alas I may be a new noodle but am no longer a young woman, such a shame, the body ages but the mind sometimes forgets it has
@Captain Noodlulous
I am a Canadian eh so can’t vote for Peter in the next election but would help with the campaign, especially if I can partake of “communion” all Sunday afternoon
Seasoned greetings. I just read about the Flying Spaghetti Monster (Cheese be upon Him) in the Toronto Star and visited your site. Please allow me a brief rant. I cannot believe that a nation as accomplished as yours, that was a leader in science and technology, that even put men on the Moon, is so troubled by fringe groups that now seem to control your national agenda. I do not mind freedom of worship but when sickness goes untreated because stem cells are little people, when exponential population growth and consumption is seen as sustainable, and when global war and environmental destruction are to be encouraged to bring about the end of times and Rapture, then their beliefs affect everyone on this planet. I am relieved however to see the many Americans who wrote in support of your site, so perhaps things are not as bad as they would seem on your news networks. I hope things do not get like this here in Canada but we have already had one national party leader who believed men and dinosaurs walked together.
It would be so much better if they did not try to twist science to support their beliefs and then teach these bizarre ideas to children. I do not see how they could grow up to work in a scientific field and pick and choose what to believe from science or faith. I would not want such people to design the airplane I fly in or the nuclear power plant next door. It would be far better for both sides if they simply felt that the strata, the fossils, the isotopes, the mountains and the light from distant stars was created in situ 6000 years ago to perhaps tempt the faithless. They could learn the science properly then go to Church and say “Yes, but ALL that evidence suddenly appeared in 7 daysâ€. No conflict there. No need to try and prove men and dinosaurs walked together until a flood created the canyons, mountains and Chixulub impact crater.
OK, rant over. So Dubya wants to go to the moon and Mars using current state of the art technology. I have good news and bad news. We used Newtonian physics and Greek geometry to measure their distance. We used this knowledge and telescopes to measure the parallax to the near stars. We used this knowledge to measure standard candles like Cepheid variables and went on to look at intrinsic brightness and redshift to measure the size and age of the universe. We found it to be 13 billion years old but we were wrong. Its only 6000 years old.
So, tracing the error back, we find that Mars is about 10 feet across and only 39 miles away from Earth. This is wonderful news! Instead of expensive spacecraft we should be able to reach it by hot air balloon. I picture NASA technicians building something out of Jules Vern, or maybe the third season of Lexx. Great vast balloons suspending a creaking wooden hulled vessel with spinning anemometers and brass valves hissing steam from the coal fired furnace. Ropes and lanyards and the Captain’s wheelhouse. As they cautiously approach Mars our intrepid stratonauts prepare the harpoon for docking.
Now the bad news. A month ago I saw the Moon passing over my backyard towards the West. A couple of weeks ago it was gone! Thinking the worst I pulled out an atlas and did some calculations. You see, the Moon was only about 600 feet from the Earth, and the rocky mountains are much, much higher. I fear it was destroyed on impact.
“Proud to Be a Liberal Secular Humanist Soviet Canuckistani!”
Hey Peter, I’ve an idea. If you stand for Prez, I’ll stand for PM. If we get elected (if, ha, we’ll have FSM on our side!) we can cement the Anglo-American Special Relationship by liberating Belgium - home of Stella Artois and whoever brews Holstein Pils. I think we should leave the Islamic countries alone, not really known for their brewing experience.
.
Just heard that good old Tony Blair has announced that he wasn’t too happy with the way Saddam’s execution went. Hmm only took him a week and a half to make his mind up. Wasn’t it Dylan that sang about “blowing in the wind”?
@Al Dente
Jan 9th, 2007 at 2:46 pm
“Great vast balloons suspending a creaking wooden hulled vessel with spinning anemometers and brass valves hissing steam from the coal fired furnace. Ropes and lanyards and the Captain’s wheelhouse.”
