While one may correctly say that evolution is a fraud, that is not to say that that same person “believes in†Creation as it is literally set forth in Genesis.
The answer is: We don’t know where we came from. Let’s find out.
Evolution is as much, if not more, of an irrational religion than what any Creationist spouts.
Sean O’leary
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An elaborate spoof on Intelligent Design, The Gospel of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is neither too elaborate nor too spoofy to succeed in nailing the fallacies of ID. It's even wackier than Jonathan Swift's suggestion that the Irish eat their children as a way to keep them from being a burden, and it may offend just as many people, but Henderson, described elsewhere as a 25-year-old "out-of-work physics major," puts satire to the same serious use that Swift did. Oh, yes, it is very funny. -- Scientific American
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Umm I didn’t apologize for any belief I hold except that the poor doctor was a little twit. Max Gobs was right pointing out that good debate, not name calling is what we want.
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Just wanted to clear up the fact that I did NOT apologize for believing in FSM!! Or argueing with him about science V.S. religion. Just the name calling..
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May you all be blessed with much Pasta!!
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ButtJester
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I’ve seen most of that crap before. It’s the same tired old rhetoric that has been spewed about since before Darwin. Not much of a challenge really. YEC is easier to dismantle than ID. Still haven’t gotten around to the morality argument. I’ll do that after I take a break.
RAmen
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p.s. Appologizing is just what he wants you to do. Don’t second guess yourself. No one passes judgment here except our great prophet bobby himself.
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Mad John Kidd
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Your right, I certainly will not second guess myself, or my beliefs. But I will try to remain civil even if they cannot. I’m just saying that while they rant and rave and tell me to go to hell and call me names, I will do my best to remain level headed and argue the points without resorting to name calling. Let them call me names and “ostracize” me. I will give them noodles in return :)
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Simply ironic how Jesus was supposed to save everyone. Most of his followers wish not to save us, but to kill us and send us straight to hell. Utterly astounding logic. Or lack thereof.
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let’s not get back into the God/Jesus is evil debate. it’s already exhausted itself. if the good doctor is right, if thousands of scientists have been wrong and if the god of the bible truly does exist, then the implications are horrible. it means that countless billions of people have been doomed to eternal torture for not belieiving in something which could never be proven. it means that billions have died simply because god becomes petulant. it means we all exist at the whim of a tyrant who makes the most evil of human beings look positively saintly by comparison.
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and the theists accuse us of having a bleak existence.
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“let’s not get back into the God/Jesus is evil debate.”
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No offence meant here. But I think I’ll go back to lurking for a while. I wasn’t going to start a debate. And it’s getting a little old being told.
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“don’t be a prick”.
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“don’t second guess yourself”
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“don’t start debate X again”.
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Sheesh whatever.
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All I can say is, kinda sounds familar. I know I’m not intending to single out any 1 person. Merely tired of feeling like I’m bouncing of one wall only to hit another.
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See you guys.
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Pasta to all!!
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sorry. you can tell some of us are getting jaded when we feel like every debate has already happened – though with 99% of the hate mailers here, there’s really no debate at all.
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what the hell, tell the world how evil the bible is if you want to. scream from the rooftops what a collection of utter monstrosities and perversions that book truly is. you have my utmost support.
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It’s ok, I’m sorry too. I am a bit stressed lately.
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I really didn’t mean to take it out on you, or anyone else here.
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And I can certainly see how anyone could get tired of the same debates over and over. But I suspect that nearly all possible debates over this subject have played out many many times. And we are just rehashing them over and over.
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Anyway I’ll let you guys have at it. I’ll watch for a bit from the sideline. Maybe at some point I’ll join in again. But I think for now maybe a break is in order.
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May you all be blessed with much Pasta!!
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So, what are the odds that Martin will actually come back? I hope he does; it’s rare that we find an opponent here that can properly string together a sentence.
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Great Acharya S writings :)…..please oh please.
How about some serious scholarship. You realize that no serious Josephan scholar doubts the quote, right?
