I wouldn’t want to be you when you stand before God.
If you are right, and evolution is the only answer, then we will all just be dirt-food when we die. But if you are wrong, and the intelligent design people are right and there is a God, then you’ll be in a tough spot.
By the way, did you ever read what the Kansas School Board had proposed? It doesn’t sound like it from your letter.
California Boy
How are you to know how your god achieved his creation? Were you there? Maybe, but do you remember? No, I really doubt it. You have what the Bible tells you, a “Cliff-Notes” version for the Israelites of the time, because quite frankly, the explanation of Creation would be like explaining nuclear fission to a 5 year-old. It would be beyond their grasp by a long-shot–they were lucky to worship their God more than 50% of the time.
Read the Bible and make up your own mind, rather than what’s force-fed you by your know-it-all pastor. The beauty of Pastafarianism is that we are all free to seek his Noodly Appendage and learn of his vast creation. May you feel the touch of his Noodly Appendage. RAmen.
Whoever said that anyone thinks that evolution is the only answer? I don’t think anyone’s saying that. I believe that Evolution is a scientific theory, and that right now it’s the best explanation for the numbers and varieties of life here on Earth. I also believe that Intelligent Design, although it might be a “theory”, it should not be taught as science in schools. If it is to be taught, then why not teach alternate theories, such as FSM? Personally, I like the theory of Intelligent Design, but I don’t believe it is science. It’s religion. Period.
Let Evolution be taught in the home and your own version of Creation (whatever it may be) be taught at home…where parents are parents, of all the strange things.
“Since life and death are each other’s companions, why worry about them? All beings are one.” (Chuang-Tzu)
Evolution is just our current scientific state of understanding of how we came to be. Nobody ever said that we would never come up with new theories or ever said that this is our only option.
We all have our belief’s and I don’t see why a god if there is one, would send someone to hell for not believing that god snapped his fingers and created everything. I find it completely illogical to think that a “merciful God” would send someone to hell for not believing in him.
I will stand before FSM and praise his big balls.
As a devout Christian that believes not only that God does exist, but that He is the Creator of all things, I would like to leave my 4 cents (many of my fellow Bible thumpers would call this my testimony, and just as many would call it Blasphemy):
Cent number one: I believe that God works thru natural laws. I believe that God is bound by the same laws of physics, science, biolgy, etc.. that we are when interacting with this creation. But keep in mind that God is much much more intelligent than us, and many of His doings appear like miracles to us as the science underlying the act would be incomprehensible to us. Hence God’s use of symbolism when explaining the creation in the Bible.
Cent number two: Science is another religion. All attempts decypher the natural laws of the universe are merely another way of understanding God. Einstien said thet he would think If I were God, how would I do it, to help him come up with his theories.
Cent number three: Evolution is the most accurate scientific theory to date to explain how we came to be. It needs to be taught in schools. Creation does not deny God exists. I believe that God established a set of rules/laws in the beginning that would allow our universe to exist the way it is, and would allow intellegint life to come to pass. I believe after establishing these laws, He set the big bang in motion.
Cent number four: Intelligent Design is not really a valid testable scientific theory. I believe it is an amazing philosphy. I believe that it needs to be taught. But not in science class. Teach it in a high school philosphy or religion class. Don’t teach it to my kids in School, as I will teach them about God at home. I need the school system teach my kids about math, english, geograhpy, history, science, etc.
Now some extremely long time period later, we exist. Our existence is a testimony of His existance. Our attempts to decypher the laws He established do not constitute blasphemy, denial of His existance, etc… I believe our attempts to decypher the rules of the universe and our existance thru science allow us to better understand His methods, His reasons, and His magnificance.
You can’t be Christian. You didn’t tell us to go to Hell, or use swears, and you’re far too reasonable, I mean, aren’t you going to tell us you pray down fire and earthquakes? Are you sure you’re not really a “Pastafarian?”
(Thank you for showing us that there are Christians that do know how to use the God given gray matter in their skulls!)
May He Touch you with His Noodly Appendage! Go in Peace! RAmen.
“Science and Religion are but two bridges to one path, it’s depressing that they can not cooperate”
My own personal belief is that the Earth itself is devine. What surrounds us is devine. Yin and Yang keep it in the balance that the Earth needs to support life.
Anyways that is just a little too deep for replying on a hate mail letter.
But, basically just to repeat what Daniel said, thanks for being a respectful logical thinking human being.
I am currently contemplating on things which are very toubling to me,
I wonder how you view your life in light of the fact that only too soon your life will cease as well as mine, and at that appointed time both our lives will have amounted to absolute nothingness. Contemplating the complete worthlessness of both our lives i struggle to find reason to take in that next breath, for you and me are but a squelch of static about to be tuned out. Our lives both lead up to the our deaths and no more will our influence be felt or or achievments mater. And as the sun about which our planet orbits goes nova all of life on earth will have been reduced to mere nothingness. Complete waste of time is what are lives our. Absolute horror is what it is. Unless of course you have encountered the simple undeniable message of Salvation in Christ Jesus. then every breath matters. And a great deal of people including yourself may shoot me down and mock, scoff, persecute me. Incessantly prodding me to prove my faith’s validity and existence. But my God speaks for himself, but he has said that those with ears may hear and those with eyes may see but their hearts will be cold and hard as stone and your understanding may never grasp the gravity of our situation on this forsaken ball. I break into tears as i consider our fates a waste of life and breath we are for what starts, ends, Unless you know the One who started it…
This sounds a bit like Pascal’s Wager.
But what if every single religion on this earth is incorrect, and the TRUE god happens to be one who punishes people based on whether their favourite number is divisible by 22.564?
thorkia, wow, good post. You sound more like some sort of semi-agnostic (or is generally religious a religion?).
In the past, I believed Baphomet kept the world in its state, and the universe was a huge living creature.
Religion is good as long as it encourage you, strengthen your spirit, etc. However- when religion becomes lifestyle it becomes dangerous. First you bow down to a higher power and can no longer live as a free man, you take every word written as law. Then, you try to convert others, but only because it worked for you doesnt mean it works for others. Soon you also think that everyone is going to hell who thinks differently. And, then, the illusions can begin in the worst case. You think everyone is a satanist, it is a worldly conspiracy, and end up converting someone to this evil circle, and so it goes on until we are all zombies.