Need a Kaptain mate?
Ahem, If Al Dente needs a Captain, Kaptain, I think he knows where to come.
Aaargh, all welcome, except the orthodox Pastafarians. They wear two eyepatches and can’t see where they’re going!
“Proud to be a LSHSC!”
“They wear two eyepatches and can’t see where they’re going!”
.
hahahaha Priceless!
For all you would be pirates - http://www.piratequiz.com/
I have the awesome name of…
.
Red Roger Rackham
Passion is a big part of your life, which makes sense for a pirate. You have the good fortune of having a good name, since Rackham (pronounced RACKem, not rack-ham) is one of the coolest sounding surnames for a pirate. Arr!
RRR!!!
.
Yarrr! I be triple ARrrrrrr
Dirty Davy Rackham
You’re the pirate everyone else wants to throw in the ocean — not to get rid of you, you understand; just to get rid of the smell. You have the good fortune of having a good name, since Rackham (pronounced RACKem, not rack-ham) is one of the coolest sounding surnames for a pirate. Arr! .
.
Cool! I’ll stick with Peter Popoff though, it just sort of “pops”
Mad Tom Rackham,
My calculated pirate name is ‘Captain Tom Flint’ which as you can see is pretty to close to my real pirate name (Captain Noodulous Silicate).
Good site.
I like my new name!
.
Yarrrrr, sez I!
why are we all called Rackham? Which one of you is my dad?
According to the quiz, my name is “Dread Pirate Bonny”
S\/\/33t!
but should I use it or no?
I don’t know.
.
What does l’tuae mean?
it’s an acronym. Life, The Universe, And Everything is 42
you read hitchhikers?
Thanks for the link Mad Tom. Looks like I’ve been promoted to “Captain John Kidd”. Make that “Captain Mad John Kidd”.
RAmen
CMJK
.
@ L’TUAE 42
I like “Dread Pirate Bonny”
yeah, ages ago. I didn’t see it at fist but I guessed that was what the 42 was about. Shouldn’t the underscore be an equals?
Iron Ethel Kidd (????)
A pirate’s life isn’t easy; it takes a tough person. That’s okay with you, though, since you a tough person. Even though you’re not always the traditional swaggering gallant, your steadiness and planning make you a fine, reliable pirate. Arr!
My name was Captain Tom Flint.
You’ve been given the surname of infamous pirate (I’d never heard of him) Jack Rackham.
I was given the name of the fictional pirate Captain Flint (cf: Treasure Island) also the parrot.
Jack Rackham was AKA Calico Jack which sounds a bit camp but I bet no one said that to him and lived…
ARR ARR Avast ye me hearties.
Captain John Kidd
Even though there’s no legal rank on a pirate ship, everyone recognizes you’re the one in charge. Even though you’re not always the traditional swaggering gallant, your steadiness and planning make you a fine, reliable pirate. Arr!
.
@ gill
Iron Ethel Kidd. Seems we’re cut of similar cloth.
RAmen
CMJK
I also like Dread Pirate Bonny, but I feel kind of bad about switching just a month or two after I finally thought of a good name.I’ll think about it.
@CMJK- congrats on the promotion^_^
I felt a name change was in order, but I really couldn’t stomach the name ‘Ethel’. Think I had a great-grandma named Ethel.
Hahahaha. Bloody Dave Vane! Hahaha
Good link Mad Tom.
bloody dave vane is an amazing name!
.
“Passion is a big part of your life, which makes sense for a pirate.” man this test is insightful!
L’TUAE,
I think you should be… Wenchette L’tuae
Ramen
I keep looking at the recent posts thing and thinking “ohh, lets go and see what red posted!” then I realise I wrote it.
@ Iron gill Kidd
Well done. I like it!
@ L’TUAE
Thanks, couldn’t have done it without a fine crew.
RAmen
CMJK
I keep reading “Iron Grill Kid” like you’d be some BBQ master or something
Red Morty Rackham. Aarrrr! I sort of like Morty.