Wow….so the YECS movement is Asenine…but yet, no reason given….it just is, right? Lets not be open to actually seeing what it has to say.
Tell me, oh well-read one, why we are not. (Because your explanation is not adequate, and its self defeating and false)…Please Doc. You don’t have to prove that we are not the sum of our biology because my explanation is not adequate, self-defeating and false? This is school yard pansy talk! I said we are the sum of our chemistry and biology( we are what we are because of our brains…which preceed MIND, can’t have mind without brain…). You said C.S Lewis says we are not, which I think means you say we are not. I said prove it, you said you don’t have to because my argument was somehow invalid. CHICKEN!! BAWK BAWWWK. Give me the one bit of evidence that says we are more than the sum of our parts. I can hold the universe in my mind. I can travel to places I’ve never been, and consider your god is my own. It is called imagination. Imagine that there is no god. Imagine that evolution is real. Can you? You claim debating ideas is your forte. Drop the double-speak and talk about imagination.
This is not hard to refute. Simple.
If my brain is a product of biochemical responses, then I have no reason to trust that they are a product of biochemical responses, and neither would you. Thats the point. Therefore, it is rightly concluded that its false.
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I have no reason to trust my thoughts if they are just random biochemical responses. Erego, don’t trust your thoughts. But we’d have to trust the thought that says not to trust our thoughts. Erego, its true that our thoughts are not biochemical responses because its inadequate to say that we can trust anything if they are biochemical responses, including the idea that they are biochemical resopnses in the first place.
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Are you saying that we can’t trust abstract concepts like thought? If so, we also cannot trust the intangible entity that is God.
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Maybe this quack inherited two allelic copies of the “Belief Gene”, as well as an oversized ego?
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An overinflated ego the size of the Hindenburg. It crashed and burned as well.
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RAmen Mad John. I’m thinking he might be one of BLR’s room mates.
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RAmen Mad John.
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Still haven’t read most of the BS yet. Did he proove that the Flying spaghetti monster is not the son of god or jeezus? I hear there’s a bit of money in doing that.
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The YECs are getting a little desperate, to be coming to Church of Flying Spaghetti Monster Church, trying to sell us their inane crap aren’t they.
RAmen.
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The sad part, I think he’s actually looking for the FSM Discussion Forum. They have full on serious debates and everthing; with language restrictions and troll filters. He would be more at home over there. Then again, maybe not. They talk real science. He seems to be totally addicted to spamming us ignorant heathens.
Have you been there, Nikkiee?
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Oh, excuse me I didn’t mean to insult the heathens. I meant us smug crack-smoking left-wing asscowns who build strawmen.
And no herr doktor didn’t proven much of anything other than
1) he can cut-and-paste
and
2) he’s an arrogant troll
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Michael Martin,
In order to obtain a PhD and earn the title of Dr. you must demonstrate that you can construct a coherent argument. You clearly can’t as you struggle to construct single words. Perhaps you are an MD but I doubt that too. You have made several large and unsubstantiated claims of your prior experience including that you have proved that Darwin stole the idea of evolution by natural selection from Edward Blythe, that you worked in cancer research at the NIH and that you have studied 50 different religions and philosophies. Something must have gone wrong with the biochemical processes in you brain resulting in pseudologia fantastica (pathological lying). Ergo (it is not erego), you should not trust your thoughts and nor should anyone else.
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I agree with the whole premise of the FSM movement, that of rebelling against outdated manuscripts that control are deeply mixed into our society. But aren’t we overstepping our boundaries by questioning theories like creationism. But shouldn’t we want to just have all of the theories out there for individuals to decide upon what is best for them and not go into a mob effect where we ostracize and criticize others with different views and go into what i consider a threatening tone to try to convert others to our own belief system. Follow what you want, and keep that your own buisness, and leave other people ideas to themselves.