Sargoth-Kuul claims another victim.
mmmmmmmmmmmmmm… dirtfood
Odin likes spegetthi and vikings made awesome pirates. As a happy viking to a pirate, Hail the gods!
Oh and my Church of the Zombie Christ friends give a shout to the pirates, “Yarrr!”
Well, Jose, you have described your own concerns very clearly, but here is the problem: You must not assume that everyone else shares these same fears. I don’t even feel especially important in life; I could give a rat’s a** about being reduced to “mere nothingness” after death. In fact, it sounds quite peaceful to me. On the other hand, the prospect of “everlasting life” in the hereafter would fill me with absolute dread (if I believed in it). Eternity is one h*ll of a long time you know. Some salvation.
If your beliefs are helpful for you, that’s great. But many people are able to contemplate exactly the same questions that so trouble you, without the need to invoke any kind of supernatural solution to bail themselves out.
These are YOUR fears, and your beliefs help YOU deal with them. And they may very well help other people who think like you do. But not everybody has the same fears as you, and your beliefs would be a solution to a problem that they don’t have in the first place. Once you realize this, you will no longer need to worry about people shooting you down, mocking, scoffing, or persecuting you. Perhaps it will give you some peace.
Oh, and Valhalla has beer too- and ale! The eventual Great Plan is to muster up enough warriors to storm the pearly gates and pillage the golden streets of that christian heaven next door. Any pirate souls are welcome to join our longships to sail the seas of the afterlife on the Great Raid!
I wouldn’t want to be you when you stand before the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
I wouldn’t want you to be me when I stand before the FSM, God, Eris, etc. What would be the fun in that?
I am happy to have found FSM. I live amongst those untouched by the noodle. Let me tell you, it’s not easy. Day in, day out, always with the Jesus. It really blows my abnormally small head up. My understanding is this: He wanted/needed someone to worship him. He created us. He loves us. If we love him we have eternal bliss. If we reject him we have eternal torture. I am leaning toward the flaming torture currently. See, a burn is a painful sensation. But it’s SENSATIONAL! Hanging with my in-laws hearing about God and Muslims and Heaven and all, that’s tough for lunch, let alone time immemorial. Why would you waste all that liquid-gold-God-time making an A-hole like me. Dammit, you knew you were just gonna cook me anyway! WTF? What’s up with God being a he? Why is that so important? I don’t mean to get too very offensive, but does he come equipped with the full package? And what is the point of a deity with the ‘whole enchilada’? Really, I’ve never heard anyone pass that particular volleyball around. Christians get pissed if you suggest that God might be a woman. Why is it so important that he be he? Who is he trolling around for in Heaven’s Margaritaville? Other than me- to cook. Sizzle.
i agree! your FSM will only be a a pile of mince when Christianity is finished with him!!!!!!!!!!!!!
GOD Rules
Ah, so it’s a battle of the Gods, huh? Well, here’s hoping you make out better than Baal did against the Israelites.
.
Seriously, what is your “testimony” based on? Your Pastor’s say-so? yeah. That’ll get you into your Heaven.
Matthys
Sep 20th, 2006 at 12:53 am
i agree! your FSM will only be a a pile of mince when Christianity is finished with him!!!!!!!!!!!!!
GOD Rules
Thats if Islam doesnt get to you first.
Religion is just a way of keeping humanity in awe
by believing in it we are just fooling ourselves
FSM is not an aggresive religion, its just an alternate belief
How many of you ‘Christians’ attack tom cruise? None i bet.
Anyways
Ive felt his noodly appendages more than once, because I AM LORD CROMDAR! RULER OF THE ALTERNATE DIMENSION! AND AVATAR OF THE FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER!
ALL WORSHIP LORD CROMDAR!
I can not believe that the people from the “first nation” believe in stupide ideas like “intelligent design” and “crationism”! In Germany most people think that the USA are the world leading country in relation to natural science … well I think we have to think again!
C
Claudia,
I’m so ashamed. No, really. Our own founding fathers (and mothers) wanted so desperately to protect freedom of religion. How is it free if ID is being taught in our schools? Yet, I see a lot of religious intolerance going on here. Leave it up to any bunch of people to really screw things up. I’m not going to get all political here, but I think that maybe I nee to move to Canada. Eh? I was born in the USA, and I love my country, but I really wonder, as you do, about some of the people in it.
Ezekiel 16, 35 shows us what he really things about people giving themselves in to sexual intercourse.
Peace to the spagetthi monster. I am his faithfull follower until all kreationists are burned by their god´s hellfire.
Adios
“Valkyrie Sep 19th, 2006 at 11:27 pm
Odin likes spegetthi and vikings made awesome pirates. As a happy viking to a pirate, Hail the gods!
Oh and my Church of the Zombie Christ friends give a shout to the pirates, “Yarrr!—
Very interesting parralel here actually.
Vikings and Pirates could be considered one and the same, and Odin’s “Valhalla” is similar to His Heaven except rather than Volcanos of Beer its “Never Ending Mead Horns” and rather than the Striper Factory its ” mead serving wenches and half naked Valkyries”
Very interesting…especially as Vikings were some of the first famous pirates.
Tim the Cabin Boy
Even if evolution is the answer, can’t God still exist? Does it have to be one or the other, you simple-minded buffoon?
Intelligent Design is the answer….and I wouldn’t want to be you when you stand in front of the FSM. May he touch you with his noodly appendage before it’s too late ;).
I wouldn’t want to be you when you stand before the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
If you are right, and creationism is the only answer, then we will all just be dirt-food when we die. But if you are wrong, and the Pastafarian people are right and there is a Flying Spaghetti Monster, then you’ll be in a tough spot.
By the way, did you ever read what the Kansas School Board had proposed? It doesn’t sound like it from your letter.
Dread Pirate Bob
“Argueing over who has the better God is like argueing over who has the best imaginary friend.”
.