Please, If anyone is going to change their names can you put your old name in as well, just ’til I get used to it, say a month or so :)
Arr Bloody Dave Vain ask, so ‘e do? (and why does my pirate talk always sound Cornish to me?)
oh nos!
.
Marcs name is like mine!
.
You sound more Devonshire than Cornish, and I’d know! Me being a ‘corn’ and all!
Re-Oared Morty?
Bloody Alchemist Dave as in BAD?
.
This could get ugly. Poor Nikky, she’s gonna freak.
@Iron gill Kidd Jan 9th, 2007 at 4:49 pm
“I felt a name change was in order, but I really couldn’t stomach the name ‘Ethel’. Think I had a great-grandma named Ethel.”
.
Ethel was also a tree growing on Billie the Mountain’s shoulder. I’ll check my name when I get a chance later.
I just tried it again still the same :(
.
“Every pirate lives for something different. For some, it’s the open sea. For others (the masochists), it’s the food. For you, it’s definitely the fighting. You tend to blend into the background occaisionally, but that’s okay, because it’s much easier to sneak up on people and disembowel them that way. Arr!”
.
Me! A good liberal humanitarian. Oh, I admit there’s a few people who’s intestines I wouldn’t mind feeding to the dog, especially if they were alive to see it Mwhaahaaa.
Ooops - time for my meds :)
Sorry about that Red Rodger Beastly Rackham Rich - us emmets get mixed up. I guess it’s as bad as someone calling me a Lancastrian, when Yorkshire born and Yorkshire bred (strong in t’arm and thick in t’ed) I be. Now where’s me wippit?
Is this racing pigeon yours?
.
Captain Mad John Kidd Jan 9th, 2007 at 5:15 pm “Re-Oared Morty?” MONTY YOU TERRIBLE C**T!!!
.
OK, I’ll stop my drunken spamming film references and go to bed now, someone explain what this means to me in the morning.
http://www.wacky-packs.com/crazylabels/spitghetti.jpg
something wrong!
Who me? Nope just had to muck out the pigs, they leave the house in a hell of a mess :)
Just thread surfing Beastly
look at the exclamation mark.
OK what is it Mad John?
It’s cute, I’ll admit that. What with it’s curvy sensuous upper and spherical lower ‘dot’. Even so, I’m now lost :)
They are onto fossils on the BBC now Mad John
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/ni/2007/01/the_thermodynamics_of_andy_mci.html
This is my current favourite:
.
“122.
JK wrote:
“Firstly are you aware of all the other flood “myths” from around the
world that have similar themes to the Biblical Flood? Nice co-incidence
eh?
To say there is no physical evidence is simply un-true. There is lots
of it both geologic and fossil. Far too much, infact, for me to list
here. I’m sure you know where to look to find it documented!
Can you explain to me how there have been fossils found, for example,
of animals giving birth, in the middle of a meal or even in the middle
of a fight?”
.
Due to a flood?
@Alchemist where did you post that link of Adam and Eve with that Pterodactyl or whatever?
hang on for a few mins Nikky, I’ll go hunting
Alchemist Dec 20th, 2006 at 2:48 pm
Oh hell fire, you’re right Beastly Rich and thanks for the link Nikky.
“Pterosaurs, including the ancestors of pterodactyls (middle left) and rhamphorhynchi (middle right), lived peacefully with Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden. (Artistic reconstruction by Peggy Miller.)†http://objectiveministries.org/creation/pterosaurs.html
.