In RAmen we trust
ps. If this makes no sense or is just sounds really stupid to other people sorry it is 3:11 am right now
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I have stated this many times before, but for your benefit, I will do so again. Creationism requires supernatural explanations, so you would have to redefine science to include them. Chemistry becomes alchemy, astronomy becomes astrology eg. Therefore, according to the U.S. Federal Court, creationism is not science and teaching it in a science classroom would be illegal. Discussion in a current issues class or the like would be no problem.
RAmen
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Peeden,
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You wrote, “… aren’t we overstepping our boundaries by questioning theories like creationism?”
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Why? What makes creationism, aka religion, so special that it is above criticism and examination?
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OEJ
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-Peeden,of course we are not overstepping our boundaries by questioning theories like creationism,if you never ask questions you never get answers,and you will never learn anything.We would still be way back in the perhistoric times if somebody didn’t say’what will happen if I stick a round rock under my cart?’ or ‘what will happen if I leave Spain and see how far I can get befor I fall off the edge of the world?’ If anybody or any organization tells you that you are overstepping your boundries by questioning them,then their is probably a lot that needs to be questioned there.
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I have just read through some of the poor dokta’s posts on the “evolution is a fraud”
thread. I took particular interest in the presentexd creationist “agument” in terms of the evolutionary, biochemical and molecular biological evidence. If this is indicative of the YECs formal presentation, than they are weaving their own noose. All the post contained was a misrepresentation of current evidence (strawman?) and a theological argument (the “ark”) against this misrepresentation. The YECs are either totally ignorant of current evidence, or knowingly bastardise it to try and argue their case for god. (comes accross to me as the latter!)
Either way it is most dishonest. I get the image of a used car salemen trying to sell a lemon simply by trying to discredit any opposition with absolute slander.
RAmen
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ok this is the “evolution is a fraud” thread. Been out of the loop for a few days!
RAmen.
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Evolution is a religion now? OMFSM! Forget Global Warming, we must discover the truth before we melt!
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Of COURSE evolution is a fraud! The guy who came UP with it said it was wrong!!!
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@ Prosper
umm… what?
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@Prosper
“The guy who came UP with it said it was wrong!!!”
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Please explain Prosper!
Or to echo El Peatieablo’s comment “umm… what?” ?!?!???
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Prosper.
in case you haven’t realised, theory of evolution was created by Charles Darwin. Evolution is also known as Darwinism, he wouldn’t have named it after himself if he knew it was wrong … tosspot.
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Why the heck are you lot arguing? I am the daughter of a Christian and an atheist. As such I was brought up with Christianity but I also knew there were other ideas that I could choose to follow. I have decided to be Christian myself, as many no doubt choose not to.
Please don’t stone me with hateful words, to do so destroys any credibility of your argument :-)
I do not believe in evolution theory (Darwinism) as I suspect it could be “the mirror that has been pulled over the world to deceive us from the truth” and I agree with others who say that neither theory, Creationism or Evolution are definitive facts of the universe, it is probably a bit of a mixture of both somehow, and numerous other theories that haven’t even been imagined yet.
I do not believe in Christianity without questioning it.
The central idea that compels me to believe in Christianity is the simple fact that God is love. Everyone knows that love exists and is true, even though science has difficulty measuring it without describing it in very cold and unromantic terms, or even proving it’s existence :-)
Whatever love is, it is a mystery to both science and faith, yet it endures beyond both, and if that is what God is, I can easily imagine that It exists beyond the parameters of what we can perceive of this world.
Also, much of science derives from Christian scholars, most scientists historically are Christian, so therefore you cannot ridicule Christians, because you would be ridiculing most of the intelligent people who have proved many things we now know as fact.