Personally, I like to believe that God is really lazy, and instead of mearly creating all things one day (or many as the case may be) he set forth a series of events (known as evolution) and just sat back to see what would happen. Personally I think that would be much more entertaining over eternity then making statues bleed or drink milk every couple of days or so. Thus, because I didn’t wanna get sucked up with all them crazy-like folk who run around thumbing their religios text of choice and telling me how I will goto hell I decided the flying spaghetti monster was right. Also because he is scientifically sound and with my theory I can believe he exists and continue on in the sciences! You rule FSM!
Yaar te ye, Yankee brethren!
FSM-ism has reached the land of the Scots, and it’s tentacles spread through the highland glens.
Just a brief point about church and state - two-thirds of the founding fathers were either first or second generation Scots, and they were quite specific on the matter - absolute separation of the two, so that the mistakes made by the Church in Britain would not be repeated in the new world; so that America would be spared the hundreds of years of religious conflict already endured in Britain. You have had ample warning!
Ah-har!!!!
@California Boy: I wouldn’t want to be you when you stand before the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
If you are right, and intelligent design is the only answer, then we will all be in Heaven when we die (except you, of course). But if you are wrong, and the FSM people are right and there is the Flying Spaghetti Monster, then you’ll be in a tough spot.
Then, I guess, you wished evolution-theory to be true (but don’t worry, it is - and the Flying Spaghetti Monster told me, it agrees on this one ;-)
TheHolg
“Personally, I like to believe that God is really lazy, and instead of mearly creating all things one day (or many as the case may be) he set forth a series of events (known as evolution) and just sat back to see what would happen.”
That’s Deism, the original religion of many of the Founding Fathers, including Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Paine, and George Washington. Basically, its like the earth was created like a giant clock that was started off billions of years ago and is now ticking without any interference. It allows for evolution and intelligent design, and is based fully on reason and rationality, not on some centuries old text. Good stuff.
Thank you for this wonderful website and for this wonderfull religion, and also thank you for finally giving me something i can hit back with that will counter the ignorant statergies of your standard religious nut.
It has been wonderful have something able to have an effect on people when common sence is an alien proposition to them. May the great flying spaghetti monster long reign over all.
“That’s Deism, the original religion of many of the Founding Fathers, including Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Paine, and George Washington. Basically, its like the earth was created like a giant clock that was started off billions of years ago and is now ticking without any interference. It allows for evolution and intelligent design, and is based fully on reason and rationality, not on some centuries old text. Good stuff.”
Yes, deism is a religion. But, to characterize a religion as being “based fully on reason and rationality” is unreasonable. Religion is based on faith. Faith is the antithesis of reason.
It is reasonable to accept that there may be a god or gods since we as humans cannot understand the totality of the universe. But, having faith in something that cannot be tested is a symptom of irrationality. Even in the Bible, no human was around for the creation of Earth. So, the theory that a god created everything is a nice idea, but it cannot be shown to be true without faith and irrationality.
1) It is nice to have someone write that Intelligent Design is the same as religion. I know it is true, but many people are disingenous in their promotion of ID.
2) It is a truly Christian sentiment to wish enternal pain on your fellow human? This letter is a sin. Have you asked your god for forgiveness yet?
3) The Kansas School Board claimed that by adding the ID information they were promoting critical thinking. But, it was the opposite. If you want to promote critical thinking, then you introduce ID and state that there is no scientific proof nor has this theory had an experiement devised to test it. So, ID does not deserve the same weight in science classes as other TESTABLE theories do.
If Kansas had taken this route, then there would not have been the outrage in science community. But, they chose to try to give equal weight to a nonsense theory and one that has been tested repeatedly. This is not what science does. And, it would be a disservice to the Kansas students to perpetrate such a poorly thought out curriculm. It would have reduced the critical thinking skills that it claimed to support.
If you wish to believe in a religion that is cool. But, the US freedom of religion works both ways. I don’t have the right to force my lack of religion down your throat, and you don’t have the right to force your religion down mine. Because the people of the US have a mix of religions, the simplest answer is to keep all religions out of the government. This is not an attack on Christians; it is a way to maintain a measure of unity for the American people no matter our other ideas.
But, it is patently unpatriotic not to question the government at all times. It is unpatriotic to promote one religion over all others by putting “god” onto money or into the Pledge of Allegiance. We have a secular soceity. And, this is what the religious fanatics fear whether they are Islamic terrorists or homegrown Christian terrorists. Religion is all about control. And, religious figures will not give up their power without a fight.
Anywho, have a nice day. :)
Quote:
“If you are right, and evolution is the only answer, then we will all just be dirt-food when we die. But if you are wrong, and the intelligent design people are right and there is a God, then you’ll be in a tough spot.”
If you are right, you go to paradise when your dead.
But if you are wrong, than you have wasted a part of the only live that you had.
And if you’re so bound up in what other people tell you instead of deciding what’s true between yourself and God (or FSM if you so desire), then you’re wrong to. The Bible says “If any of ye lack wisdom, let him ask of God, who giveth to _all_ men liberally and upbraideth (chastiseth) not, and it shall be given him.” (James 1:5 (KJV) emphasis added)
.
Rather than listen to a pastor who’s paid to tell you what to think, read your holy book and make up your mind yourself. How are you better than the suicide bomber who will only listen to their Imam? Islam _means_ peace, not al-Qaeda. The point is, if you don’t make up your own mind, someone will make it up for you and thus control you, and you become a pawn to them. Make up your own mind, that’s why God/FSM gave it to you!
.
_That_ is why ID should not be taught, or it should be taught with Pastafarianism and any other idea. Science and Religion _are_not_ Mutually Exclusive!
.
Vas en paix, may His Noodly Appendage Touch your Mind. RAmen.
Oh, all of you put down your verbal weapons and remind that for minced mead thou art, and unto digested mead shalt thou return. Peace on you all !!!
On one hand, we have Genesis, blah blah, don’t eat the fruit, the most boring read ever.
On the noodle, we have midgits, pirates, and beer for everyone.
Now tell me which out of the three I’m going to believe. Hint: I have an eyepatch.
I have finally found the God that is right for me. I am spiritually reaching out right now to caress his Noodly Appendage.