Although I don’t see how the human race reproduced as the Pterosaur seems to have made off with Adams ding-a-ling :)
The thread was
http://www.venganza.org/2006/12/17/excellent-satire-unless.htm
Your pirate name is:
Calico Jenny Bonney
Often indecisive, you can’t even choose a favorite color. You’re apt to follow wherever the wind blows you, just like Calico Jack Rackham, your namesake. You can be a little bit unpredictable, but a pirate’s life is far from full of certainties, so that fits in pretty well. Arr
Got it. Thanks Alchemist :)
Alchemist Jan 9th, 2007 at 6:05 pm
The thread was
http://www.venganza.org/2006/12/17/excellent-satire-unless.htm
.
Am I the only one to notice, that Adam has some breastage going on there?
huuummmmm
Avast me hearties. Glad I swam alongside and threw that pirate name site onto your decks. I’ve laughed heartily (like a real buccaneer should) at all your comments.
Remember, pirates were a passionate lot and didn’t stint their favours towards the wenches. Therefore, are ye surprised that many of us have the same Gt x10- grandfathers’ names.
Now, hundreds of years later the FSM, in his noodly wisdom, brings us altogether as Prophet Bobby’s crew.
His ways are truly wondrous.
RAmen
Hahaha - Peter - I was more interested in trying to see through it’s wing. Did they do Brazilians in those days?
Peter Popoff Jan 9th, 2007 at 6:13 pm
Alchemist Jan 9th, 2007 at 6:05 pm
The thread was
http://www.venganza.org/2006/12/17/excellent-satire-unless.htm
.
Am I the only one to notice, that Adam has some breastage going on there?
huuummmmm
.
Opps wrong link, heres Adams boobies…
http://objectiveministries.org/creation/pterosaurs.html
@ Wench Nikky Jan 9, 2007 at 5:47 pm
OK what is it Mad John?
.
Huh?
.
Thanks for the BBC link. Won’t this wanker ever give up?
.
Calico Jenny Bonney…?
Captain Mad John Kidd Jan 9th, 2007 at 6:23 pm
@ Wench Nikky Jan 9, 2007 at 5:47 pm
“OK what is it Mad John?”
I thought someone else could check it for me. I was a bit flat out. It’s ok I’ve done it now.
“Thanks for the BBC link. Won’t this wanker ever give up?”
No! Round and round the garden!
Calico Jenny Bonney…?
Got a chance to do the quiz. That’s my name.
@ Wenchy
Actually, I was asking how you liked Calico Jenny? Or are we going to see Calico Nikky? Or something?
.
Wish I had more time to read that whole MacIntosh link…bugga.
Okay, I couldn’t resist having a butcher’s at that link. It’s like the bloke has run out of ammunition and is reusing broken arrows. Stop that world, I want off!!! Pathetic. Sadly pathetic.
@Captain Mad John Kidd
“It’s like the bloke has run out of ammunition and is reusing broken arrows.”
Yeah and numerous times over. Great analogy.
He reminds me a really spoilt kid who has been told a definate “NO” and is trying every trick in the book to get around it. :)
RAmen
Wow… I’m Mad TOM Kidd.
.
Oh well. Anyway, there seemed to be a few newer pirates, earlier on, so I’m gonna bring up that old favourite, www.letter2ted.org
.
Tell them to sign.
Mad TOM Kidd…this could get really confusing…Mad Jingles the Aussie…
.
http://www.letter2ted.org/ Please sign the letter to Ted all you fresh fish. In his hour of need he could really use our support. Be the next one on the list! Tell your friends!
RAmen
CMJK
@Captain Mad John Kidd
Jan 9th, 2007 at 7:22 pm
Done!
And kongrats on the promotion!!
Peter Popoff Jan 9th, 2007 at 6:23 pm
Peter Popoff Jan 9th, 2007 at 6:13 pm
Alchemist Jan 9th, 2007 at 6:05 pm
The thread was
http://www.venganza.org/2006/12/17/excellent-satire-unless.htm
.
Am I the only one to notice, that Adam has some breastage going on there?
huuummmmm
.
Opps wrong link, heres Adams boobies… (link was here)
.
I got my first awaiting moderation notice for that post.
I took the link out so this should post Ok.