Personally I cannot believe in the Big Bang theory, because I cannot conceive of there once having been Nothing. The concept of Nothing scares me, and also that when we die we disappear into oblivion scares the shite out of me, so I tend to err towards a vague belief that the universe is cyclical; it has always been and is eternal. It can be explained in religious/scientific terms by “there will always be a spring” meaning that even after everything has died and there seems to be no life and no hope, everything starts again. This is based in faith and is also proved by science, as we all know that after winter there is spring :-)
That is supposing the universe is real. There are many who believe it isn’t, see the film The Matrix for example, which is based on Gnosticism. This is where the idea comes from that what we perceive of the world is not real. In which case all scientific “fact” has been created to deceive you into believing that God doesn’t exist. Or perhaps religion is wrong – which path should we blooming follow? Well Christians believe that it is bad to not believe in God (Who, as I have explained, is love) and to emphasise how bad it is, we imagine the most crap place ever, ie Hell. That is how bad your life is when you do not believe in love!! Would you agree with that?
Also, a belief is merely a theory that hasn’t been proved. No proven fact would exist if no one had theorised about it, which is what people of faith spend much of their time in prayer doing, we are pondering the bigger questions of why we blooming well exist on this planet, and science is one method of trying to make any sense of the world, religion or faith is another, whose to say that one day science will prove the existence of God?
As for the Flying Spaghetti Monster, how funny! I don’t get those Christians who can’t laugh at it, they’re probably the same ones who got offended at Andre Serrano’s “Piss Christ” piece of artwork :-)
Any attempted attack on Christianity only galvanises it. To mock it is to show yourself up for what you truly are, a person full of hate and contempt, something that Christianity has evolved people to live without ;-)
Atheists are always welcome in churches, yet it seems that Christians on here are treated the way they were in the days of the Romans. It doesn’t make Atheists seem like a particularly nice bunch, which isn’t true, cos my Dad is one and he’s great! :-)
Peace
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Grr…site just ate my (longish..) post!! Will try in two parts
@Blackbird
“I do not believe in evolution theory (Darwinism) as I suspect it could be “the mirror that has been pulled over the world to deceive us from the truth”
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Oh dear…
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“Also, much of science derives from Christian scholars, most scientists historically are Christian, so therefore you cannot ridicule Christians, because you would be ridiculing most of the intelligent people who have proved many things we now know as fact.”
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Oh dear…
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“Any attempted attack on Christianity only galvanises it.”
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I think you might find that the first instance of attack has been the constant attack from Cristianity against rational thinking, those who don’t hold the same beliefs and science! (first quote from your post)
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“To mock it is to show yourself up for what you truly are, a person full of hate and contempt, something that Christianity has evolved people to live without ;-)”
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You think? You really believe that?
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K then :) Part two..
@Blackbird
“Also, a belief is merely a theory that hasn’t been proved.”
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Sorry, but your definition of a theory isn’t the same as that pertaining to a scientific theory, which has a very specific meaning.
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“That is supposing the universe is real. There are many who believe it isn’t, see the film The Matrix for example, which is based on Gnosticism.”
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May I suggest you purchase a metal sieve? Mind rays…humanoid lizards you know…can’t be too careful. :)
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“something that Christianity has evolved people to live without ;-)”
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IDist then?
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Welcome Blackbird :))
May you feel the touch of His Noodley Appendage
RAmen
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@Blackbird Sep 14th, 2007 at 3:26 am
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Please continue browsing this site: you definitely need some more (no, a LOT more) insight in the Pastafarian spirit. Mark, it’s not unusual to see newcomers interpret our discussions as hateful bashing of religious people, especially when those post stuff that just ASKS for some flaming…
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Reading Pastafarian posting also can teach someone to write coherent posts: there are some mighty clear thinking (and writing) Wenches and Pirates here. You also might need some time to grasp why we call our highly esteemed lady Pirates “Wenches”.
Good luck and RAmen!
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@ Blackbird
God is love, eh. May i just ask you, of god is supposed to be all powerful, and beyond comprehension, how come we then have some of his pwers?
But if god actually IS love, then that means WE create him, without people, love doesn’t exist.
Christian scholars and scientists. True, they were. but look at some cases, one being Galileo, the man who put forward that the earth was round. This new revelation had this religious man branded a heretic by the church. i can tell christianity loves their scientists alot. Not to mention, THE most intelligent people? that would be Steven Hawkins, an atheist, and one of the men who originated the Big Bang theory.