All these christians touting the old testement. The god of the old testement was vengeful and angry. The god of the new testement was a bit more loving. According to the bible christ came to teach everyone a new way of living and throw out the old rules. The followers of christ became known as christians. Now if you follow christ and his path that is ment to replace the old path I think you see where I am going with this. The old school of thought said the world was created in 7 days. Christ never said that. As a follower of christ should you not follow the teachings of christ and not the older school of thought found in the old testement. Jesus stated in no uncertain terms love thy neighbor as thy self and judge not lest the be judged. So when you say “I wouldn’t want to be you when you stand before God.” You are being judgemental (about something only god can judge) and you are not being loving. Hence you are not following the teaching of christ and are taking unchristian actions. So at the very best you are a crappy christian but mayhap not even christian at all.
I like christ. I do not like christians. They are so unlike christ.
“The most preposterous notion that H. sapiens has ever dreamed up is that the Lord God of Creation, Shaper and Ruler of all the Universes, wants the saccharine adoration of His creatures, can be swayed by their prayers, and becomes petulant if He does not receive this flattery. Yet this absurd fantasy, without a shred of evidence to bolster it, pays all the expenses of the oldest, largest, and least productive industry in all history. ”
-Lazarus Long
After ages of Christian dogmas and fakes, finally some believes that make sense.
PRAISE THE FSM!! His mighty majesty touched me, and i’m feeling enlightened.
I’d hate to be you if the Jew’s or Muslims are right.
Your opinion is already flawed, before you even thought of it, California boy.
For a religious debator to debate, he must have arguements that can’t be used for any religion.
I find it ironic that intelligent design has the word intelligent in it.
It’s wretchedly farfetched the way that people look towards others who base their beliefs off of facts and logic (rather than speculation) as the dumb or crazy ones.
-sever
Money is God.
ZONA. homo sapiens might have just dreamed it up. but okay, why do you care and what is your motive to change what we think. i dont really pray anymore except for forgiveness because it has gotten me nowhere, but in my own opinion, i dont deserve anything from God. in general, im probably what God would consider a bad person. least productive industry in all history? are you speaking of the church cuz back in the day the church was FILTHY RICH.
Stop that. You’re making us Californians look bad.
Uhm… has anyone else ever considered the possibility that God created everything, but that both he and his vessels (Moses, Jesus, Mohommad, etc.) aren’t quite sure how it was done themselves? I mean, what if “God” was sorta like the user of a brand new computer… he learned how to use it, but had no idea how it actually worked? I mean, where in the Bible (or the Qu’ran, etc.) does it say that God knew from the beginning how everything worked?
Maybe he just clicked the “Create Planet” button, then the “Create Life” button the day after (or five days later, whatever). How can anyone be certain that “God” actually knows what’s he’s doing?
Maybe God is just a really good gamer, you know? Maybe He didn’t create the game, but He’s learned how to use it very well. Think of The Sims– who else here loves that game but lacks the ability to create it?
Perhaps the designer of this “game” we call reality is content to sit back, out of the limelight, and provide the occasional patch download or expansion pack. Maybe he (or she) just likes watching how his program will be used.
John
We from Germany can’t understand what you are doing in Kansas - are you really serious about that? Everybody of course is free to believe in whatever he wants, but teaching children stuff like this is dangerous. I’m not talking about the Spaghettimonster or what ever, I’m talking about telling the kids God createt everything and sciense is nothing! That’s so stupid, we can’t even find the right words!
It’s a shame that modern people still do think like that - I’m glad to live in germany, where things like this never could happen!!!
Friedrich Nietzsche: “Gott ist tot” (die fröhliche Wissenschaft) Diesen Satz brauche ich nicht zu übersetzen, denn jemand, der so aufgeklärt ist und sich für Nietzsche interessiert, ist auch so europäisiert, dass er diesen kurzen deutschen Satz verstehen wird!
“I believe that God is bound by the same laws of physics, science, biolgy, etc.. that we are” -Thorkia
Then there is no god, because god, or God, if you wish, is by definition a SUPERnatural being. Get that? It means ‘outside nature.’ And nature is, by definition, all that exists. You can’t have both.
“Don’t teach it to my kids in School, as I will teach them about God at home. I need the school system teach my kids about math, english, geograhpy, history, science, etc. ”
-Thorkia
While you’re at it, teach your kids to capitalize English, not just He and God.
Sorry for the harsh tone, I get so weary of people trying to rationalize their mythology.
This new forum isn’t good. More difficult to use, hard to see the big overview. And this form doesn’t let you format your post into paragraphs. Unless I’m doing something wrong.
Personally, I like to believe that God is really lazy
When i do think of a god (not often, FSM rules =D) i tend to think of a small child, sitting on an anthill, with a magnifying glass in his hand…guess who we are?
Ramen
=D
God might be dead - the FSM is not!
penis.
I am a Roman Catholic, and I personally think things like ID belong in church, not school. Like it has been said before, Science is the “how,” and religion is the “why.” They don’t need to clash with one another at all. Now, if you’ll excuse me, I must partake in his noodly body and blood. When I die, I want a spot reserved for me on the banks of the beer volcano. Go forth and be touched by His Noodly Appandage, RAmen!
I am surprised by your connection between evolution and lack of an afterlife. We strongly believe in an afterlife, hence the beer volcano and the stripper factory but I am digressing. I am sorry to break it to you but if you truly fear “becoming worm foodâ€, you really can not stop decomposition despite your belief system.
May you be blessed by his noodly appendage!
Should I believe in a god ‘cos if I don’t then I’ll be in a “tight spot” when I die? Leave aside what happens to my corporeal remains (which will provide nutrient in the soil, thus - I hope - helping to grow the wheat, which shall then be milled into flour, before becoming pasta), and also which god I should be scared of (a muslim god, a catholic one, a smiting one, a nurturing one, an elephant-headed one ?), and even whether this god would be impressed by someone who gives into threats. The only immortality I aspire to is that conferred by having children and having had an influence (positive, I hope) on others around me.
Why is so much emphasis put on the afterlife? God has been a part of my life for 15 years now (He was always a part of it, I didn’t recognize that until 15 years ago). Since then, life has been good. I have been good, not perfect, but good. Our faith is not just about the afterlife, but life more abundant here and now. I’m sure glad no one ever told me, “worship God…. or else!” I would have NEVER done it for that reason and I don’t blame anyone here for feeling the same way.