Funny thing is, I just copied and pasted Alchemist’s link?
The FSM sure does work in strange ways…
try taking the http bit off the link Peter and just copy/paste the rest.
I took the pirate quiz and here’s my results:
.
“Captain Anne Vane
.
Even though there’s no legal rank on a pirate ship, everyone recognizes you’re the one in charge. You tend to blend into the background occasionally, but that’s okay, because it’s much easier to sneak up on people and disembowel them that way. Arr!”
.
Whoa! Not what I would have expected at all! But I guess I’ll start looking to find my own pirate ship now :) I want you ALL to be my crew and you’re ALL going to be co-captains with me!! Oh, and I’ll stay Wench Beth to my friends (you awesome Pastafarians :)
Off the subject slightly, but lots of fun… go to YouTube and do a search for “flying spaghetti monster”. There are some hysterical videos there! Some we’ve seen courtesy of this site, but others are new and a great laugh. (And a couple have simply usurped His Holy Noodliness’ name to get viewers — they ought to walk the plank!!)
Alchemist Jan 9th, 2007 at 6:02 pm
.
I don’t know Nikkiee? Alchemist left the http in his post, and it showed up?
Odd I tells ya!
Mad Tom Cash
Every pirate is a little bit crazy. You, though, are more than just a little bit. You’re
musical, and you’ve got a certain style if not flair. You’ll do just fine. Arr!
I believe I like that one.
Wait is it saying I’m flamboyant?
Captain Mad John Kidd Jan 9th, 2007 at 6:40 pm
@ Wenchy
“Actually, I was asking how you liked Calico Jenny? Or are we going to see Calico Nikky? Or something?”
Don’t think so. In fact I’m going back to my old spelling coz I kinda got attached/used to it.
Also notice that both the terrible twins (who would they be?) always use my old spelling now…..correctly. The misspelling never bothered me anyway.
Thanks Nikky for that link. Turns out i’m family off you Gill: I’m Red Ethel Kidd. We probably got different nicknames to tell us apart.
Hmmm….
Mad Morgan Bonney.
That seems a little harsh - they hardly know me! ;)
Still I am related to a lot of the other wenches, so that has got to be good.
Maybe Mad Morgan Booty….
Whadya think?
@ Booty
Big Booty Bonnie?
;)
Yay Nikkiee’s back! Yay!
I don’t know why I’m up so late, but I am.
Who are these ‘twins’ you speak of? Do I know them?
Where dya get the big from?????
I have a bit of a problem with size having had a breast reduction done 10 years ago, so a bit less of the “big” thank you! ;)
Mad Booty Bonnie?
Mad Bonney Booty?
Do you work Peter? How the hell do you manage with so little sleep and so much beer?
I wish I could do that - no fair!
What time is it over there?
@ Booty
Okay, my bad. I certainly meant no harm. Just “Booty” is great. Whatever you chose.
@DutchPastaGirl Jan 10th, 2007 at 12:30 am
“Thanks Nikky for that link.”
Link??? Not mine.
@Peter Popoff Jan 10th, 2007 at 12:45 am
“Yay Nikkiee’s back! Yay!”
Thanks Peter. Only for a few minutes mind. I’m trying to read all this OZ Govt. Biotech research guidelines!! It’s BORING! Then, there is the problem of having to get on the net to retrieve some info….and well you just have to call in, don’t you. I’m thinking I’m going to have to go completely cold turkey to get this stuff read. At present I’m trying to ease out of my addiction to this site gradually!
Whinge over!!
.
“Who are these ‘twins’ you speak of? Do I know them?”
Appologies, I meant “lovers” ;)
Oh Mad John - just teasing you! I am quite used to all the comments - if anything went missing my friends would say it was lost down my cleavage - when it got as far as Notre Dame being down there I knew it was time for action :)
I quite like Mad Bonney Booty, but then I quite like Booty on it’s own - decisions decisions!