You said that the big bang theory began with nothing, you poor misguided child. The Big Bang theory started with EVERYTHING, in a singularity, for you that would be a ‘black hole’. Makes much more sense than god pulling matter out of nowhere.
Also, you speak of our perceptions of the universe being wrong, and we are clouded. That right there is a scientological belief, which is the single most dangerous cult on earth.
“a person full of hate and contempt, something that Christianity has evolved people to live without”
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! wait, sorry… no i was right …. HAHAHAHA!
Christians here are not fed to the lions. However, in a figurative sense i suppose so. you see, the thing is, for every argument a xian puts forward, we completely and utterly devour it. It is a one sided battle, but it’s not really our fault that we use logic and xians generally don’t.
May you be touched by His noodly appendage.
RAmen!
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Blackbird – evolution is not there to explain the universe and its creation, it is a theory explaining how the species that are on this planet today have come to be, taking into account all the countless other species who have lived and died in the few hundred million years of this planets life. if you are looking for a creation story, evolution is not it, it is an explanation of the development of living things on planet earth. whether or not you believe a higher power created it is a separate issue. so yes arguing about it is pointless, especially when people decide to totally ignore overwhelming evidence because……. well because it doesn’t fit with their unfounded beliefs. i personally have found a religion which does not fiddle with the facts (or anything else for that matter) and my undying faith and learned scientific knowledge can live peacefully side by side.
also, FSD is not an attack on Christians, it is not a joke, it is a serious religion with just as much evidence for its validity as yours. I have faith in our lord the spaghetti monster, one day maybe you too will be touched by his divine noodly appendage, as i have been.
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Yo,
if “creationism” is true, I have proof Satan wrote the bible.
I’ll explain, there where no humans in the first days of creation, which means no one has seen it, and especially no one capable of writing it down, which means no one knows this happens, the only way it could have appeared in the bible is if god sent it down to the person writing it down
this is remote writing, remote writing is the occult, god doesn’t do “the occult”, satan does
satan sent it down, satan wrote the bible
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@Commodore Angryy
Nice post, but Galileo didn’t propose that the Earth was round; that was already known. He gave evidence to the heliocentric model of the universe, without saying it was just an idea that was wrong (as Copernicus had done).
@Blackbird
Your post was polite enough; I just wish you would think about what you are typing.
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@El Peatieablo Sep 14th, 2007 at 8:46 am: “@Blackbird … I just wish you would think about what you are typing.”
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I lost count of the times I’ve been wanting to shout that at fundies. Sometimes I DID launch that remark, but never saw any reply. Strange…
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@Blackbird, your post reads like a typical ‘How To Place An Argument for Atheism’. You make all these bizarre generalizations like, “you can’t dis xians because then you would be dising the xian scholars who proved things as fact.”
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Puh-leeze! That is like saying that people are not allowed to question politicians because there were good politicians out there who made a difference. Or you can’t question the media because some of the reporters aren’t biased.
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So when the xians who didn’t get eaten by the lions began torching people during the Inquisition, was that one of those big steps towards loving everyone? How about when all of those xians went charging down to the holy land in their crusades and slaughtering the locals? Was that all about the love? Or even in my own country during the forties and fifties when they dragged the aboriginals from their homes and sent them to xian schools for ‘their own good’, and the kindly priests ended up molesting and torturing those poor helpless children, was that all about the love?
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So Blackbird, go ahead and continue making all those generalizations about how your chosen religion has brought love and peace into this world. But not until you go and do a little research into modern day xians and fundies. And find out about how they are advocating the death of doctors and bombing abortion clinics because they find it perfectly acceptable to kill people in their warped and crazy minds. Or how they think that any other person in the world deserves everlasting torture because they happen to have a different religion they believe in.
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The come back and tell us about all this love.
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*sigh* Let’s play “Demolish the Poor Christian’s Illogical Argument”. If you already read Blackbird’s post, you can skip over the quoted parts.