Also, God is not a man, but rather masculine. There’s no denying that throughout history (until recently thankfully) women were not really in charge of much. Men were leaders and for the most part they were stronger. God leads us. He is stronger than us. He takes care of us. He loves us. That is why God is a he.
You know, I’m getting pretty sick of these so-called “Creationist Scientists” picking and choosing the bits of science that seem to collaborate their theory, and dismissing all others, for example, the fact that energy cannot be created or destroyed, only changed from one form to another. Some (such as Dr. Gish, head of the creationist science institute (or whatever it’s called, I don’t really care)), misquote or mangle other bits of science to make it seem like it supports their theories (Dr. Gish misquoting the 2nd law of Thermodynamics (he is over eighty though, bless his blasphemous little heart). He quotes it as “All things tend towards entropy.”, when it is in-fact “IN A CLOSED SYSTEM, all things tend toward entropy”. What’s the big deal, you ask? It’s only three words, right? But there is a big difference: In Dr. Gish’s quote, creationism is possible, but in the true law, it is not). As energy cannot be created or destroyed, then ‘God’, in the act of creating the Universe (or Multiverse, as is the theory held be some, which explains Dark Matter), must have either destroyed, or severely diminished itself in the process. But anyway, to come back from my rant to the original point I was trying to make, what’s so strange about the idea of a Flying Spaghetti Monster creating everything? I can see how some people would find it ridiculous to think that an omniscient, omnipotent, and omnipresent being could create everything, whereas the Christian theory of ‘God’ creating everything is perfectly correct, I mean, God is omniscient, omnipotent… and omnipresent…(Uh oh! Major logic flaw alert!!!) Until someone can show me indisputable evidence that God created the Universe and not the FSM, I think I’ll stick with the latter (at least then I can enjoy myself, and eat delicious pasta, of course). Come to think of it, I’ll probably stick with the FSM anyway, and then when I go to hell, I can smack Satan in the face; nick (steal) his pitchfork; and rule hell the way it should be ruled (competently, and with a vast-ranging scheme of public-works (put out that damn fire, for a start, and possibly build several lakeside condos, thereby increasing the economic stability of hell and establishing a tourism trade, bringing more wealth and power to me!!!!). But that will never happen, of course, for the FSM is the one true path to salvation (methinks I have heard that elsewhere…oh well).
All praise Him, and His Noodly Appendages!
RAmen!!!!
I believe in the monkeys. It is so clear they are our cousins, that when I was 7 I thought if Darwin had not figured it out first, I would have.
For how long are we going to be caught in 4,000 year old myths of Sumerian-Egyptian origin? It is just silly.
One more thing: show me an “agnostic American” and I’ll show you a “coward American atheist”… Civilized people of the world are laughing at us.
Long live Darwin!
To Pastor Disaster:
You should try reading some pre-history.
Most societies were not patriarchal, but lead by females. It is not until empires emerge through violence that men become the rulers. This happened recently in the 99K years of homo sapien sapien existence.
You are surrounded by a current world that only seeks and teaches history based on patriarchies.
Women are the creators of human life. WOMAN = CREATION.
God (if she exists) is female.
Too bad I’m an atheist.
I wouldn’t want to be you when you stand before the Flying Spaghetti Monster.
If you are right, and God is the only answer, then you will be saved and we will all burn in hell. But if you are wrong, and the Flying Spaghetti Monster people are right and there isn’t a God, then you’ll be in a tough spot, a verry tough spot indeed.
And on the outskirts of all this, The Church of the Subgenious shall continue to eat popcorn and fart obnoxiously.
-LOVE!
HAha, this is funny People are fighting over their beliefs. They all give their own good views except for some people and the people who think their atheist (they don’t realize that atheism, the belief in not beliving is a paradox in itself, if they would I’m sure it would make their heads implode) For all the different religions fighting you guys have to realize that either there is 1 god… 1 universial god that you all belive in. There are multiple gods that all work togeather. Or look to science to give a theory.
Religion is funny in that all religions say their religion is the correct one. Who’s to say who is right and wrong? You can never know unless you have actually seen this 1 god. Or the multiple gods. (Which with the 1 god, the certian people like Christians, and Mormon, and those other door-to-door-converters, belive in the same god, yet for some reason say that their god is more correct than the other god which just happens to be the EXACT SAME PERSON, except interpreted by some guy)
Which brings me to the cult that lives around me.. They are called the Ramah Cult. 20 somthing years ago, a islamic man named somthing Ramah came to a town which is like 10 miles away from the city of which I live. He claimed to be a Reincarnation of Jesus. And thus converted a bunch of families into beliving him. Thus making it possible to sleep with which ever woman he wanted to, the belivers of this allowed it because they thought that this islamic man who was obviously muslem (even states it at one point in the documents he wrote on his now known as a religion) He now owns part of the town, because family that own certian stores are in his religion and have vowed to allow use of what ever building he wants. You can kind of call it a syndicate. The Rama Syndicate.
Now I used to be a Christian and when I heard of this man I thought. How can people be so stupid to be tricked into one mans scheme to get power? How can people be so ignorant that they can belive in somthing that is so obviously a lie? I pondered that, then realized that the religion that I belived in was nothing better than that. One or more people thinking they can create power by making a book and selling it as the words of the “Ultimate creator”.
I would like to know if anyone would be able to answer this. Or if anyone would like to show their views to me. Email me at Killer008r@hotmail.com or Killer008r@gmail.com
i think all you “super christians” should leave this guy alone. hes entitled to his opinion no matter what you whack jobs say. why dont you stop being christians and start becoming americans, and give the man his 1st amendment. which i think is freedom of speech and if its not then let the man speak his word. if you dont like it dont read it. if you cant handle what he says, dont read it. if your too much of a baby to let someone criticize what you believe in then dont read this and stop whining about it cuz hes just gonna leave more posts and piss you guys off even more. so leave the flying spaghetti monster guy do his work and go back to yours. tornadov15@hotmail.com
I love how the religious types keep changing their explanations after each new SCIENTIFIC discovery!
Only the FSM explains it all.