Bugger - got to go to work - catch you later :)
Booty is off to play with some Noodles :)
Have fun
Nikky, you’re right . Mad Tom Rackham posted that link (piratequiz). I wasn’t really awake I guess.
People, I could use a bit of help please (sorry to go on about that BBC blog again).
On
www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/ni/2007/01/the_thermodynamics_of_andy_mci.html
there is a creationsist ‘pb’ who keeps saying ‘if evolution is true then why are there no fossils of half-evolved feathers?’. So someone posted links to articles that show there are. He refuses to accept that, saying that nothing provided to him shows such fossils, only theory.
I (Peter Klaver on BBC blog = me, DutchPastaGuy) have downloaded one of the articles and read it, pointed out to pb on what page and in what figure to look. He still says he has not been presented with anything. So I have just reposted the info on where to get the article and put up a challenge: can others download it? If some of you could go the url above (may take some time to load) and look for the latest post by Peter Klaver. It may not yet be up, is has to go through a moderator first. But it should appear shortly after post 178. See if you can follow those steps and download the pdf. And post back your findings. No need to read the whole thing, just let the blog know if you could get to it. If so, that would be enough to show creationist pb to be consistently dishonest.
Thanks for your time on this one, it would be good if there was wide response, so any responses from this crows are much welcomed. It should take ~5 minutes of your time if you try.
And Nikky, I see some overlap in language between posts here and Pastafarian #5 over there. That’s you?
greets,
Peter
“But some satires, including the spaghetti monster, are so frivolous they will neither open people’s minds nor influence them, except in an oblique way, Branch says”
well that is so rude.
I find nothing frivolous about his mighty noodle.
Hmmm..my post to the BBC blog has gone down a digital blsck hole apparently. Hang on for a bit, working on it, I’ll get back to you.
Wench Nikkiee Jan 10th, 2007 at 12:28 am
.
“…In fact I’m going back to my old spelling coz I kinda got attached/used to it.”
.
AAaarghhh. You be screwing with Bloody Dave’s poor brain, Nikky, Nikkiee. Wheeee, “they’re coming to take me away, ha, ha. They’re coming to take me away, ha,ha. Yes please, Mister Hatstand, an extra helping of plumb duff for me. Wibble, wibble.
.
Terrible twins indeed (huff). Been called worse - me and a mate at uni were called the gruesome twosome by a lecturer.
mine went the same way.
Peter, You have way too much patience with that guy. I still find it incredible to read that kind of nonsense.
May The Flying Spaghetti Monster bless Leslie. I’m glad somebody is spreading the word, instead of sending hate-mail. Thank Noodles!
@DutchPastaGirl
I know, but more and more bloggers are starting to call him a dishonest liar. Challenging the bloggers to see if they can get to the literature can only work out ok I think. If other creationists can, pb looks very incencere or incredibly dumb. If no other creationists can figure it out, but evolutionists can, all creationists look dumb. Not that they sound very bright now though, I do agree with you on that.
This doesn’t have anything to do with the discussion at hand; I just wanted to let people know that there are Flying Spaghetti Monster silicone bracelets for sale on eBay! Spread the word!
Ok, so completely off topic, but:
http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Pirate
Go there.
@ihatemyspace
That’s an interesting website, looks like wikipedia really caught on with people, I think I’ve seen 3 different versions, and there’s probably even more.
DutchPastaGirl– I still don’t get the ‘Ethel’ part, though. Was there a famous pirate named Ethel? And if so why didn’t she change her name???
@DutchPastaGuy Jan 10th, 2007 at 5:15 am
I’m not sure how many identities (genders:) I have over there anymore DuchPastaGuy, but I ain’t giving no secrets away. Yet! I’m finished with the dickhead anyway. He just wants to make out there is a big debate on. I think I’ve pointed out that tactic on a couple of the BBC forums there. I consider PB a pile of ashes now! Did I tell you I have a deep fondness for Molecular Biology and Botany as well as being a dedicated Pastafarian? He’ll only keeps repeating BS questions. That’s why I (er I mean Tom…I think) keeps posting the AiG mission statement quote as a reminder to readers that the whole YEC vs Evolution “debate” is a dishonestly conceived ploy.