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“Please don’t stone me with hateful words, to do so destroys any credibility of your argument :-)”
–In short: actually it doesn’t. Not that we are stoning you with hateful words anyway, but to state that doing so destroys the credibility of our rebuttal is entirely illogical.
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“I do not believe in [the evolutionary] theory (Darwinism) as I suspect it could be “the mirror that has been pulled over the world to deceive us from the truth” .”
–If this is so, than who put this metaphorical mirror over the world? It couldn’t have been your god, because why would a being of love want to deceive? This means that there must be a being of greater power and will than your “omni-”ful one, which is paradoxal.
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“The central idea that compels me to believe in Christianity is the simple fact that God is love. Everyone knows that love exists and is true, even though science has difficulty measuring it without describing it in very cold and unromantic terms, or even proving it’s existence :-) ”
–Using “unromantic terms” does not lessen the validity of scientific estimations of what love is and why it psychologically exists. Also, by this logic than, since the Flying Spaghetti Monster is pasta, and everyone knows that pasta exists, than the FSM must exist. This argument is illogical, as it requires one to assume “Since a exists, and b=a(supposedly) than b must exist”, without having proof that b=a; not to mention that one cannot have proof that b=a if b’s very existence is in question.
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“Also, much of science derives from Christian scholars, most scientists historically are Christian, so therefore you cannot ridicule Christians, because you would be ridiculing most of the intelligent people who have proved many things we now know as fact.”
–First of all, the only reason that there are so many historic Christian scholars is that for the majority of the last millennium or two, those who weren’t Christians were killed, brutalized, etc. Further, most of said scholars came to very wrong conclusions because they relied on “what god told them” rather than scrutiny and experimentation. Second, now that we aren’t theocracies(i.e. you won’t be killed for being an atheist), most scientists have no faith. It is reported that at least 93% of members of the National Academy of Sciences do not believe in a god.
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“Personally I cannot believe in the Big Bang theory, because I cannot conceive of there [having once] been Nothing.”
–As has been stated, the Big Bang theory never states that there was once nothing, merely everything concentrated into one point.
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“The concept of Nothing scares me, and also that when we die we disappear into oblivion scares the shite out of me, so I tend to err towards a vague belief that the universe is cyclical; it has always been and is eternal.”
–This is a major logical fallacy: believing something because the alternative scares you. I would prefer a universe in which I had a rather large was of money in my right pocket right now, but that doesn’t mean that that reality exists. Preference has no effect on reality. Also, the word you are thinking of is “cyclic’, as in continuing in a cycle. Cyclical means happening periodically.
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“In which case all scientific “fact” has been created to deceive you into believing that God doesn’t exist.”
–In which case, who put this deception out there? Again, it would have to be a being more powerful than your god in order to go against the wishes of his love.
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“Well Christians believe that it is bad to not believe in God… and to [emphasize] how bad it is, we imagine the most crap place ever, ie Hell. That is how bad your life is when you do not believe in [god]!! Would you agree with that?”
–I would not. I have already covered the whole god=love thing earlier, so I’ll ignore that part. And I do not believe in love as a magical thing. It appears to me in scientific and “unromantic” terms. My life is not as bad as the supposed Christian Hell because of it; if that is what you are trying to say.
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“Also, a belief is merely a theory that hasn’t been [proven].”
–No it isn’t. Faith/belief is defined as being sure that something that can never be proven is correct. A hypothesis is what you’re thinking of, and it doesn’t require religion to form one. A belief can never become a proven theory.
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“No proven fact would exist if no one had [hypothesized] about it, which is what people of faith spend much of their time in prayer doing, we are pondering the bigger questions of why we blooming well exist on this planet,”
–You’re confusing prayer with meditation. Prayer, is “an effort to communicate with God, or to some deity or deities, or another form of spiritual entity, or otherwise, either to offer praise, to make a request, or simply to express one’s thoughts and emotions.” Prayer is an attempt at communication, not contemplation.