Popping in regardless of context:
I find it highly amusing that at the top of my browser it says this:
“I wouldn’t want to be you when you stand before God at Church oof the Flying Spaghetti Monster”
XD
In the 13th century scientists were being ex-communicated from the church for saying there could be other planets out in space. It was heresy, because the Earth is special, it is where “God created us”. In the 13th century, ex-communication was a big deal, since everyone was christian. you were basically shunned by society. Anyway, now we know that there are countless planets throughout the universe.
In the 17th century, Galileo said that the Earth revolves around the sun. He was placed under house arrest for the rest of his life by the church (thankfully the church doesn’t have that power today). The accepted view at the time was that all things revolved around the Earth, since “God created us” here on Earth. Today, we know that Galileo was correct, and even the church accepts this. In 1996, the Pope issued an apology and pardon for Galileo. Too bad it was 300+ years too late.
Today, we see a repeating cycle. Evolution is being cast as the spawn of Satan, and yet there are books coming out by christians like this one: “http://www.amazon.com/Language-God-Scientist-Presents- Evidence/dp/0743286391/sr=8-1/qid=1158901596/ref=pd_bbs_1/ 002-3017616-5175261?ie=UTF8&s=books”. It at least shows that some christians are starting to support evolution. The repeating cycle is in the 13th century the issue was “other planets”, which the church eventually came to accept the science. In the 17th century the issue was “the earth revolving around the sun”, and the church eventually came to accept the science. The issue now is evolution. It is only a matter of time before the church accepts the science supporting evolution. FYI, Pope John Paul supported evolution over ID (smart man!).
To speed this process along, I’m handing the above book out to all my christian friends, and even offering to buy another copy of the book to donate to their church’s library. At least then the christians will get their science right.
FSM is like a Chinese Buffet for the mind! I mean, you wouldn’t want to eat it every day, but when you do it’s something you really enjoy!
>>They’ve got the different entrees that are identical except for the sauce. The zealous cursing Christian could be the General Tso’s Chicken. The sincere and polite Christian could be the Honey Chicken. And the guy concerned enough about your immortal soul to chime in but not concerned enough to go beyond a web posting could be the Sesame Chicken.
>>They’ve got the exotic food that you don’t get anywhere else. FSM could be the sushi you don’t eat regularly but it’s fun to look at. The Viking Guy could be the fried chicken that doesn’t really fit in to the whole “Chinese” buffet concept, but it’s there anyway. The arm-chair theologians on both sides could be the food that’s not the main course, but is intrinsic to the whole Chinese Buffet experience (like the pork fried rice).
>>They’ve even got the foods that you simply can’t pass up. The t-shirts and jewelry could be the almond & fortune cookies you have at the end of the meal to finish things off.
What would we call this place? How ’bout the “WHY THE HELL CAN’T THEY UNDERSTAND IT’S A FRIGGN JOKE PAGODA”? After all, you can’t spell ‘pagoda’ without God.
I’m getting hungry, I’m gonna go eat.
Seriously, I am speechless to the ignorant. This God guy/girl whatever is a real reality killer. Who has seen him. People say they talk to him, but ironically this only happens when they are alone. Well I have the answer. For all those that have spoken with god, I hate to disappoint you but it is just the voice in your head.
When the time comes you will feel the wrath of the all powerful Spaghetti Monster and you can confess your “sins” to him. Until then keep your Bible loving shit to yourself and stop trying to tell other people how they have to live and filling their heads with a false sense of hope. Miracles can only exist in the presence of luck!
All hail my fellow pastafarians! I was wondering if anyone could answer this question: Does the beer volcano have subsidaries, such as vodka springs or pina colada geysers? I am hoping the answer is yes, because while i have not yet drunk beer,(underage) it doesn’t smell very nice. All hail the Noodly One! Yarg!
“Religion is funny” -Messiah
Yeah, I’ll go with that! If you don’t think so, you should read “Under The Banner of Heaven” by Jon Krakauer, which details the founding of the Church of Latter Day Saints (Mormons), among other things. Well, it would be funny if it wasn’t so tragic and. . . stupid. Or maybe it was supposed to be a big goof, just got out of hand. . .I mean, magic rocks in a hat? Ph-leez.
I could personally go for a Margarita Spring.
As the world lay into keneticism, His Flying Pasta Divine Self floated invisibly before the world. He passed in and out of normal matter, but with nothing more than ease. He saw the rise and decline of the Pirate, as well as the rise of Christianity. To counter this, he made a prophet his own, named Robert, and set Bobby forth to spread his word. Bobby spoke to the FSM, “My Lord, what is it that these Christians need?” The FSM thought for a moment, then spake, “Bobby, what these Christians need, is exactly what they do not understand. They must be let alone, as to carry out their purpose, which is to be misguided, as an example for Pastifarians everywhere.” Bobby nodded his head in enlightenment, and ate a Communion of Spaghetti and Meatballs. Afterwhich, the Spaghediety Himself disclosed the centuries-long hiding place of the Arc of the 10-I’d-Rather-Wish-You-Didn’ts.
DIRT DOESNT EAT WHAT A NOOB
To the OP - “I wouldn’t want to be you when you stand before God,” begs a number of questions. For example, I always imagined myself reclining on a giant manicotti before Him, rather than standing. Either way, I think you make a very good point. It’s best that I be me, and you be you when the time comes.
You said “If you are right, and evolution is the only answer …”
I suspect that evolution is the only answer to a number of questions - for example, What word is spelled E-V-O-L … oh you get the point. But I’m not sure what question you have in mind, to which it ain’t the answer.
Evolution is just a word used by scientists to describe what we observe about the nature of living things … species change over time (for various reasons) and sometimes they become other species. It’s not the Evolution part that bothers your Intelligent Design gurus …. it’s the “for various reasons.”
When you do finally stand before Him, ask him about the various reasons. I don’t think He will be offended, in fact I think He would be delighted to know that one of His children is capable of thinking for itself. You’ll probably get yourself brownie points.
Btw - if by “dirt-food” you mean that my body will be decomposed and digested by worms, fungi, and soil-dwelling bacteria or other microorganisms, and then recycled into the environment to provide nutrients for say … a giant redwood tree, and thus to all the living creatures which depend on that tree, then I must say cheers for the happy thought. I really can’t imagine a better after-life, short of the beer volcano.