@Alchemist Jan 10th, 2007 at 9:13 am
“Nikky, Nikkiee. Wheeee, “they’re coming to take me away, ha, ha. They’re coming to take me away, ha,ha. Yes please, Mister Hatstand, an extra helping of plumb duff for me. Wibble, wibble.’
.
Could I, perhaps, offer you a little Lithium Alchemist? I’ve heard it’s a little more calming than herbal tea?
depends on the herbs. ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
Lithium? No thanks, you see “I’m so happy cause today, Ive found my friends …
They’re in my head”
See what it did to Kurt Cobain?
Herbal tea does sound nice though. Indica or Sativa?
Arrgg!!! I do think this name is more fitting, being piratical and all. I noticed you guys were talking bout Adam and Eve up there. I give the word of god, direct from his mouth:
*
“It says Adam and STEVE. That’s what you get for reading the translation.”- God
Steven Colbert is on a kick for a new word for 2007, “factiness”. Here are some facts from The Center for Inquiry, www.cfidc.org, (DECLARATION IN DEFENSE OF SCIENCE AND SECULARISM):
A recent poll by the Pew Research Center revealed that 64% of Americans are open to the idea of teaching intelligent design or creationism in public schools.
Some 42% totally reject evolution or believe that present forms of life existed since the beginning of time.
38% would teach only creationism instead of evolutionary theory.
Only 26% agree with the predominant scientific view that life evolved by processes of natural selection without the need for divine intervention.
The percentage of individuals who accept the theory of evolution is lower in the United States than in any other developed country, with the exception of Turkey.
Clearly these people are in need of some grated parmesan.
@Tom Mac Millan: those are the saddest statistics I’ve heard today.
Polls, are all rigged anyway.
Ramen
Dread Wench L’TUAE Jan 10th, 2007 at 6:09 pm
Arrgg!!! I do think this name is more fitting, being piratical and all. I noticed you guys were talking bout Adam and Eve up there. I give the word of god, direct from his mouth:
.
I like it L’tuae!
I still think of you as a wenchette, (because of your age) but you do have the intellect of a full blown Wench, so I guess your new name will work!
Ramen
@Tom Mac Millan
It’ll may take a little while. Rome wasn’t built in a day! :)
Iron gill Kidd
Jan 10th, 2007 at 4:11 pm
DutchPastaGirl– I still don’t get the ‘Ethel’ part, though. Was there a famous pirate named Ethel? And if so why didn’t she change her name???
I can’t find anyone. I did find that in the film shakespeare in love shakespeare was struggling with a play he wanted to call Romeo and Ethel the pirates daughter. So i’m guessing that’s where it came from.
@Wench Nikky, you wrote
“I’m not sure how many identities (genders:) I have over there anymore DuchPastaGuy, but I ain’t giving no secrets away. Yet! I’m finished with the dickhead anyway. He just wants to make out there is a big debate on. I think I’ve pointed out that tactic on a couple of the BBC forums there. I consider PB a pile of ashes now!”
Quite right, pb is hopeless as it gets, but what better way to show that than by making his co-creationists publicly abandon him. Your last visit and reply to the McIntosh thread (check post #209) could help in that. Others too, if they like.
www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/ni/2007/01/the_thermodynamics_of_andy_mci.html
Beg, beg……….
Why do no creationists understand the 2nd Law? well, noone really understands it perfectly,and if they can’t grasp evolution I suppose there isn’t much hope in them understanding how to define a system, but it’s still depressing
@Tom Mac Millanis, is stupidity really that rife in America and turkey?
<