“and science is one method of trying to make any sense of the world, religion or faith is another, [who's] to say that one day science will prove the existence of God?”
–If by “God”, you are referring to the biblical account of the Christian god, he cannot exist for he is self contradictory. If by “God” you mean an arbitrary powerful creator, it won’t happen without pretty big proof. That is, rainbows and faces on toast aren’t going to do it, it will require something like the being himself coming down and saying, to reliable witnesses, “Hey, I exist”. I would like to say that, as of this moment, I am enjoying a nice bowl of beef ramen for those of you who care.
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“As for the Flying Spaghetti Monster, how funny! Any attempted attack on Christianity only [galvanizes] it. To mock it is to show yourself up for what you truly are, a person full of hate and contempt, something that Christianity has evolved people to live without ;-)”
–An attack on Christianity doesn’t galvanize it, no more than mockery of Xenu galvanizes Scientology. If we were to accept that logic, than every time atheists were insulted, it would make the existence of a god less and less likely. For mocking the FSM, are you a person full of hate and contempt? That last phrase, by the way, is the most incorrect assertion you have made thus far. Christians have more than their fair share of hate, just refer to Iron Bess’s post for some examples.
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“Atheists are always welcome in churches, yet it seems that Christians on here are treated the way they were in the days of the Romans. It doesn’t make Atheists seem like a particularly nice bunch, which isn’t true, cos my Dad is one and he’s great! :-)”
When I came out of the disbelief closet, I was not at all accepted in church. I was scorned and regarded as a “lost soul”. Not that I wanted to go to church anyway, but there were always those events that were hosted at churches, or school ceremonies with hints of Christianity in them. As for your comment on Christians, I would not say that having your incorrect arguments pointed out to you is quite as bad as being tortured. Atheists are far more accepting of religious people than they are of us.
And I’m glad you get to see things from both points of view, though I would ask your dad to teach you about logic If I were you
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“Peace”
And also with you.
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R’Amen to that dantes_torment.
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@Blackbird…too bad your father didn’t do a better job trying to counter act the indoctrination that your mother obviously did. Maybe you wouldn’t be so afraid of nothing these days.
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@dantes_torment
“Let’s play “Demolish the Poor Christian’s Illogical Argument”.”
That’s such a fun game, I just wish there were more challenging levels.
Anyway, your post was awesome.
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@El Peatieablo
Yeah, that’s too bad. I keep trying to move up from Beginner to Intermediate, but apparently that level doesn’t exist yet.
The praise is much appreciated.
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@ all those who @blackbirded.
I would not call blackbird a fundie by the post. A little off kilter because of a dysfuntional childhood maybe, but that is almost the kind of xian I could handle. Never tried to convert anyone, made only a few glaring oversimplification, and did not deny that pastafarians might be right….Don’t be so harsh you attract more bees with honey. Just my two penny’s
-have a nice day.
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Blackbird said:
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I agree. Some posts edge towards flaming and that doesn’t help.
We need to explain in measured tones why what she believes is childish nonsense that she should throw off without another thought.
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She then goes on to the ‘God exists because God is Love’ argument.
I’m a bit busy today, but I have to say that is one of the most feeble arguments ever presented.
Forgetting the fact that re-defining God as being something that does exist (though not in a physical sense I note) somehow makes him exist is silly and foolish.
Did love create the world? Does love send people to hell and burn them for eternity?
What can you possibly mean by an abstract concept creating the physical world?
Surely people fall in love with people they aren’t married to. Why does love forbid adultery and yet encourage it?
etc. so on and so forth.
As with many theist arguments the challenge is to find the few threads of cloth in order to circumscribe the hole!
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There is more plausible evidence of evolution than there is of creation.
Besides; Darwin was a religious person. He didn’t publish his work for several years, for fear of being alienated from his fellow Christians.
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But he changed his mind.
Christians say what they believe is amazing.
I wish they could experience things even more amazing with added excitment of being based on facts!
Its not your made up mumbojumbo guys. This is the real truth!
WOW!
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