Arrr, may ye be touched by his noodly appendage,
RAmen.
AN OBJECTIVE COMPARISON BETWEEN CHRISTIANITY AND FSM-
I think that the only way to settle these arguments is to objectively compare the two religions. Firstly; Christianity has one God. FSM; also has one deity. The All Powerful Holy Be Thy Name Flying Spaghetti Monster. In this sense both churches are monotheistic. (Well, except in Christianity God has a kid who gets some attention also.) Therefore we have to analyze both claims, in deciding which one of these two deities are authentic, or to put it scientifically “for real”.
The basis touted by the school of ID is that creation itself is so intelligent and intricate that an intelligent being MUST have created it. And therefore this intelligent being MUST have been the God described in the Bible.
FSM has a different reasoning however. IT IS INDISPUTABLE YOU FOOLS! HIS NOODLY POWERS CREATED THIS UNIVERSE! SHIVER IN HIS AWESOME PASTATIOUS PRESENCE!
Christianity is a religion that calls upon mankind to do good deeds. If man does not perform these good deeds he will be roasted alive for eternity. Good deeds include refraining from pre-marital sexual intercourse, masturbation and eating rabbits. (Refer to text in Bible)
FSM does not have a whole bunch of rules that confuse you. One has to only wear pirate regalia and have faith in HIS CARBIC GOODNESS. Which sounds entirely logical and acceptable to me.
In essence the only logical conclusion is that a Flying Spaghetti Monster did indeed create the universe, and if you do not agree with me I will poke you in the eye. Or bite your toe off.
Ramen.
p/s: to the Christians that are taking this forum seriously, thank you. It is highly entertaining, and it feels good to know that there are still a whole bunch of idiots out there to make fun of when I am bored.
This makes sense:
FSM is made from two meatballs and pasta. He is good for you, contains vitamins.
God is everything (according to some) and some say he is a guy with beard. Everything is not good for you. Guys with beard are absolutely not good for you.
The noodlier the better. RAmen.
What problems do all of these people have with the FSM, i mean, think about it whts the difference, the oly real one is that they image of god had a beard, and ours is pasta and meatballs, thats the onli fundamental difference, of all the religons they could have picked on its us, stupid naive christans.
eh hehehehheheheh sorry I was too busy laughing at how much this guy cares about random people hehehehe
Praise noodles! RAmen.
As the poet and philosopher Mark Knopfler said, in his treatise “Industrial Disease”, “Two men say they’re Jesus; one of them must be wrong.” To each his own philosophy and belief, I say.
The esteemed Sister Mary Margaret, God or Whoever rest her soul, was quizzed by her seventh-grade class about the nature of belief, to wit, “What if you die and there’s nothing, no afterlife?”, she replied, “Well, then the joke’s on me, isn’t it?”
The realms of faith and reason may cooexist on this plane, but never (current evidence or lack thereof withstanding) shall the twain meet.
Peace. Shalom. Pax. Paz. May the Word be spread and heard.
You guys are perhaps the most intelligent people I’ve had the pleasure to happen upon on the internet.
I do hope this is taught in schools someday…which is quite plausable.
I see the light and smell the truth…keep the faith!
There seem to be roughly two types of people in the world with two different attitudes toward ambiguity and the unknown. When confronted with great mysteries like 1) where did we come from? 2)what is the “right” way to act/behave? 3) what is the “meaning” of life? there are those who follow pre-established thinking and there are those who create and explore for themselves. Clearly, the creators and explorers are the minority and have been througout history. The questioning minority seem to be a good argument against evolution. Wouldn’t conformance trump questioning individuality? The herd imparts protection and comfort - you get your beliefs and take your marching orders from your parents, friends, your political party, your pastor, or king, and you are much less likely to be ridiculed, become an outcast, or be burned at the stake. What kind of chance of survival does a creature that leaves the herd have versus one that stays within the fold? And yet these black sheep still persist throughout the history of mankind. How is this so? Why doesn’t this penchant for risk-taking and self-elimination wipe out the independent thinkers? How do you become popular and pass along your genetics if you are in jail, stoned to death, or excommunicated? Where is Darwin’s theory now? Obviously, there is a divine hand at work. God, or at least God’s favor exists. Could there be anything but Godly approval of the free-thinker and challenger of the status quo for such rebels to persist? Can it be that those who suffer the distress of distance from the herd move closer to Godliness with every departing step? Could you be closest to God when you ask things most likely to blaspheme and disturb the majority? How do we know the earth is really flat? Why are pigs bad - what makes their meat really unclean - aren’t goats kind of dirty too? If God is good and likes goodness why would God make Ghandi burn in hell and send Pat Robertson to heaven? Why is God afraid of/ashamed of women showing their faces, arms, or other body parts - are women defective - (kind of like unclean pig flesh)? Why should I pay such great attention to a holy book that’s been modified extensively by the hand of man and ignore God’s direct creations - nature, the heavens and earth? What is up with this carbon-dating thing - didn’t mommy and daddy tell me the holy book says the earth is only a few thousand years old? What would Mohammed look like and why would any decent person want to kill someone if they drew a picture of him? Why can only those with a penis become holy leaders - if God is a male, is he gay?
Ask questions like this and you are in deep trouble with society but far closer to whatever truly is Godliness. Religion, our attempt to put the universe into a tin can, has consistently gone stale century upon century. Might as well call whats in the can today “spaghetti.” May the rebel spirit of the FSM protect you all from the “righteous” herd - RAmen
I am a Christian. To reply to people who say that if God was a merciful god he wouldn’t send them to hell just for not beleiving he exists, I say that God is merciful to those who believe in him. For judgement is without mercy. He is a just god.
Before people start to call me a hating Christian I would like to say that I can’t stand it when other Christians ruin it for the rest of us when they judge others and condemn others to eternal damnation. It puts a bad light on a belief that is not about judging others at all. It is completely the opposite. Jesus accepted people inspite of their faults. Most of the people that he hung out with were thieves, adulterers, and tax collectors.
BTW I think FSM is the funniest thing in a long time I frequent venganza.org often.
Is God Really There?
A Look into the Traditional Arguments for God’s Existence
Nicholas E. Craig
There isn’t a Bible verse that explicitly argues for God’s existence. The Bible assumes that God exists. The following arguments, then, are not primarily exegetical, but rather philosophical in nature. However, the Bible is amazingly accurate when it touches historty and the sciences, both natural and behavioral, and that argues strongly for it’s validity and God’s existence.
I will now put forth four of the five traditional arguments for God’s existence. I have omitted the ontological argument. While it has appealed to some of the finest minds in Western history, usually mathematicians like Descartes, Spinoza, and Leibniz, it fails to persuade me. This, however, is probably more indacitive of my simplicity than the potentency of the argument.
· Cosmological argument – Something has existed forever.
Genesis 1:1, “In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.†(KJV)
Millard Erickson wrote, “In the realm of our experience, everything we know is caused by something else. There cannot, however, be an infinite regress of causes, for if that were the case, the whole series of causes would never have begun.†Therefore, there must be a sufficient original cause or an “uncaused cause.†Epicurus showed an understanding of this when he stated, “Something obviously exists now, and something never sprang from nothing.†No matter if you’re a theist, atheist, or agnostic, you must admit that something has always existed. A.J. Hoover wrote, “The choice is simple: one chooses either a self-existent God or a self-existent universe – and the universe is not behaving as if it is self existent. In fact, according to the second law of thermo dynamics, the universe is running down like a clock or, better, cooling off like a giant stove. If the cosmos is running down or cooling off, then it could not have been running and cooling forever. It must have had a beginning.â€
Virtually all scientists believe that the universe began to exist at a finite point in the past. Virtual particle fluctuation has been used to explain the spontaneous appearance of matter; however, those virtual particles still need a place to fluctuate and thus space itself still needs its origin explained. Further, as B. DeYoung has pointed out, virtual particles, if real, form as matter and antimatter in equal amounts. However, our universe appears to consist almost entirely of ordinary matter. Antimatter is distinctly rare.
· Teleological argument – Design declares a Designer.
Psalm 19:1-3, “The heavens declare the glory of God; and the expanse proclaims His handiwork. Day by day they pour forth speech, and night-to-night reveals knowledge. There is no speech, nor are there words where their voice is not heard. (MKJV)
The universe as we know it is extremely complex; it possesses highly organized and integrated order. The teleological argument declares that such magnificent complexity must have been designed. For example, when you see a painting you assume there was a painter, and when you see a building you assume there was a builder. Likewise, when you see the spectacular design of our universe you assume that there is a designer.
Some one once said that the world, with all its complexity, having begun from a chaotic explosion, is like a tornado ripping through a junkyard and assembling a Boeing 747 in mid-flight!
Murray Eden, a statistician at MIT once used high-speed computers to ask a question: Beginning with chaos at any acceptable amount of time up to eight billion years ago, could the present complexity come by chance? The answer was and is absolutely No!
“Could I convince you that I dropped 50 oranges onto the ground and they, by chance, fell into ten rows of five oranges? The odds that ten oranges would fall by accident into a straight line are mind-boggling; let alone ten rows of five.
Maybe you’ve heard William Paley’s famous illustration. It goes something like this: imagine you’re walking along and you find a watch. You pick it up, pry it open and see all the various parts moving around inside. Would you say to yourself, “This watch has been here forever.†Or would you assume that the watch is the result of an explosion? No, you would assume that some watchmaker made it.
In fact, when you think of an explosion, what comes to your mind? – Destruction. The Big Bang Theory assumes that all the order in the universe arrived from an explosion; that’s like some one setting off a bomb in Home Depot and the explosion creating a neighborhood of homes.
God’s creation is incredibly complex, and evidence for its intelligent design is everywhere.
“I could prove God statistically; take the human body alone; the chance that all the functions of the individual would just happen, is a statistical monstrosity.†- George Gallup, statistician
Give your neighbor a high five… when you struck hands, through a complicated process, the neurons in your hand sent a message to your brain, which returned a message to your hand telling it what it felt! All that occurred in the instant you struck hands!
Socrates once argued for the intelligent design of the universe by citing the eye as evidence.
Consider the eye:
1. It has 40 million nerve endings.
2. Its focusing muscles move an estimated 100 thousand times a day.
3. The retina contains 137 million light sensitive cells.
“To suppose that the eye could have been formed by natural selection, seems I freely confess, absurd in the highest degree.†- Charles Darwin
If man cannot make the human eye, how could anyone in his right mind think that eyes formed by mere chance?
Maybe you’re thinking, “Natural selection isn’t really about chance (except for the random mutations of genes), and in his book Origin of Species, Charles Darwin argued and proved that natural selection was quite capable of creating the intensely complex structures of the human body.â€
Okay, let’s assume that natural selection occurs, and I believe it does. (Of course, as a progressive creationist, I believe that natural selection is the means by which God has providentially equipped His original creations or “kinds†to survive and adapt in a fallen world - a world, which is now separated from God because of the original sin of mankind. This separation has been observed and is commonly known as the Second Law of Thermodynamics. The universe is now subject to the uniformity of causes in a closed system. The system is not sealed shut, however. It is open to the hand of God, and thankfully God often reaches into our system. With His perfect will and wisdom, God is providentially guiding our system to His desired end.). However, even if Darwin’s natural selection, as opposed to the progressive creationist interpretation of natural selection mentioned above, were proven to be correct, mankind would still be lacking an ultimate explanation. Oxford philosopher Richard Swinburne observed that the laws of Darwin’s evolution are “consequences of the laws of chemistry governing the organic matter of which animals are made. And the laws of chemistry hold because the fundamental laws of physics hold.†Swinburne then asks, “But why just those fundamental laws of physics rather than any others?†To really see the brilliance behind Swinburnes question one needs to have an understanding of what some have called “the cosmic coincidences†or “the anthropic principle.†This concept will be briefly discussed in what follows, but at this point it will suffice to say that if the basic laws of physics were slightly different life could not exist. Darwin’s natural selection might be capable of explaining intensely complex structures, but it cannot provide an answer for why the perfect conditions for it (natural selection) exist. Hoover explains it this way, “Proving that watches came from a completely automated factory with no human i